The Ultimate Vampire Resource and Directory

1001 Sires To Go

Vampire Rave is the largest Vampire Database ever compiled by one man. That man is our Prince - Cancer. He is also the one responsible for creating this online Vampire community. The Houses, Contests, Profiles, Portfolios and all the extras that we as a community come here, on VR, to enjoy.

There is a built in rating system on Vampire Rave.
That rating covers; Profiles, Portfolios, Member Articles and Most of The Vampire Database. These are the things that we as members add to the Vampire Rave site. Our community. The ratings, as most here already know, add to our status levels. The more we rate, the more pages we view, the more time we spend, the more higher our own rating; the more we get. Or do we?

Just recently, one of the Master Vampires of VR did a little experiment of his own. The results were not very surpizing. But they did prove a point; many people seem to be more concern about rating, than reading what they rate.

One of the main reasons for making a profile is to introduce yourself to the community. One of the main reasons of reading a profile is to learn who is about to enter the community. And yes, welcome them. But it is about the community, not about yourself. Cancer may have started the concept and put everything into motion but, I believe, it is up to us to make it work - not Cancer.

And lets face it, what the Hell are we all going to do with 5000 plus Sires in a year anyway? Lets leave the rat race outside and not in Vampire Rave. How about slowing it down a little and actually meeting ourselves?

The community is here. Use it or loose it.

Please feel free to comment.

That has to be the single most insightful statement anyone has made on here in a very long time. Daire's experiment was brilliant, and it helped to prove an important point. We (myself included) get way too caught up in ratings and status levels.

That said, I am only trying to level up to test for acolyte. I want to help people.

a very valid and interesting point to be proven but i will add something in as well-

its hard to meet people and get to know who is in our community if so many people do not do what a profile is intended for.
so many take it too lightly and even more use it as a dating system...if more people were to actually put together a profile..i believe more people would take the time to actually read and get to know the people on this site

Then perhaps we should take the time to instruct them or teach them; instead of rating them. We are immortals, we have the time. :)

Always remember: the more you put into something, the more you will get out of it.
Including, VR.

I agree billy, I only rate those I know and the vampire database...

my status is of no importance to me...

OK I agree with you on this one. I was one of those test rats of Daires. I can admit it I failed. Most of the time I read what is on the profiles. Then I rate accordingly. I have learned not to just hand out 10's. This has opened my eyes to my own damned habits.~NFA

Why use "NFA" ?
Your opion does count.
That's the point that will be expressed be me and others. Its a community.
Lets get together and get with the program!

i agree 100% i got on here to meet people like me not get ratings truly i could care less if i'm a 0 or a ten

I do agree with the point here. And I have talked with a number of great people here on the site. I do think that it is kida funny that so far the lowest level from a person posting on this is 17 and all the others are in the 20's. I do agree, just think it's kinda funny. I think people on the site get used to wanting to raise levels from the start to have more access on the site..like posting here!

I totally agree with you.
VR is a wonderful place.
Granted, I am not one of the most liked ones here, I am trying.
My profile is built for people to get to know me. While I am open to freinds, no one seems to want to build any relationship with me as far as friends or networks.
Being a Sire is a long way off for me, but I think that, if we have a lot of sires, and a lot of covens, that it could get pretty confusing and tricky.
It would require a more complicated system that what is already in place.
Perhaps.. once we get about 50-70 sires, Cancer should take off that level for others just below it, divide everyone up into groups, and as those sires leave the site, or retire from the site, new sires can replace them.
Just as someday our master vampires will leave, and get replaced.
Just as in each houe and coven, a member of hte house leave,s they are replaced.
We must keep the cycle going.

I don't pretend not to like to advance, but at same time I agree with what you say billy. I am an avid chatter, when i am not rating

i have been takin my time for awile, i relized this a long time ago, i have been on here longer than most people even the one who wrote this thread, Sir Billy (no disrespect), im not to into the race to get to sire first, i read all the profiles i rate, an all the threads i post in i read. iv been around for to long to start rushin now

I've only been here for a few days, but everyone who I have rated, I have read their profile. I have left comments about things that are in their profile. Or I have gone into their portfolio and actually looked at the pictures and artwork they have up before making a comment. I try to make each comment unique, and not just a generic "Hi, here's a [insert number here] rating for you."

I actually am interested in meeting new people to talk to and get to know them. I'm not here to try to use the place as a dating service, I have a wonderful man in my life, whom I adore completely.

Read a person's profile and see what kind of stuff is in it, before rating and actually taking the time to message them.

Billy you supplied a very good subject for argumentation, as it's everyones knowledge I am one who achived sirehood, consquently partly due to avidly rating profiles, looking back nowdays I question how much time I must have spent rating people who actually
I haven't gone in more depth in getting to know them. Not that I am sorry as I maintained a sort of a way in reviewing other then blindly rating but basically nowdays I grew tired trying to rate en masse & rate only rate those which catch my attention, this has resulted me in falling back badly in rating percentage but somehow this isn't of much concern, to which here came this realisation even if had to cost me my level.

On the other hand if you examine the System Status you'd see '10% is based upon the Things you have Rated', surely the Prince had such consideration in mind when designing his equation in levelling.

People will always be people.

They want to be the highest in everything with all costs.

I admit I do not read 100% of every profile I go to rate. I am sorry there are just some that I can't force myself to finish reading, but those I do rate accordingly. But I do attempt to read all the profiles I rate. While I have been concentrating on rating I am not doing it lightly. I too have focused on the database, it is much easier to rate something you just have to decide how much you like it, rather then how well someone has expressed themselves. But I do do both.

I always rate a profile on what the profile teaches or shows me of the person who creates it....I will rate a new profile when I see it but usualy about a 6 or 7 and try to inspire them to work on the profile...Letting them know i will go abck and check them out later, after they have added more.

After all no one wants to join a community where they are ignored for being new.

Although I do agree with the fact that you should not rate just for the sake of it...I would like to think that I am being rated for the effort I have put into my place on this database.

Ever tried to explain someone why you gave them a low rating? Last time i did i got abused and got re-rated from a 10 to a 6 and in my portfolio from a 10 to a 4 with a nasty comment lol.

I'm more then willing to help people with their profiles and I offer help to the members in my coven, cause I enjoy to see if they enjoy their profile too and learn themself how to code and improve it. I dont mind sharing what I know and learn myself more about it.

But i will step back from ever trying again to give someone a constructiv critic why i rated their profile lower. Unless I know the person since a while and i got asked for help.

For me reaching the next level is like a game and i just enjoy it when i hopped one level higher, but beside that, im still me, the same person who likes to help and listen and to ask uncomfortable questions ;)

Billy, every time I have read one of your threads they are well thought out, insightful and on point. I could give a $#$% about ratings; I am my own crazy person profile wise, and either people will get that or not...who cares? The people who "get me" are the people I want to meet...just like any place...internet or not. As such, I do the same; I really do read profiles. I really do rate according to what efforts people make; (this is "camp") "I'm just keepin' it real y'all." That all being said, I really like it when the "quiet" ones come out with something to say; good thread Billy.

lol Kat! So true!

Well I think if you cannot give a profile a good rating you should take time to get to know the person behind the profile. Many times they really dont care about improving the pro, because they are not interested in a rating.Hey you have to admit we have a lot of opinionated people here.If you want to rate low tell them why.I met quite a few that simply want to meet and greet and arent into the profile thing. Yes I think someone who has a empty profile should at least put SOMETHING in it. The ones who take time to put in effort to beautifying their profile and adding a personal touch should be rewarded. So I tend not to rate a empty pro , rather I go in and say hello. Because I think giving it a low rate is not saying something nice either.It's like slapping someone in the face and then saying " Hi! How did you like that? Wanna be my friend?" rude, rude, It is like judging a book by its cover dont you think? I dont rate as much as I should for that reason alone.People are sensitive about their ratings,... lol. I am glad the vampire database can be rated , I go there to get my ratings up to par. And YES I care about my profile on a personal level. I like to show team effort in participating to make this a great site people will want to come back to and are attracted to. I know people will probably both dissagree and agree , but its just my opinion and I am sticking to it.

oh one more thing about the sires Billy, too many cooks spoil the broth. Is all I have to say.

Very, very insightful-- and I've felt this way since I've started.

Every time I change my picture, I get the same slew of messages, though people do not see that I've been here a good, long time compared to many here. I'm -very- established here, I think, as many of us are.

See I am sorta of a mean rater, I think if you have a profile, you should make it like you. Too many quizes, not enough information, no pics to give us a thought. that why I don't like giving 10 unless I believe the person took the time to make a profile to draw you to it. That how you make great friend i think. If you got a profile that sings.

a lot of nice responces here to a top thread ^_^ to all

i have been in disputes at times as to weather i read or just rate.

while online it may be a mix of chat read contest or rate.

at other times it is just rate rate rate this becouse sometimes i wish to just read so i remain not loged in(avioding chats messages ect) then i will log in and go about rateing what i have read.

to some stalkers out there it may and does look like i log on and rate without reading.

i now dont even try to explain why at times my stamp may be everywhere.
i know ive been honest.
hugs 2 all

I always read at least a big portion of each profile I rate...

My problem is that SO many people have rated my profile a 4 r a 5 because its "too long".

I rest my case.

yeah I read the profiles I rate...usually will leave a somewhat long comment to the ones I really like. I do it at my own pace and don't get on with the rates so much I mean I love the vampire database! I love to see the book reviews and the clothes!!!! also the member articles are great ..in that sense I try to balance out a day of profiles/a day of articles etc. a day of hangman...lol
however I do have a goal in terms of level/although I am still far from it and am too busy to just go for it.
I think we have enough people who do their own thing and do respectfully read..so not all are in it for just a click and rating or status alone.

I'm trying, myself, to get to the level to be inducted into a house or coven. Once I'm there, I'll be happy and won't pay attention to my level anymore.

But, then again, I kinda like being a "shadow", lol.

oh and echo* i rated yours just a few days ago and you visited mine and I thought yours was fine...I mean if a pro is long but I enjoy it /I just revisit...because it was good stuff but I just may not have the long time to read...
so you can revisit.

Nicely argued thread, but only part of the problem has been addressed.

You see, the overall advancement in level is STILL based upon ratings. And when you look at your "scores" you readily see that it is QUANTITY and not QUALITY that counts. Because there ARE so many people here there is no mechanism in place to gauge or measure quality, creativity, etc.

I have seen simply AMAZING posts here for instance, but, an amazing post is worth no more levelwise than "yeah, I agree".

I READ everything I rate. I stamp a lot because a LOT of what I see is quizzes and lack of any REAL insight to the person. For those profiles that stand out to me, I will either message the person, or I WILL comment.

In fact I take so much time reading and looking closely at each art piece that I could be three levels higher based on time. But I will not do that.

All of that said, I think that if you REALLY want to have an honest rating system, then do away with the "See Who Has Rated You" option. But, even if you do THAT, lower "levels" face another daunting decision: do they DARE rate a level 21 or above HONESTLY?

*Smiles* I have offered suggestions on how to make the Community here more intimate. I have not received even the courtesy of a mind your own business. Those are the rules here and so I shall abide by them. But the rating and levelling systems are quite flawed for the reasons stated above plus others.

So, am I the ONLY one who feels the levelling system and especially the rating to level scheme is flawed? Statistically of coourse I am NOT alone. However, let us see if anyone has the courage to speak up.

Yes, Cancer HAS done a great job. And so have the "master vampires". So this is no attack on him or them. But there is no perfect system anywhere and never shall there be. But at the same time, systems must continue to evolve; they must continue to adapt.

One cannot simply dismiss competition, greed, pride, fear, and a whole host of other aspects of the sentient condition. And when a level 11 meets the profile of a level 26, is that 10 that the lower level gave REALLY an honest rating?

*Smiles* We have a society based upon CLASS here in VR. Like it or not, it IS the truth. So having this societal structure we must ask how can we be fair to one another via rating?

I think I have said enough on that..

As for the experiment, I believe it was a good idea, but it was flawed because there was no control group. You see, it didn't and couldn't measure those who visited the faux site and did NOT rate it. I did NOT rate it because I READ it as I read other profiles.

To quantify properly the results of such an experiment, one must needs have a control group AND a robust way to keep count of the numbers. So Daire, nice idea, but I would be curious to see the results over a longer period of time, the numbers broken down by perhaps the following categories:

Number who rated
Number who did NOT rate
Mean, Median, and Mode of level of those who visited
Percentage of Premium Members versus Regular Members
Affiliated Members versus Unaffiliated.

etc. etc.

Just like in University.

Be well!

VladVoivode

And so this gives me MORE reason to work on to go to Sire. It's not a race however, but, hey, it's great to get to the finishing line. ;)

When I first arrived here on VR, I did nothing to my profile, I had one line and thats it. I got some mid range rating, and even some "10"'s. the tens came from those who got to know me. Later I add some things about me, I got some re rates in the high 8's and 9's and more 10.
I have done a bit more to it now, and I am quite happy with it. I get a lot of 9s and 10s, but the thing that disturbs me is the comments. they all want to see my picture. Why, some even say when I post a pic they will rate me higher.

I HATE having my picture taken, so I do not have one on my profile. Why should this be such an issue. I rate for content, if there is a pic I rate it, but I don't ask for them. To me that seems rude.
The closest thing to a pic request I ever did was ask to see more of a persons ink (tattoo artist so I like the artwork).
So whats the deal. any comments...

It looks like it is most important to raise your rankings while you are in a House to further that House in the climb for top spot...rating of others and having others rate you high becomes very important...I rate from the newest members to the eldest...newbies don't usually have much on their pros...so I scan and rate neutrally...if I see that profile again and it's peaked my interest I will rerate it...

and about the 1001 Sires...yes...we may have that many...the community is growing...or we may not...some people may simply lose interest after a time...it is not a given.

and about having a picture of oneself in the profile...I personally don't...for my reasons...and I have had others say pretty much the same thing...add a pic and I'll rate you higher...I like when others do it...I will rate higher if I like the pix but there are also some pros with no personal pix that are as interesting to generate a high rate based on the content in the pro...to sum it up...personal pix will get you higher ratings.

I want to add to the theory of improperly skewed rating scores.

When I was back at level 8, I had noticed that I had lost points. I had asked why and I was told it was because newbies had joined thus lowering my percentage of things rated. Well I accepted it and rated all the whelps and the deth iz kewl people to at least MAINTAIN the level of WORK I had completed.

But then it hit me. The ratings system is mathematically tricked. What that means is the ratings system is in the house's (VR's) favour - pardon the Casino talk.

I will use a Baseball analogy. a typical season is 162 games. Within that space of games I am quanitified by what I have DONE. At game 35 lets say I have a .275 batting average, 10 doubles, a triple, and 3 home runs. Now let us focus in on ONE statistic: BATTING AVERAGE.

Batting Average is defined as number of hits divided by at bats. So, .275 says that I have hit safely 27% of the time compared to my total at bats to that point! It does not - AND statisticallt CANNOT - measure what still lies ahead.

Now lets say that that the Major Leagues have decided to add 10 more games to the schedule thus raising the season to 172 games. My batting average DOES NOT CHANGE.

Same as here. However, since newbs join all the time, the equation is skewed such that they are added - like games - BUT, now the work or percentage I have done - the hits I have made have dwindled! It is a statistical slippery slope.

Overall things to be rated constantly climbs so unless you ARE a HIGH level, you MUST play the ratings game to attain any level. In fact, privilege IS based U P O N L E V E L.

So on one hand incentive is offered based upon level, then we are excoriated for rating!!

This is a system based upon the worst of feudalism. You HAVE to reach a certain level to be "inducted" into a House or Coven, but then if you are traded or "bought" you LOOSE your modifier of your House leader's mark!! I have seen friends drop a WHOLE level!!

The ratings system and levelling AS IT STANDS is faulty and statistically tricked.

VladVoivode

The rating system in an inherent part of this community. With 5,000+ members you are not going to be able to "make" everyone stop and say "wow, you're right". Everyone rates how and why they want to; as I have stated in another thread rating is subjective, it's personal and frankly I know a lot of people don't read my profile. Does that bother me? No.

You are not going to be able to get to know members here simply by rating their profiles. I have come across profiles where members are suspended until infinity or they haven't logged in for over 6 months. Yet those profiles are still there, needing to be rated.

If you want to meet people, send messages, talk in the Shout Box and answer forums posts. Profile ratings are not going to do it.

VladVoivode,

You are quite wrong in your analysis. You are attempting to solve an equation when you don't know what the equation is.

*You* put forth an equation and offered alternative solutions in contrast to how I have designed the site. However, your analysis in no way takes into account my motives or goals when designing Vampire Rave.

There are not many people here who can accurately answer questions about the status or rating systems at Vampire Rave. You are not privy to the underlying motivations and resulting site design. You can speculate all you want, but it's only speculation.

And I am not about to put forth my motives either. It's the Status System that makes Vampire Rave entirely unique when compared to other sites.

I think certain people do get binded get the levels, more so now because of the Coven oppourtunity.

So I admit that I am not aware of the experiment that the VR member who was spoken of performed, but I think I got the jist of it. I just hope that this community of ours doesn't turn into VF, with ppl getting caught up in ratings and stuff. Granted, I like to see *original* comments in my profile and portfolio, but that's comments. I could care less if I actually get rated. I just think we all need to sit back and think about why this community was started by our Prince in the first place.

i do not agree on the largest database, please check your info, that is being a person who is totally adicted to VR more than anything else.

moreover the point is not here but rather of getting to know each other, you are right but sometimes it is nicer to have questions to ask people to start of a friendship cause when all the questions are answered it will be a wee bit difficult to get to know a person then the other would freak out when you start talking to them, knowing they know alot about you

if you get my message...but reading about the person who are rating and getting to know is also something nice, but the idea is more to get to know friends more than just rating as you previously said......

all the best and good luck to you alll

I have a very specific criteria upon which I rate a profile. There have been a few where I've missed important details, not because I didn't take the time to read but because half the time I'm here, I'm exhausted from work and lack of sleep. As of late, I've bneen seeing a lot of profiles that warrant low ratings and their lack of content allows the opportunity to spend all of 30 seconds rating them. I do agree with you on keeping the integrity of the site and I try to do my best to do my part.

Nightman, what do you mean you disagree with the "largest database"? First of all, read line two of the Home page of this site...yes it is the primary goal and function of this site to host the largest online database of vampire information. Second, Billy...the guy who started the thread...said VR is the largest vampire database ever collected/put together by one man. ONE MAN! The Prince of this site, Cancer. If you can prove anything to the contrary I suggest you do it. Cancer established and maintains this site single-handedly. He ALLOWS free memberships to an ungrateful and spoiled general population, and he allows an AMAZING amount of liberty in what is, in fact, a vampire hierarchy. I, for one, am sick and phucking tired of hearing people bitch before they lift a damn finger to contribute.

Let's put VR into a classical philosophical scenario...the "state of nature"; if the members on this site who do nothing but go back and forth whining and complaining about this and that existed in a community at the beginning of time...somebody would bash their heads in to shut their useless uncontributing mouths. True story. Think about it.

I need to post an addendum; I meant no disrespect to the Master Vampires, who I know do an awful lot of work to maintain the flow of this site. I meant...ok if you are reading this y'all know what I meant. *smiles

In response to Cancer.
He's right. No one can truely fathom the status system.
Ive jumped from 20% to 70% of a level for no apparent reason.
I am lacking in my ratings, but I have high everything else.
As a result, im stuck where I am at.


Cancer has put forth this site, this system, and put us in here, to learn, to grow, and to contribute to his cause.

There is no reason to question him.
I amuse myself with thoughts on how amused he must be, watching some of us try to finish early, and I imagine how proud he must be, that the house system has flourished so well, and that Sires are taking it upon themselves to become leaders, selecting thier members carefully and devoting thier coven to a unique cause all in its self.

I want to thank cancer, and I encourage you all to look at this man, the Master Vampires, The Sires, and everyone else that makes up this site, and thank them.

Every single one of us contributes in some way, be it positivly, negativly, with articles, with art, with poetry, with musings, with peace, and with love.

We are all here.

Thank you, cancer.

I actually read everything That is why my level is so low and my posts so few and yes sometimes lame if you took the time to get to know me you'd know why and I'm not about to broadcast it.

I don't care about my rating i;m just here to met people i have found a good big brother Raziel and everyone i have met on here is wonderful.

I agree aswell I have no intention of forming a coven or anything I I just wish to fully interact with those i choose to maybe get to level 5 and join a house but even when i was working to get past whelp so i could post ( wich was a pain btw) I only rated stuff I had something to say about and did not just spam rate things

I would willingly rate a lelvel 21 the same as a level 7 if the level 7 had a profile that deserved the same rate...

If a profile interests me it gets a high rate...If not it gets a low rate...Simple as....If people want to rate me according to how I rated them, then I am sorry keep you rate i dont need or want it...I want to be rated upon what I have done and what you think of what I have added...If you dont like it then rate me accordingly and maybe leave a comment on hwy you did this...

If you do like my profile then rate me accordingly....Also let me know what you liked and if you have any ideas on how to improve let me know. If i like your idea i will give it some thought.

If i dont agree with what you have to say, I will still value your oppinion, i just wont take into consideration what you ahve said...I will respond to you though, more than likely thanking you for you comment.

I have no problem with constructive criticism, I value it as I can learn from it.

This is a tongue in cheek reply to thsi thread. Billy i love you to bits i always admire your steadfast approach so please dont think im having a go at you personaly.


Hi Im Sky and im a VR addict.
I do everything possible to level up.
I Stamp profiles and rate to my own system,unless something grabs my eye or my imagination and then i will comment in a unique manner becausei have decided that person is worth my effort to get to know.
I stamp because.. guess what i paid for the privelidge and there is no rule saying i have to read every profile or get to know each individual member here.
I shamelessly advirtise in the mascara box so people will stalk me add me and bite my derriere. I do this because i really want to see my name up there in the top three somewhere. Im competitive so sue me.
I have shamelessy made a thread about mayonaise to entertain the masses.

But then i have contributed to the forum also i hope by starting threads off, both serious and ones full of humour. Ive done an article. I do what i can for my House. Im not an acoylte but i get messaged a lot from people wanting advise or help. I do what i can. I contribute. Is it appreciated? I neither know nor care. Im here because i want to be not because someone has a gun at my head.

Yes im Sky and im a VR addict. Please dont judge me.

*Hands Sky a pamphlet for V.R. Anonymous*

Grins
Think i need some cold turkey..? Or is that do i need ot go Cold Turkey..? And do i get some VR stuffing with it?

stuffing costs extra but it can be provided...All major credit cards accepted at the desk

No Pay pal? good lord what sort of therapy group is it...

Pay pal only comes into play if you want to be a premium member ;)

Ahh see how deep my addiction goes..i already am...;winks:

true, but like every where, the more you want somethink, when you coem to get it, you dont want it as bad as you first did

Impressive responses all holds some truth. In the end only cancer rules ! lol. Anyway it's a great place to haunt luv the people here:)

Stabb I find your words a bit harsh albeit true...Like any other community not everyone wants to spend time searching into things that it provides...

I do confess to leaving a rating on things that I have discovered here but not yet studied, but that is my perogative. I commented and rated the subject in question on how it merited to me of interest, and how much the article had interested me into discovering i wanted to learn more or could not be interested in learning more respectively.

The fact that someone chose to include the information here thus informing me of its pressence in the world in my judgement merited me rating it...

Much as would reading yours and anyone else Profile merit me in rating it as I saw fit on how it interested me as a person.

Call it how you will, but everything I rate in this place or any other forum or database I am involved in is called strictly upon how the information provided affected me as I read through it

mearhinas,

Would you then rate a book or song low, based solely on the title and / or extract and whether it held an interest for you or not?

Yes I would why would i praise a book that I read and did not like....

To praise it would be to tell the people i like it was a fantastic book and go out and buy it...To do this I am not being true to myself....

Would you reccomend a builder who did a bad job on your home to your friends just because you knew the builder....I think not.

If I enjoy a book i say i enjoy it....If i dont like a book I will say i dont like it.

Same as anything else in life.

I have earned the right to do so and so I shall

I feel that you have misunderstood.

I mean that would you also rate low something which you had only a sample of, based on that sample and it's title only?

Cancer,

I never asked you to put forth your reasons or arcana concerning ratings. I shall assume I misread the subtext implying that I DO or WOULD want them. It's your ballgame and I am but a player. My math is STILL right based on the known facts. Your math is STILL right based on YOUR equations and variables unknown to me. So really there is no argument.

Speculation is healthy as you well know. When intellectual inquiry ends or is quashed The sheep take up the jackboots and march. I would say that from what I have seen thus far that there is no imminent danger of a new Nuremberg rally.

You have done a great job here. It is NEVER easy to aggregate such a huge body of information while maintaining a stable Community among legions of disparate epistemologies. The fact that I CAN - at least so far - voice my concerns is what has earned you MY respect. The earlier poster who said that Cancer's system cannot be fathomed misunderstood my post. If I thought we WERE being deceived I would not be here. I have met some intelligent people here and I treasure them all. I have seen some anti-intellectual criminals as well. I do not think on them until another comes along to remind me of their existence.

VR has been a great experience and has been a wonderful opportunity to explore ideas and have (usually) intelligent and informed discourse in the various fora.

I am certain it shall continue.

VladVoivode

I like to rate things, and to respond to forum posts. Yes, partially to advance my level. But also to get my name out there on this site. I came here to meet people, and to have a place to post my poetry. And so I seek people out that interest me, and I do my best to interest others. But, most of my time here is spent chatting. Or playing favor contests =D. Let's welcome the whelps and let them know that profiles are better to read when they say more than "I like biting. Umm, I don't know what to say. Fuck off."

Ahhh your too sweet lostinlife, thanks much dear

but when i am rating people i don't always read all the way through, like i hate quizzes, but if it is something about them i read it, and sometimes when i'm bored when i am on at wee hours of the morning till daylight comes none of my friends are on so i just go through and rate profiles for something to do and see all the newcomers, i really don't care of my status, but sometimes i am shy to give premium members a bad rating even if they deserve it because then i get hate mail

Well, I'm a newcomer to this site and am rapidly becoming one of the addicted... still learning about the status system and ratings.....not to mention profile vs. portfolio and what is best to put on either one and then the journal! but I am learning....and since I am a 'newbie' still somewhat moldable and can be taught new tricks.

My profile is added to a little every couple of days, even updated it earlier this evening and I appreciate all the creative criticism I receive, it only makes to help make my profile all the better. I don't want people to just stamp and rate for the heck of it, but to read what I've got to say and actually help me make it better... isn't that what it is all about?

Still not sure of stalking and biting, and would love to be part of a coven and/or house....all in good time/even though I'm not the most patient of beings.

p.s. I do actually read what people on their profiles have to say, and try to rate accordingly to how I feel about it...like I've said, as I grow and progress here, and the more I get to know people, I'll be able to see things in a more established vein.

Hehe much love to you to Raziel...and yeah your right I hate it when someoen gives me a 4 or 5 though and doesn't tell me why or says oh it is because I didn't like your background or music those are little things that have no impact on me and my profile or the information in it so that is when the status thing gets to me...so many peopl are s o concerned about themselves they just say oh i like this...10 I don't think they are pretty...5 it is ignorant and having to go to a profile just too look ta quizzes is extremely ignorant too.

Heh I guess I am guilty >.> - slaps own wrist- I will try to do that =D

No then I would rate it on how much importance it has to me....For example..If the subject is something I am interested in I would rate it highly.

Examples of this:

Vampiric Lore, Supernatural Lore.
King Arthur {Mythical and Real}

Stuff that hold little or no importance to me I would rate low.

Examples of this:

Racism
Nazi's
Religion

Since these subjects abhor me then I am more than likely to rate them low.

However if I was to read an article on any of the stuff I like and disagreed with them after rating them on my preference to the subject then I would ammend my rating of them accordingly and give my reason on doing so. As with a subject i have rated low for the same reasons.

Which brings to to this point....If someone makes public something that i like and I read it then I will say so.

If someone makes public something i dont agree with I will likewise say so.

If this offends I appologise but if you did not want to know my thoughts on something then dont place it in a domain that I am likely to see it.

If I say or write something that someone finds distasteful and that person tell me that they are offended, its all good. If i didnt want people to tell me what they think of my oppinions on a subject I keep it to myself.

Once you speak what you think it is out the to be agreed with or to be questioned.

If you dont want either of these responces talk about something else.

I think People should read the profiles to be rated. That's how you get to know people. I thought that was one of the purposes of VR.

I have A.D.D. I take my riddlen and read the profiles somtimes. this is the coolest dating site ever... rock on cancer

dating site? apparently I was under a misimpression about THAT.

There isn't a widely abused part of the system in my experience. I find that in general most people find that they are able to "coexist" for lack of a better word.

Too be honest however, why go through all the trouble to even rate, give constructive criticism when some members will simply follow suit and change their member name to erase their low ratings and completely negate the purpose?

Just frustrated I suppose, there are reasons I would guess to change such a thing, however it seems to work in the favor of most to do it for ratings.

As for the Sires....I don't see a huge influx of Covens going on, and I'm sure that Cancer has regulations in place to prevent forseeable pitfalls.

Rating is such a small portion of your overall score, it doesn't make a huge difference in the long run. If you look at the user levels (it's in the menu bar to the left), you'll notice a nearly perfect pareto of levels.

It's slightly weighted to Sire, because there is a glass ceiling at level 28 - you have to be physically promoted to L29 and there's only one L30 out there.

So here's what my excel spreadsheet calculates:

Whelp 3800 51.22%
Mosquito 551 7.43%
Shadow 400 5.39%
Marplot 256 3.45%
Caitiff 491 6.62%
Ghoul 436 5.88%
Spook 258 3.48%
Phantom 191 2.57%
Shade 158 2.13%
Fiend 146 1.97%
Unclean Spirit 144 1.94%
Specter 89 1.20%
Wraith 79 1.06%
Bloodsucker 68 0.92%
Vampling 58 0.78%
Vampire 49 0.66%
Savage 34 0.46%
Shaitan 31 0.42%
Blood Drinker 29 0.39%
Changeling 28 0.38%
Viper 22 0.30%
Firebrand 17 0.23%
Savant 16 0.22%
Incendiary 12 0.16%
Destroyer 10 0.13%
Iconoclast 11 0.15%
Necromancer 6 0.08%
Sire 21 0.28%
Master Vampire 7 0.09%
The Prince 1 0.01%

So "sires" make up only a little more than one quarter of one percent of the total population of VR - doesn't seem out of line, and doesn't seem to be growing at an undue rate.

Just my 2 cents...

Stormwind.. That puts it into an interesting perspective with the percentages. I've seen the numbers but it never really clicked in like that. Nice job.

I belive that Cancer, the Admin and Members have made this site what it is.

But I also fear that perhaps we have gone off track as to what this site was meant for.

Too many people come on, dont stay long, so they stay on the site at level 3-10 or whatever.
They originally come on to sell thier bodies and feed into their own egotistical needs.

Theres been too much being added to the Houses and Covens, too many wanting Covens of thier own.

Even a few (I will not name names0 who wish to create a coven and best everyone.
Some are so full of themselves, they want to win at all costs.
Everyone loves them because they see them as someone who is participating, when really, they are out for thier own motives, and only trying to better themselves, not the site.

I admit, I have gone this path several times, but what I see now, is a site that needs to be pushed back onto the track.

Keep all the decorated trains, but please, keep the path the same!

Lets keep adding to the database, lets keep adding links.
Lets keep learning about ourselves, about each other, and lets keep loving, and keep getting to know one another!

That is what I think this site is about!

well I rarely drop my .02$ on topics like this one....but I will now...
the ratings system does seem skewed..whether or not it is...is for cancer to know...but the conjecture is pointless..
if it is..then he knows and has reasons....if it isn't....it's an entirely moot point
people freak out about being rated less than 10's....but what you are rated affects NOTHING but the top list... NOTHING....what affects your level is how many ratings you have given out....
and how many database entries you have rated....
that sort of thing....
I could care less what my rating is....as long as i am past the point of restrictions....which I passed even before they were added....so i'm not concerned....
I appreciate the work Cancer has put in..and the work the masters have put in....and most times the work the dominars put in...the database is growing...the profile numbers are growing...and the average intelect hasn't dropped too low yet...as is known to happen with mass numbers of people....so I am basically a happy person here...

I always try to read what people have written if I have the time - It's good courtesy to actually give people's work time if they've put the effort into it.

The reality is that very few will reach the status of "Sire", as very few have the patience or interest that is needed to do so.

Fangor said it all.

All we can do is sit back and let time take it's course. There is no way we can change people from who they are, they will rate as they want and comment as they please. If it makes one happy to speed through the ratings without reading the content of the profile, then so be it that is that one’s nature. We can’t assume that everyone is going to have the same intentions with the processes of this site. That is why communities like VR work so well, because of it’s diversity. If you take away it’s diverse nature, you will have a pretty dull outcome. So I say let it be and leave it alone, the wave will reach the shore on it’s own.

I wish people would stop bickering about what is wrong with this site or stuff and just enjoy what we been offered.

This post closes tonight.

If you wish to say anything more on the topic say it now, for I do not.

The stew has been stired;
lets now enjoy it!

A couple of things...

VR deletes inactive accounts far more aggressively than any other community site that I am aware of. To date there have been over 75,000 signups... Less than 10% of that number is reflected in the membership.

This means, that when you look at the membership total of VR, you are looking at a very accurate representation of *active* members.

I also cut a lot of waste by dropping the dead weight. There was a lot of opposition when I started deleting members. People wanted to see those 100,000+ profile numbers. Knowing that many of those profiles would be created by people that would never come back... What would be the point?

For a profile to become 'permanent', it needs to reach at least level 5. At this point, VR is either in your blood or it isn't. Yes, there may be a few inactive level 5+ profiles... But overall, these total a very small percentage.. And even a good deal of these people stop in every few months to see what is going on...

Most level 5+ members that leave VR self-delete their account first.

Regarding the 'unusual' nature of the rating portion of your Status....

Yes, it is open-ended. No, this wasn't a mistake. Your rating score (portion of Status) is *not* like a batting average. It's not meant to reflect past activity. It's meant to reflect past and current activity... Something that it does quite well. As profiles are aggressively deleted each night, so are all the ratings associated with deleted accounts. This is why those of you who are rating whelps are *constantly* rating...

It's also only 10% of your total score.. Less if you have marks(s) or referral bonus. A person could theoretically reach Sire with zero ratings if they maxed every other category out, had mark of the Prince, and a maximum referral bonus.

I would be surprised if the total number of Sire's, in relation to the overall membership, ever crossed 5%... Even with the glass ceiling. I think 2-3% is probably a more accurate number. The current Sire total is skewed. 3 of them are permanently suspended, and there's a few others that are hardly ever here.

I stumbled by VR by accident and found a liking for it. we do not have these kinds of communities in Denmark.

About the rating, I like to rate the profiles I view, because when someone has done a good job, they deserve the acknowledge ( to know that they have done a good job )

I do not know if I am concerned about level or not. I just like to chat and be a part of a place that doesn't hold prejudges. sry my lousy spelling..

Oh come on please....Get a grip, we have been given the opportunity to be part of something that is not only informative and helpful but is fun as well....If you aint happy then why not leave.

Cancer has taken time and effort and more than likely a lot of expense to provide this service...Enjoy what the guy has provided

I think its a shame that you only come out of the woodwork on posts like these Cancer. It would be nice to see your opinions in other threads...Points you to a very good thread about Mayonaise and then runs away so she doesnt get her arse kicked..
No seriously it would be nice to see the man in question dropping in a few of the more interesting threads...

i guess my only question is why the big hurry to advance?

and may be i really shouldnt say much i just went on a rating spree recently, but i did keep it confined to portfolios and those portfolios that did have a lot of text in them i did read. but it gives a more visual statement and its quicker. it does take time to read profiles, but those people who took the time to put the work in the deserve to have them read.

Very good point.

When I came here I was looking for those with similar feeling, likes, dislikes..etc. I came here to learn, even if it is from one with a thimblefull.
But, I too have gotten caught up in the ratings race. But, I met a few people tonight that makes being here all worth while.
Thank you Cancer....

yes..the ratings race.....
I wonder what would happen if i went on a rating spree.....i'm pretty high up already here....but point in fact.....I might rate 10 new people a week on a good week....
my interest is in the forums searching for that elusive useful thread....in helping mod our household...and in conversing with the intelligent few I have found I like to call friend...

As someone new to VR, I can say that I knew nothing of the rating system when I joined. When I found out about it, however, I wanted to up my rank for a few reasons. First because I met someone I enjoyed talking to and with only ten messages, it's kinda hard to make a friendship. And second, because when I read some of the forums, I knew that my comments might be helpful to some members out there. Honestly I could care less if I was a mosquito or a sire. But with all the benefits, I did what was needed for me to enjoy VR. As for my profile, I would love to get some help making it more about ME, without all the stupid quizzes.

Cancer - you really see Sires getting into the 2-3% range??? That would be something like 200 Sires at the current membership level... Given the exponential nature of the levels I think that would take years...

As I have promised.
Thx.