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This topic is inspired by a subject that was lightly touched on by another thread.

As we all know in the black veil code it kind of says vampires should have a code of secrecy. For obvious reasons this should be done. But by now in today’s society the community is well known to those outside of it. Hell there has been several documentaries done on it. Whenever I speak with and elder or a solitary person of this lifestyle. They both seem to say there should be or is a system of teaching those that are ignorant of this life. If one is supposed educate how can you do so from the shadows so to speak. Are we supposed to just let society draw there own conclusions or should we reach out and try to get them to understand.

One other thing is if so many governments know of this activity and disapprove of it why not do something about it?

Code of secrecy my butt! I know far too many people who will just walk right up to me and blurt out "I'm a vampire!"

Then, also, there are those who have said to me "I'm a vampire, but you can't tell anyone because if you do, my elders will hunt you down and kill you!"

I've told lots of people. Hell, every time I'm told that I can't tell, I'll tell everyone I know. I'm a gossip, it's what I do. And anyone who knows that and tells me anyway deserves what they get!

And nothing bad has ever happened to me. No elders swooping down to carry me off into the night, never to be seen again, or any stuff like that what you see in movies or read in books!

the code of secrecy should not be communicated to the general society in my opinion

And yet, it is!

Yeah I have found that weird. Alot that preach the code of secrecy. Are contridicting themeselves with posting websites on the web about it. which makes me think there shouldn't be a code. Seeing as how if don't brodcast it in some way. Alot of people would be lost.

i agree, it should be kep a secret, wonder what in code of secrecy would give that little tidbit away? LOL

The secrecy is there to protect those who have not "come out of the coffin" so to speak. Let's face it, the world does not accept our kind. Some people know who and what I am, and some of my closest friends do not. I live in a verry conservative state/ area, and don't care to be harrassed any more than I usually am.
Also, because sooooo many people can just walk up and say "I'm a vampire" is the main reason for the secrecy. This is a path, a journey to find the self. If someone is serious enough about it, they will take the time to research it.

Well said.

There used to be a code of secrecy but now there are people running up and screaming that they are vampires. but we all would know if they were by the aura they possesed. it sickens me to see so many mortals think that they can easily decieve a vampire as if he were not higher in the food chain.

I think there was a code of secrecy, but it was destroyed, when people became 'open minded' and started disbeleiveing vampires.

I think its real purpose is to protect our kind

i do think people talk way too much in this day and age

There is not much need to stay quiet...unless your diverting secrets that are really required for you to hide...to a human.

It's ironic to talk of a code of secrecy on a vampire database website. The purpose of this site is to learn of vampires.

It's like that everywhere, though. I've met my fair share of pseudo-vamps, but not believing myself to be a vampire, I really don't care. But I do know where you're coming from. I am a Wiccan, and it really irks me that every girl (and guy too) out there with a henna tattoo and a spice rack is calling herself a "witch." I mean, we know our kind, not by auras, but by knowledge. I'm not saying that the inexperienced Wiccan is a wannabe, but those that are wannabe's can be sniffed out right away. The same is true for vampires. It seems that nowadays every person who's ever licked a papercut, read an Anne Rice novel, and has seen every vampire movie starring Christopher Lee is a member of the walking undead. But if you want my opinion (and I know no one does, but you're getting it anyway), it's these same wannabe's and pseudo-vamps you complain about that actually help the code of secrecy. Since "I'm a vampire" is a phrase that gets thrown around all too often these days, society is beginning to brush off the "vamp thing" as some call it, as nothing more than a fad. So since there's hardly a person out there who will actually believe that someone is a "real" vampire, exactly who's cover is being blown?

You raise a valid point there. As a non vamp for every 1 person here that makes a believeable explanation that they are a true vampire there are 10 that sound so very unbelieveable.

down here in aus in the newspaper one day this year, it said thats witchcraft, vampireism etc had been band.

you mean banned? good luck trying to enforce that.

There is a big difference between SECRECY and DISCRETION.

Secrecy is by definition
1. Something that should remain hidden from others (especially information that is not to be passed on)

2. Not open or public; kept private or not revealed

Discretion differs in that
1. Knowing how to avoid embarrassment or distress
2. Refined taste; tact
3. The trait of judging wisely and objectively

The Black Veil in it first guideline (Discretion) states:

I. DISCRETION
Respect yourself and present yourself so that others also respect you. Take care in who you reveal yourself to. Explain what you are, not to shock, but to teach and to inform.

Do not flaunt what you are, and know that whether you want them to or not, your actions will reflect upon the rest of
the community.

Share your nature only with those with the wisdom to understand and accept it, and learn to recognize these people.


Discretion teaches us to maintain a level of dignity and beauty, not only for ourselves but for the good of the entire community.

yer thats the word, sorry (should learn to spell)

When you decide to walk a path the only one that needs to know is you... after all you are writing your own story. Every philosophy have something in common... Gaining knowledge... to learn more and more... and to understand and get to know our true self.

Also when you decide to walk a path you got to have your reasons... If you just chose a path because it made you feel important and superior.. even thinking you are over those "pesky mere mortals" you should reconsider the path you took then... You are not gaining knowledge.. nor understanding more about yourself... you are just showing off... And people that show off usually do it to hide what they lack.

I know exactly what you're talking about, alvens. I am a Wiccan, which is knowledge I would gladly share with anyone who I know would take it right, but I don't just walk up to any Tom, Dick, or Harriet on the street or in a crowd and say "Hi, I'm a witch! Wanna see me cast a spell?" Sadly, though, I have met people who have said that to me, and I feel for those who have to encounter "Hi, I'm a vampire! I can't touch crosses, but I LOVE to drink blood!"

Humans! Glad I never was one!

Secrecy depends on which "family" you know lol

Exactly beshadowed. I think vampirirsm comes from folklore.. and sinse it comes from it.. it has to have a true origin... like witches.. but that doesn't mean that folklore is 100% accurate and right... After all I've never seen a witch flying at night crossing the moon with his/her broom and throwing beams form their hands. Or turning people into frogs.

Must people are afraid of what they don't know.. and fascinated by it too. I am fascinated by it too.. but it doesn't make me more than human. It just make me a curious one.

good point Goblet

I'm curious myself as to where the "Witch Mythos" originated from. Witches, so far as I can recall, have never turned people into frogs. We can't shoot beams from our hands (pure Hollywood), and although certain witches can bend the laws of physics slightly (only slightly), we cannot break or defy them. Sorry, but the great broom ride has been cancelled (although once someone actually did refer to me derogatorily as a "Broom Jockey")

But like you said, all myths have their bases in fact, however slight. I'm not sure where all of the vampire mythos came from, but I do know that a lot of the witch myths came from rumors that became grossly exaggerated (hey, we were still, like a million years from the invention of TV, talk was all we had.)

um....did you know that post was blank?

I believe it is there to secure the knowledge that Vampires have procured over the existence of their being. When it is time, the wisest, and proven are enlightened to this ageless information. As well it is meant to protect. Yes modern day vamps have begun destroying this way of life for many, but it still exists protecting who it can, and who is deserving.

I would like to expand upon the very good point which domangelus has raised.

There is a distinct difference between secrecy and discretion.

In the past during less liberal times, secrecy was a requirement for survial.

Since the advent of the victorian storytellers and visual media, the popularisation of vampyres has meant that there is less fear and stigma attached, particularly amongst the younger generations.

With this, it seems that what is being touted as a contradiction is publishing information on websites such as this one and maintaining a 'veil' is that we need not go shouting from the rooftops and chasing publicity.

Those that have an interest and wish to learn will seek out of their own accord- there is no need to force the issue nor chase people to make tham understand the nature of vampyrism.

eventually, it will follow the same path as wicca and witchcraft, where popualr culture has already begun to embrace it within the 'mainstream' and it is essentially seen as 'cool'.

This process has already clearly begun and I suspect in just a genration or two, with the kind of works being produced by those such as the Order of Dragon and the Kheprians amongst many, even though their opinions vary to a huge degree, they core basis of their philosophy is to deconstruct the myth and buld a truth.

^ Apologies for the shocking amount amount of spelling and grammer errors...

Very well said Stabb.

Sonik,

I don't think that it is neccessary to patronise people in respect to this, as there is indeed confusion on the various teachings.

Many here that would claim to be vampyres do not generally advertise their personal info.

So I am not sure that I see your point?

well said people

i don't blame people who take themself for vampire, all are have the right to do what he want stabb and i respect this a lot ...

... for myself i'm more consider like student in vampire , vampirism , myth and mythology ....

... if you claim for a real secrecy and discression society don't come in internet on Vampire Rave or stuff like that is the best way for know all you dont think ? ....

... and people who make them own site about vampire and claim to be one sorry again but it's stupid after to speak of discretion and secrecy ....

nop sorry but when i see people who speak of secret and discretion on a " site internet " it s make me laught ....

And if you think a little about what i tell before you will see i'm right.

Sonik,

You are essentially riduculing people for presenting information on the nature of their vampyrism in apparent violation of their ethical code of 'discretion'.

As has been said, the black veil does not say that one should keep it secret, but that discretion should be used in the way in which this information is presented.

One of the co-authors of the veil itself has become a great proponent of 'coming out of the coffin' and is currently in the progress of writing a series of books to act as guides for the newly awakened.

So, it is not contradictory to want to show themselves, if this is done in a well thought out and intelligent manner and avoids role play cliches...

yes , totally because speak of secrety , discretion here i think is not very intelligent.....

and i apport proof to my theory ....


for this

" As has been said, the black veil does not say that one should keep it secret,
but that discretion should be used in the way in which this information is presented."

yes , i'm agree with you but on this point but the information here sorry to tell that is not sometimes good
representative of the reality " too much people are based in hollywood movie and stuff like that "
it s for that i think information it s necessary for help people to understand what is vampire , vampirism...

i'm glad you read a little a bout vampire and you re not enjoy this site only for fun ...
ps : i give you a answer in my other thread " about vlad .... " if you like read there are three book
specially mentionned for you ....

So, it is not contradictory to want to show themselves, if this is done in a well thought out and intelligent
manner and avoids role play cliches...

yes i dont tell the inverse you have right but speak of secrety is totally wrong if understand your think ?

ps : sorry for my english it s was hard for me to answer so much word i dont know

Right...I think I see what you are saying now sonik.

those that come on places like this and shout 'I'm a vampyre' are who you are directing your criticsim at...

but those that do such clearly are inexperienced and often younger and may never have even seen the black veil, so they are not following or claim to be following it's guidelines.

Besides which, the veil is only one set of ethics, so a vampyre only chooses whether to follow them or not. I know of those that are more secretive and those that are more open, yet neither set care for the veil.

yes, totally because speak of discretion and secrecy
and shoot
" i m a vampire " i find it stupid and totally
no intelligent ... it s big " euphemisme and contradiction "

yes sometimes i think too much young people here for have
a serious conversation on the subject and lot of them play....
it s for that in this point "information and prevention and prevention " are more welcome i think

there are things that should not be posted for all to see. as far as teaching one should know what the student is ready for and what it is not.

have you fear of the knowledge of vampire
Mr ryu ??
because i think knowledge is essential for undertand creature of the night ....

I had no idea that vampirism was something you could teach....

....go figure!

we don't speak of teach
we speak of information ;)

I think society has already drawn its own concutions on the matter, with the likes of hollywwod and the video games industry, The Kin are now readily avalable in all foms of media.


Sorry for any spelling ,istakes I am a little drunk

i believe that the code of secrecy has been blown to hell

Well its not longer secret is it?

As it was mentioned earlier "The Black Veil" is a guideline only. Yes in this day and age the code of secrecy has been blown to hell but as for the black veil it states very clearly to use discretion when revealing one's self to one of the mundane society. This is for the vampire's protection mainly and the house but there are those who are rogue their descision still effects the rest of the vampire community though they are not part of any particular house.

I agree with raven cadwell-so many want to be, and insist they are, and know this or that- if I were a true elder, I wouldn't want to waste my time with that kind either-it;s annoying

It is not right to assume that all vampires choose to live by a code of secrecy. For one to live out their vampyre life in the open is not idiotic or childish. It's the same as saying, "I am a Republican" or "I am a Baptist"....or whatever. Discretion is how you present the vampyre life to those around you. If one does it wearing fake fangs or wearing archaic clothes, then a person may think that the vampyre culture to be a mere novelty. If however one does live openly about their vampyrism with dignity and maturity, then another person may learn to see the beauty of what vampyrism is all about. Many vampyres, like myself, live openly in order to teach the general public about the nature of true living vampyrism.

And for you Sonik, I find your comments rude and condenscending. You continually make snide comments and then hide behind your broken english as an excuse for not better preparing your posts. Just because you have your personal theories doesn't mean you are always correct. Learn to be a little more thoughtful and better prepared to state your point in order to avoid any further misunderstandings.

I am closing this thread as it is not going to become a battlefield for about who is right, and who is wrong and silly name calling. Thankyou all for your input, and I feel each view is valid from the independant perspective of the individual :)

By the way interesting thread and debate Vampkamui.