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~I am sure that most of you have heard something about Bible Code.I am including an article on it but am curious to hear what others think about it.~

The Bible Code is the title of a book by Michael Drosnin in which he claims that there is a code embedded in the Bible by God. The code is revealed by searching for equidistant letter sequences (ELS). The code is called the Bible Code or the Torah Code. For example, start with any letter ("L") and read every nth letter ("N") thereafter in the book, not counting spaces. If an entire book such as Genesis is searched, the result is a long string of letters. Using different values for L and N, one can generate many strings of letters. Imagine wrapping the string of letters around a cylinder in such a way that all the letters can be displayed. Flatten the cylinder to reveal several rows with columns of equal length, except perhaps the last column, which might be shorter than all the rest. Now search for meaningful names in proximity to dates. Search horizontally, vertically, diagonally, any which way. A group of Israeli mathematicians did just this and claimed that when they searched for names in close proximity to birth or death dates (as published in the Encyclopedia of Great Men in Israel) they found many matches, for example, the date of the assassination of Yitzhak Rabin was in close proximity to letters spelling out his name. Doron Witztum, Eliyahu Rips, and Yoav Rosenberg (1994) published their findings under the title of "On Equidistant Letter Sequences in the Book of Genesis." The editor of the journal commented:

When the authors used a randomization test to see how rarely the patterns they found might arise by chance alone they obtained a highly significant result, with the probability p=0.000016. Our referees were baffled: their prior beliefs made them think the Book of Genesis could not possibly contain meaningful references to modern-day individuals, yet when the authors carried out additional analyses and checks the effect persisted.

That is, the probability of getting the results they did was 16 out of one million or 1 out of 62,500. The authors state: "Randomization analysis shows that the effect is significant at the level of 0.00002 [and] the proximity of ELS's with related meanings in the Book of Genesis is not due to chance." Harold Gans, a former cryptologist at the US Defense Department, replicated the work of the Israeli team and agreed with their conclusion. Witztum later claimed that, according to one measure, the probability of getting these results by chance is 1 in 4 million. He has apparently changed his mind and now claims that the probability p = 0.00000019 (1 out of 5.3 million).

As further evidence of the statistical significance of their results, the Israeli team analyzed the Hebrew version of the Book of Isaiah and the first 78,064 characters of a Hebrew translation of Tolstoy's War and Peace. They found many names in close proximity to birth or death dates, but the results were statistically insignificant. (The book of Genesis used in their study, the Koren version, has 78,064 characters.)

What does this all mean? To some it means that the patterns in Genesis are intentional and that God is the ultimate author of the code. If so, should the Book of Isaiah, and any other book in the Bible that fails the ELS test, be dumped? Should we conclude that these statistics verify the claim that the Jews are the chosen people of God, or that no more names should be added to list of Great Men in Israel unless they pass the ELS test? Unless other religions can duplicate such statistically improbable results, the mathematically minded supernaturalist might well consider them to be imposters. Should we translate all the sacred books of all the religions of the world into Hebrew and see how many great men of Israel are encoded there?

Can a computer really read the mind of God? Apparently. For on this theory God dictated in His favorite language, Hebrew, a set of words that are more or less intelligible if taken at face value, containing stories of creation, floods, fratricide, wars, miracles, and so on, with many moral messages. But this Hebrew God chose his words carefully, encoding the Bible with prophecies and messages of absolutely no religious value.

Many, however, are not at a loss at all. Some Christian "creation scientists" claim the Bible Code provides scientific proof of God's existence. If they are right, they should convert to Judaism. Doron Witztum can't do that, since he is already a Jew. But he has taken the work done on Genesis a bit further than his colleagues. Witztum went on Israeli television and claimed that the names of the sub-camps on a map of Auschwitz appeared remarkably close to the phrase "in Auschwitz." The odds of such occurring, he said, are "one in a million." Some of his students did the math and claim their mentor was off by "a factor of 289,149." Witztum's math may not be as good as his intentions, but it is difficult to see what those intentions might be. Was God revealing in an odd way that the sub-camps of Auschwitz are in Auschwitz?

Michael Drosnin has written a book based on the ELS study. He claims in The Bible Code (1997) that decoding the Bible leads to the discovery of prophecies and profound truths of a secular nature, not all of which are related to the Jews. Drosnin claims that the Bible is the only text in which these encoded phrases are found in a statistically significant pattern, and that the chance of this being a random phenomenon is unlikely. Using the ELS method, Drosnin claims that the assassination of Yitzhak Rabin was foretold in the Bible. He also claims that the assassinations of Anwar Sadat and the Kennedy brothers are encoded in biblical ELS.

Not everybody agrees with the Drosnin hypothesis, including Harold Gans, a retired Defense Department cryptologist who corroborated the work of Witztum, Rips, and Rosenberg. Gans says that the

...book states that the codes in the Torah can be used to predict future events. This is absolutely unfounded. There is no scientific or mathematical basis for such a statement, and the reasoning used to come to such a conclusion in the book is logically flawed. While it is true that some historical events have been shown to be encoded in the Book of Genesis in certain configurations, it is absolutely not true that every similar configuration of "encoded" words necessarily represents a potential historical event. In fact, quite the opposite is true: most such configurations will be quite random and are expected to occur in any text of sufficient length. Mr. Drosnin states that his "prediction" of the assassination of Prime Minister Rabin is "proof" that the "Bible Code" can be used to predict the future. A single success, regardless of how spectacular, or even several such "successful" predictions proves absolutely nothing unless the predictions are made and evaluated under carefully controlled conditions. Any respectable scientist knows that "anecdotal" evidence never proves anything.*

Dr. Eliyahu Rips, one of the authors of the study that started the Bible Code craze, has also made a public statement regarding Drosnin's Bible Code.

I do not support Mr. Drosnin's work on the Codes, nor the conclusions he derives....All attempts to extract messages from Torah codes, or to make predictions based on them, are futile and are of no value. This is not only my own opinion, but the opinion of every scientist who has been involved in serious Codes research.

Professor Menachem Cohen, a celebrated Bible scholar at Bar-Ilan University, has criticized Witztum et al. on two counts: (1) there are several other Hebrew versions of Genesis for which ELS does not produce statistically significant results; and (2) the appellations given to the Great Men in Israel was inconsistent and arbitrary. Other critics, such as Brendan McKay, have done their own analysis of War and Peace with remarkably different results than those reported by Witztum et al. Many critics, however, have done little more than use ELS to find names, dates, and so on in various books, a feat already known by even the weakest of statisticians to be unremarkable. Drosnin once said, "When my critics find a message about the assassination of a prime minister encrypted in Moby-Dick, I'll believe them." McKay promptly produced an ELS analysis of Moby-Dick predicting not only Indira Ghandi's assassination, but the assassinations of Martin Luther King, John F. Kennedy, Abraham Lincoln, and Yitzhak Rabin, as well as the death of Diana, Princess of Wales. Mathematician David Thomas did an ELS on Genesis and found the words "code" and "bogus" close together not once but 60 times. What are the odds of that happening? Thomas also did an ELS analysis on Drosnin's Bible Code II: The Countdown (2002) and found the message "The Bible Code is a silly, dumb, fake, false, evil, nasty, dismal fraud and snake-oil hoax."* Does this mean that God put in a code to reveal that there is no code?

http://www.skepdic.com/bibcode.html

I think it simply means that a mathematician is perhaps the best person to pull the wool over one's eyes. Everything in the known universe has a numerical value, even music and images..things we see..even our own cellular breakdown.

Codes? Devised by whom? God? How was this code revealed then to mortal men who without God's guidance would not have the mentality or genius to develop such a code without it?

That and there is, as your article pointed out, discrepancies in which translation is coded...not to mention the hours of study involved in such a process...and the money? Who got the grant approved for this to begin with?

In my opinion, it's just dazzling press...frankly, David Copperfield is more reliable in his results..;)

Which versions of the bible did they examine, sooner or later they would find a version with a higher than expected "hit rate".
That aside, this is a topic close to my heart.
Research should never be taken seriosuly by those hoping to get famous, earn a living or write books about it.
Only when independent scientists have verified the data~as with Climate chaos, should it be taken seriously. Interesting that all these predictions about men, events, nostradamus, fail to mention climate chaos.
The only one that does is the vedic prohesies 3000 B.C.
They have found other books which also show unusually high "Hit rates" such as Dickens Great Expectations.

I have heard about it on and off for a while,and looking around,it appears as though there are several now from different religious texts..

When the Bible Code first became notorious, the claim was made that ‘no other book contains these codes." The bible was unique. However, as time as gone by, this claim of uniqueness has been completely disproved. Amazing codes have been found in War and Peace (in the Hebrew translation) and in Moby Dick (in the English translation) and even in the text on cereal boxes. This really does indicate that a person should always listen to two sides of any debate if you want to make an informed decision. Codes are found in any piece of writing, in any language, and, yes, even the most fantastic and unbelievable predictions of the future are found everywhere and anywhere. This claim of Biblical exclusiveness was false from the start. The codes that were found in the Bible could not be found in any other book, or any version of the Biblical text other than the 10th century Masoretic version of the Hebrew text for the simple reason that changing even a letter changes the displacement of every other letter in the crossword grid pattern used to search for coded messages. We were left with the impression that ‘no other book has these codes' which is true, but rather disingenuous, since every other book on the planet has its codes.

The codes, while they look fantastic and highly improbable, are actually just the random result of placing thousands of letters into a matrix. The matrix can also have many different dimensions, and the possible combinations of letters one can make is very large. Most of what the matrix produces will be garbage (junk like ‘xopeqwrut', which is not a meaningful word). It is inevitable that the matrix will produce many words, and, as hard as it might be for people to accept, the matrix will also produce astonishing combinations of words in close proximity. This is as true of War and Peace or Moby Dick, as it is of the Masoretic text of the Bible.

But one such as you knew this anyway so the subject matter is?

I am simply curious what others feel about it.I like your post AN,it was really informative...thank you .:) And even though I do feel much as you do,I find it interesting none the less..

I have to agree with AlieNation.

The whole bible code is treated like a hidden word search book.

The whole concept is looking for something that you want to see. The ammount of combinations when reading the lines of anything is high enough that you can find a predictions for the future in a" Where's Waldo Book."

The phrase "given an infinite ammount of monkies and an infinite ammount of typewriters you will eventually get the complete works of shakespear".

Much ado about nothing, Sometimes words work out in funny ways makes um seem more then what they are. To some they might be great secrets and all, but in the end of the day, whats it matter? the world spins, life still struggles on.

Before enlightenment haul water, chop wood, cook food.
After enlightenment haul water, chop wood, cook food.

Doesn't matter what happens written and modified by men through out the last 2000 years, or in the last 200. It only means something to them who find a meaning in it. The thing it means to me is rolling papers for cigs when im out, and to make a good campfire if its cold.

This is very interesting...

Well the codes are possible.

coz I do believe that Universe is caused by formulation in zero and the characters and numbers or any formation which be used in formulation is called matrix. everything works on matrix. may bible have interprataion in the form of code. codes always are matrix coz we have to solve them just like mathmatician. if any one decipher it, please inform me, I will read it.

as interesting a theory as many I've heard: but what about he Apocraphal Bible?

As man re-wrote that book, he left much out.

Great posts and input everyone. I do thank you very much for your imput.
Venom,I would like to hear more on the matrix concept.my dad told me when I was young that everything is mathematical..and I do agree with him on that.
Angelus,forgive my ignorance but what is the Apocraphal Bible?

Why the Apocrypha Isn't in the Bible.Puritans and Presbyterians lobbied for the complete removal of the Apocrypha from the Bible and in 1825 the British and Foreign Bible Society agreed. ...
www.jesus-is-lord.com/apocryph.htm - Cached - Similar

defined as the hidden bible.. by some.

Yuppers Angelus, how true...I've a copy of a "complete" bible including the Apocrypha as well as many others on my shelf that were "deleted" for public perusal in order to push religious theology that in truth, cannot base themselves upon the whole of "God's word."

The exclusion of the hidden bible and the lost books left quite a bit out, not to mention the little reviewed impact of the Dead Sea Scrolls not discussed at any length in a public, little country church setting. This would touch on a previous thread discussed regarding knowledge withheld and thus the power of ignorance over wisdom.

Coding exists as a matrix design in assigning numerical value to written letters, which is nothing new. All of that which we see, smell, hear, taste, and touch can and does have a numerical value. All things, whether we desire to admit it or not, has a price of numerical value to pay for the exchange of what is highly prized at any given time, space, or place....but knowledge is ultimately powerful, but only in the hands of those who reckognize its worth.

.. assuming a code, just assuming it exists, might much of it been lost, with those missing gospels?

.. like, the book according to Mary, Magdalene?

Being "chosen" may not be a good thing.

Ponder that for a while.

Well, in my opinion mattrix can be narrated as:

According to Hinduism, the Creator created this Creation from its womb the Zero (None) and it was in the form of formaulation of the creation and this is interesting that every cause extend this formulation to bring the wider effect and expansion of the formulation and this cause again expand as start (the start of formula) from the earlier effect (the end of formula), this way the Gigantic Creation is expanding. and said the creator is Hiranyagarbha (who dwell too in its own creation / womb) thus this creator brings the start of formulation at every end of earlier formulation and this codification is called matrix. I do surprise that when will the formulation will start folding this universe. coz this formulation matrix brings into effect as creation by the God. Is this means the matrix is the God? / or Matrix is the power of the God?

In the base of hunduism it is said only God exist and none other do exist and other than God is YogaMaya (Super and concentrated Mirage) - this means Yoga Maya is the matrix which convetrated this Creation. and in Hinduism's base it is too stated that Ishwar (God) is Eikeva (only one and none other) na dwitiya (no other).

This means this concetration itself is the God which lost its visibility and conscious feelings in this creation. coz what we see is the efect of the concetration into mass but not the concetration which is causing new formulas.

This formulation is just like the dna fomulation. dna formulation is only on living species, but the mass and its effect is formulated in the matrix and concetrated.

..erm, I thought the thread was about code in the Bible: that is why I offered the information I did about the Apocrypha Bible. Although that said, Apocrypha means 'hidden things' in Greek...

Thank you Angelus.:)

Venom,I understand what you are talking about ,I will post something on the super lattice in the future..
Thanks for all the imput everyone.

Thanks Honorble Oceanne.
Who is the Sutradhar (formulator/ the one who coding), who bind the universe in one code (never ending code as code's end bring another expansion of that cose open into multiway just like computer programming), who is the source of VishwaVriksha (world tree (actually the tree of code)). if any codification is there in the Bible, is of mosrt interest to me. we know the codes are mathematics. Coz I do believe in the world rose from zero due to codification in zero.

can human work on this (codification or matrix) on plazma or photons.... if we derive something on that this will be scientific way to derive the codes and how this codification work...
This will help us in time travel. LHC will not help us otherwise.

Oh... Interesting.... But I love the point Angelus brought up... It was rewritten and text was left out.... The entire book of Enoch is no longer in text as well as multiple verses.... And let's not forget.... The bible was actually put together by a pagan.... Soooooooooo... I find much of the text to be tampered with anyways.... Who's to say what is holy text and what is not when everyone has left their fingerprints all over it.

not only a Pagan. but a hundred years after the death of Jesus the Nazerene.

Everyone's posts have been really informative...thats again.

I do find it interesting that those "hidden texts" have been left out.

I found it interesting that the majority of the most informative and useful info came from a site put up by the Catholic Church... weirdness itself.

If you have any Bible which contains the codes you believe in, and in the file form in your comp., please send me to

khetan.sanjay@gmail.com

I can believe in Bible may have such arrangement of cyphers from the God. which is the medium to who dwell in learning the Bible in the Book Bible very sincerely.

I just wonder which version of the bible has a code in it. The original version of the bible as been altered and rearranged so many times that it would have to be a more modern version, I am thinking.

If it was an older version, then any code would have been lost unless those that were doing the alterations, omissions and additions were aware of the code embedded there, and kept those parts intact.

Oh dear, I've thought too much, I went cross-eyed ;)

S.

personally.. if'n there's a code there, we may as well say that mice did in fact create the earth, to find the question, to the answer forty two.

yay...as though straight-forward jeopardy was not enough...the reverse in coded language in a defunct translation in an Old English text would be perceived as the harbinger of hidden mysteries to unravel mankind...personally, I think we're doing a bang-up job already..;)

Always the Bible or any God book be written by cypherd way more easier than the nostradamos queries. This can easily be decypered by the reader and follower of that book.

Such as

Oh that beloved daughter of the land walk through the land and the land brought her desitny written before she took the birth in this world.

For she is the pride of the land, yet no vanity in her attitude (but her the humble courteous nature (and bright smile helped the nature of that land grow well and the vagetation and flora and fauna there in plenty and others time to time guidence) and her good acts makes her the queen on throne.

As a Christian...i pretty much think the whole "Bible Code" thing is bullshit. I mean... you can create any kind of cypher or pattern to follow and get some conspiracy nut to come up with all sorts of hidden messages in ANY text. I mean...there's a group of nuts that say they decoded to Bible and have discovered that judgement day is May 21 2011... seriously??
ANd yes, there have been a TON of books added to and subtracted from the Bible over the many versions and centuries, but I don't think that the addition or subtraction has anything to do with some super secret code that requires a magic decoder ring from a box of cracker jacks to solve LOL.

The assination of Israels greatest President Yitzak Rabin is said to be predicted and encoded in the bible.