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DarknessBound
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07:19:26 Jan 14 2005
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anyone here have information on Lilith? she is said to be the first ancient vampire. according to what i have found out she was the first wife of Adam (the husband of eve) but she refused to follo his orders and so was condemned...later killing all of Adam and Eve's offsprings. I've also read somewhere that she would kill newborns and mothers to be.....
anyone know of her? if so, please help me with some info =)
thanks




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HellChildDami
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07:26:12 Jan 14 2005
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Wow, that's a total new one on me, I've never heard about this...see I just learned about something new ;^} *winks knowingly*



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demonschild66669
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07:28:51 Jan 14 2005
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i must agree with hell, this is a very new subject to me. though i cant wait to read any of the info that you get on her, should be very interesting



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DarknessBound
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07:29:05 Jan 14 2005
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yeah, i didnt know about it either until recently that i came across it. ive been trying to find some more info but i can't. so i was wondering if someone knew something...



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DarknessBound
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07:34:14 Jan 14 2005
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omg i came across some info...look guys this is interesting stuff!

Lilith - First ever female vampire?
Background

According to various myths and legends, mainly Hebrew and Jewish, God created Adam and Lilith each from a seperate rib on his body. She is said to have a womans face, long black hair and wings on her back. Adam always wanted sex in the missionary position and Lilith wanted to be the one on top. Adam refused to allow Lillith to be on top even though Lilith stated that they were created as equals. This led to much bickering between them that one day after Lilith could take it no longer, she muttered God's name and flew away from the Garden of Eden.

Lilith inhabited the shores of the Red Sea which was populated by Demons as they're attracted to water. It was here that she had countless sex sessions with the demons and bore 180 children a night.

Three archangels were sent by God to bring her back to serve Adam's whim. Lilith refused and struck a deal with the archangels and told them that if the angelic amulet above the head of infants bears a resemblance to them or each of their names, (Senoy, Sansenoy, and Semangelof), she would not slain the baby infants. Boys younger than 8 days old and girls younger than 20 days old were Liliths main targets.

God was angered with her refusal to return and punished Lilith by making one hundred of her demon children perish on a nightly basis. God also spitefully turned Lilith against her own children for refusal to kill human infants that had the angelic amulet.

Because of this, Lilith is the one who kills young children which is why in ancient times many of the Jewish faith would place an amulet around their childs neck with the names of the three archangels and a saying which roughly translates into: Lilith begone.

To have enough children, she steals the sperm from sleeping men and is blamed for wet dreams along with SIDS (sudden infant death syndrome). (Courtesy of Dennaveve Kalanam).

Lilith is said to be the first immortal in history, or the mother of all demons, and she was also a seductress. Not only would she strangle baby infants (could've been cot death), she would seduce dreaming men would could in turn become her victim. Because of this, Lilith is sometimes referred to as a Succubus, a demon who seduces men into breeding with her, then killing them and drinking their blood. All this she would do at night.

In ancient Jewish religion, circumcision was performed on the baby infants to protect them from Lilith. Also to protect the newborn, parents were advised to draw a charcoal circle on the wall of the room, and write inside of it "Adam and Eve, barring Lilith." On the door they were supposed to write three names of the angels Senoy, Sansenoy, and Semangelof.

During the time she was living near the Red Sea in a cave she met up with Sammael (aka Lucifer/Satan) and went down to "hell" to marry him. They had a grand amount of perverted sex and she bore him a daughter (also named Lilith) which is why you see two images of Lilith in mythology. The older Lilith: the mother and the younger Lilith: the daughter. Being a free spirit Lilith left and her daughter took up the role of fornications with daddy in hell.

Also Lilith is represented as an owl many times in the bible and torah. (Courtesy of Dennaveve Kalanam).



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demonschild66669
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07:39:14 Jan 14 2005
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very very cool info. cant wait to learn more



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DarknessBound
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07:41:58 Jan 14 2005
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yeah, if anyone else knows about this...please psot...i wanna know =)



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DarknessBound
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07:42:33 Jan 14 2005
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*post


hehehe, im slightly dyslexic ? (shrug_)



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demonschild66669
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07:43:40 Jan 14 2005
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ah thats not a big deal. i think everyone has their moments of that



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Daermon
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11:07:42 Jan 14 2005
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http://www.webcom.com/~gnosis/lillith.html

http://www.lilitu.com/lilith/lil_alt-myth.html

http://abroere.xs4all.nl/pipermail/pnp/2000-June/000958.html

ok these are a few links to some of the lilith myths.....the most historical ones are found among hebrew writings......
have fun kids



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Emaerald
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14:42:47 Jan 14 2005
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Emmy *coffs* and looks in the direction of MV Dan, our resident and chief Lilith expert. He wrote a book about her Darkness :) It really is quite wonderful



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DarknessBound
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18:34:52 Jan 14 2005
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thank you Elder Daniel.

i will definitely look into it.



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LadyLilian
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18:01:32 Jan 15 2005
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D pointed this out to me, glad he did. What and who I think Lilith is; she is the artists Muse. She whispers into his/her ear and directs and guides their hands. She is a touch of every woman. She is the essential spirit of freedom, the first true feminist. She is Lust, Love in all it's light and dark forms, and Mother for all Demons.

She is Azrael's soul-mate, a witch, a vampire and a siren.

There's so much I could say about her.



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ElderDaniel
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18:16:41 Jan 16 2005
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Here's what I had written in the Gray Matters thread a while back...

First, again, I'd like to give Wikipedia a nod, because they actually happen to have so many articles about her, they have a Disambiguation page for her. This gives you a glimpse at just some of her influences.

The one who you are asking about is no doubt #1 on that list; the ancient demoness "conjectured" (I love that word) to be the first wife of Adam, hinted at in Genesis 1:27.

Darby Translation (1890): "And God created Man in his image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them."

It isn't until Gen 2:18 that it describes that Adam was alone and that Eve should be made for him. Of course, we know that the Bible is a collection of very old stories. We also know that not every story was the same, and a lot of interweaving of the stories was done.

This is the case with Genesis, among others. To appease all of the tribes, two versions of Genesis are combined. (This is seen again in the tale of Noah's flood, and more, but I digress.) But because of this discrepancy, we like to believe that it is Gen 1:27 that suggests Adam was not created alone. He was created with a woman who was not Eve. At some point, this woman must have left Adam alone. This woman was Lilith.

However, depending on your version of the Bible, she is only mentioned once, in Isaiah 34:14. And in modern versions, it isn't flattering.

Darby Translation (1890): "And there shall the beasts of the desert meet with the jackals, and the wild goat shall cry to his fellow; the lilith also shall settle there, and find for herself a place of rest."

The other more common translations have "the lilith" as "the night hag" or "the screech owl". But the word in Hebrew is li-li-th, "לילית". Interesting to note, in the Latin vulgate, the word is "lamia", one of the mythical forms of vampires.

The primary reference however for Lilith as Adam's first wife actually comes from a medieval text known as the The Alphabet of Ben Sira. That link there is the first time I've found the whole section complete. (I am still trying to find a copy of this in a book, if anyone has come across it.) The website it comes from is one of the most complete collections of stories of Lilith.

The Alphabet is a collection of stories detailing the life of Ben Sira, a Hebrew mystic, but leads us to believe he had quite a wild life. At any rate, near the end, he explains how Lilith flew away from Adam after he imposed his will upon her. When Adam whined to God about this, He sent three angels Snvi, Snsvi, and Smnglof to bring her back to Adam. They found her near the Red Sea getting it on with a few demons and having many cute baby demons, aka the Lilin/Lilim. Confronted by the angels, she refused to go back with them to Adam. When they could not change her mind the angels passed on God's judgment against her, that 100 of her children would die each day. In retaliation, she claimed she would cause human infants to become sick and die, however she would not harm those who bore an amulet with the name of those three angels upon it.

This is very close to a Mesopotamian myth, where a night demon named Lilitu killed children. It is believed the legend of this demon was adopted by the Hebrews, who protected children by placing amulets around their necks with the names of the three holy angels. This practice is still in place. Another legend you may not know; the act of singing a child to sleep in order to protect them from Lilith was once known as a Lilith-Bye to cast her out from the nursery. This song eventually became known as a lullaby.

Regarding how Lilith flew away from Adam, I've heard another tale, but this one I have not seen a source for. At any rate, apparently, Lilith was quite beautiful to behold. I'm sure Adam was quite the specimen of human males, but we're talking about Lilith. ;-) Any ways, some of the angels in heaven found her to be quite remarkable. They mused, "she is so beautiful she is almost angelic." On their own they decided the only thing missing were wings, so they blessed her with wings of her own.

No doubt this ended up being one of many reasons Adam was jealous of Lilith, but he still demanded to be her superior. Lilith was created from the same earth as Adam so she did not believe herself to be inferior. Some sources say they were made at the same time, others that she was made second. But remember, none of this is in the account of Genesis. The way it is written, it could go either way.

Quite possibly you are familiar with her because she is described quite well in White Wolf's original Vampire: The Masquerade, and given fine form in The Book of Nod and in Revelations of the Dark Mother. It is in WW's original story line, that Lilith is described as Adam's first wife, but she found solitude after leaving him. Eve was created to take her place (from his rib) and she bore Adam two sons, Cain and Abel. After Cain slew Abel, Adam cast him into the land of Nod, just as God had cast Adam and Eve out of Eden.

After wandering alone in the land of Nod, marked as a murderer, Lilith found him and sheltered him. It was Lilith here who shares her magical essence with Cain, making him the first vampire, Caine. He was the first to "create" vampires, known as the Second Generation.

Lilith makes a comeback in the first (and best IMHO) story line of "Gehenna" (WW's chronicle of the Final Nights) to kick everyone's ass. Actually the story idea is good, but is not very well fleshed out -- left up to the Storytellers of course.

And this is just the part of her being Adam's ex.



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DarknessBound
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18:21:17 Jan 16 2005
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wow



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Deity
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18:25:20 Jan 16 2005
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that is fascinating. Great work, Elder.
i'm impressed.



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^DarkMan
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19:06:59 Jan 16 2005
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ehehe Excellent Dan...
See i told you all that Dan was the "Lilith" expert around here... :P



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DarknessBound
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19:08:11 Jan 16 2005
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lol indeed. very knowledgeable



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^DarkMan
^DarkMan

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19:10:01 Jan 16 2005
Read 849 times

when it comes to "Lilith" yes he is very much indeed :P



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dellamore
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04:57:45 Jan 17 2005
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I'm not being a smart ass(so don't take affense)How do you memorize all this stuff! Hey I'd post it as a thread but It would be lame, Who is the chic that is queen of all prostitutes in the christian bible, I thought she was like the head sucubus? Is it lilith?



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ElderDaniel
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07:14:53 Jan 17 2005
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It's fair to say that most goddesses are mother goddesses and therefore connected to sexuality. While Lilith is certainly connected to sensuality/sexuality, she will always be part of the darker side of it. Not evil, but sex for the sake of pleasure, not procreation.

On the other hand, the goddess queen of prostitutes was most certainly Astarte/Astoreth/Ishtar. In Syria, among other biblical times and places, prostitution was seen as a viable religious activity in order to promote fertility.

"Religious prostitution flourished, for in Syria, as throughout western Asia, the fertility of the soil was symbolized in a Great Mother, or goddess, whose sexual commerce with her lover gave the hint to all the reproductive processes and energies of nature; and the sacrifice of virginity at the temples was not only an offering to Astarte, but a participation with her in that annual self-abandonment which, it was hoped, would offer an irresistible suggestion to the earth, and insure the increase of plants, animals, and men."

—- Will Durant
History of Civilization
Vol. 1, pg. 296.

Also, while Astarte was associated with the sun, and specifically the dawn of sunrise, Lilith was associated with the moon. This is a further depiction of Astarte as a light goddess and Lilith as a dark goddess for our ancestors.

As for who's specifically mentioned in the Bible as the queen of prostitutes, I'd have to look it up to be sure. Cancer may beat me to it. ;-)

Regarding how I remember this stuff. Well, Lilith has been my muse for more than a decade now. I've done quite a lot of research about her as a result. Someday, I will compile it all along with my poetry and stories. Until then, you'll just have to poke and prod for more.

D



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demonschild66669
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07:17:26 Jan 17 2005
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very, very cool info. you really know your stuff MV dan.



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Deity
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07:21:09 Jan 17 2005
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being well informed is amazing



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DarknessBound
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07:23:00 Jan 17 2005
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MV Dan, youre the CoOLeST! thank you for all the info...it has really cleared up some questions.


you r0k!



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demonschild66669
demonschild66669

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07:24:25 Jan 17 2005
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very, i might have to drain MV dan's brains so i can be so smart. *acts as if he is going to make his way towards dan and drain his mind of all his amazing intellagance*



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danzig1330
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07:28:09 Jan 17 2005
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Very interesting indeed. Thanks to Elder Dan for certain.



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DarknessBound
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07:28:56 Jan 17 2005
Read 817 times

lol demon

RUN DAN! RUN!!!!!!



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demonschild66669
demonschild66669

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07:32:37 Jan 17 2005
Read 813 times

hahahahahaha, no one can get away from me when i set my mind to something. *looks at dan and says* just be thankful that i havent set my mind to that yet.



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Daire
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12:34:36 Jan 17 2005
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ahem.....getting side tracked are we?



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DarknessBound
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17:43:10 Jan 17 2005
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LOL Daire.

*ahem*

well i have another question in hand,
i came across information of a vampire called Cain, some of those sources believe he was the first Vampire, this is puzzling...

info:

Caine
the First Man
born of Man.

Caine
who had slain
his brother and was
cast from humankind.

Caine
who was cursed
with eternal life
and with terrible lust
for Blood.

It is said that he wandered alone
in sorrow for many years. In time,
however, his loneliness consumed him
and he made others like himself.
His childer created childer,
and these childer created childer,
until there existed 13 vampiric Clans.
Each of these damned souls
bore the curse of Caine,
but for every generation
they were removed from the first one,
their strength was lessened.



o.0
somebody?



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vampirebrethren
vampirebrethren

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04:21:35 Jan 19 2005
Read 792 times

Demon, you are quite the flirt my brother, lol, well I have no input of my own towards Cain or Lilith, but I believe that everybody believes different things, some may believe Cain was the first, Or Lilith was the first, Or that Vlad Dracula was, but as most stories passed down through time all of them get distorted as they are passed on, but also I do not have my own opinions for I have not looked up any of this, but I must say ElderDan, you are quite smart, when it comes to Lilith and I commend you for your knowledge of all things, and the information in this Thread is quite useful to all those on VR and think everybody should check this one out



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MonKTanG
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05:11:09 Jan 19 2005
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Lilith, Cain, Its all a huge project im gonna start to study up on now. Thx to u all for piqueing my interest. I more "in to" vampyre culture and have learned sooo much now. LoL ^_^ thx again are there any more resorces i should be looking in to fer more Vampyre knowledge? I wanna learn all i kan possibly put in me skull ^_^



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vampirebrethren
vampirebrethren

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05:13:30 Jan 19 2005
Read 781 times

MonKTanG, just check out everything you can around this site and you shall learn alot to fill your head, and welcome to the rave



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demonschild66669
demonschild66669

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06:03:50 Jan 19 2005
Read 774 times

you know i am bro, and i always will be. as for the question, i must agree with vampirebrethren.



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vampirebrethren
vampirebrethren

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06:09:53 Jan 19 2005
Read 772 times

haha, thank you brother, I see you have caught me in my acts haha



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