The Ultimate Vampire Resource and Directory

Ave, Greeting to all our dark Brothers and Sisters from the house of Noctem Aeternus.

We hope that this new year will bring our community closer.
We are hoping that we can open links of communication between us all to find ways to better our community as well as unify us.
Let us learn from each other, we are all Vampyric, thus we should build off of that commonality and see past our differences.
We all have views on being Vampyric, Psi or Sang. We are still Vampyric and that is what we as a community should build off of.
I think it is time, that we stop calling others role players because of the terminologies that are used.
Some of us are taught some words that fit who and what we are. I studied and taught Noctem Aeternus the path of Strigoi Vii, but for the last few years we teach many schools of thought, but we are still seen by many as role players even though none of us ever even played such games just because of the strigoi path we started with.
It is time to teach and learn from one another and help our community grow.
Not push each other away.
How can we call our selves a community if we keep doing what the mundane community has done to us.

Please think about this.
Don't just dismiss this.
We are reaching out to you all......

We would like to hear your thoughts on how we can make this happen.
Please no putting others views down, no hating, no flaming. this thread is to speak about how we as a community can work together...
so please lets not put anyones views down.

I agree with you entirely LordOfNoctemAeternus that is why I have become more open about who and what I am on these forums.

If more of us are prepared to discuss our lifestyles it helps those who are non vampyres to integrate better.

No one has the right to say another is a role player or to judge and say your not a vamprye because you do not spell it right.

Its time we embraced each other and excepted each others views.

Its time that we are able to express who we are without ridicule from others

Lord Ryu I hope you can bring the community together .Much luck upon you in doing so.As you know I am not vampyric but only Neko that doesnt mean I dont respect and believe in the vampyric existance

Thank you both for your words and support

But what is being discussed by your want for unity. What is the point other then to call out a "truce" with flame wars.

how would you wager someone learn if there is not a unified codices of vocabulary that everyone would agree on.

Should there be a sort of online and real world meeting like there be a modern day Council of Nicaea where everyone who has respective houses and covens convene and speak for the unification and the establishment of their overall factions for the foundation of the community to eliminate these pockets and squabbles?

Yes. We are already working with other households and states, to find a common ground to build off of. we are asking for those who are apart of the community what they feel is needed to bring us all together and how to reach that point.

Lord ryu i understand the place your heart is at, however this will take a lot of work to do and it will not be easy there are ppl that will resist changes i wish you the best of luck

There should not be a subjugation of order to the ranks, that would make us like them. Which we are not.

In any case, the individual and the connection to their path is important. If you start adding in human law and dogma to the path. Then you are taking away the connection to the spiritual and the higher laws which one might be working with in accordance with bonds/pacts they have made in order to fulfill their role of service.


When it comes to those bonds and pact agreements. All earth bound ones can literally go to hell. I don't care what humans do, i don't care what gods and the assorted like want. I don't have an interest in their "ways". I have a path that I must walk. Others who walk paths, do so in connection with their own agreements and such. Its not my place, nor is it any "living" community that determines how one walks it.

- on a legal note - if ones society determines that the actions of one or many of the subject is illegal / unlawful then they will seek to punish. If ones actions are above reproach then there is no need to involve ones self in the legal aspects.

Again we have enough of government involvement and socio-political involvement and "codes".

I will begin by writing in a note to all: I apologize from the get go if this post ends up being a book, but this is always the way I post when I am particularly learned in a topic. Now I will begin...

The community is the way it is because its members, those belonging to groups and independant make it the way it is. This is the way that it has been from day one way back in the 90's. There is no changing any drama, nor "political" views by anyone within the community.

Yes, there are always trouble makers within the community, this is a given. But why do those who confront others by taking sides of supposedly innocent individuals become the trouble makers in the eyes of others before and after getting the whole story from both sides? It seems as though the real trouble makers are the blamers of the innocent to begin with. If you do not like someone, then the mature thing to do is to tell them to leave you alone. Plain and simple. If things turn out to be illegal, then this is what the local authorities are for, NOT vigilantes. That is of course, unless anyone belongs to a "gang" or something of that caliber.

No one is pushing anyone away, some just need clarification when others go on a ranting spree when others seem to piss them off by things they type online to others or speak in person. If you do not like someone elses views then just walk away or ignore the post. Again, plain and simple.

This quote irritates me a bit so I will need some clarification for it:

"How can we call our selves a community if we keep doing what the mundane community has done to us."

The irritating factor is the general idea that the statement percieves the writer to be "differant" then the average individual, when clearly they are not. We are ALL human, no one is above HUMAN unless they climbed some sort of evolutionary ladder within the last 15 years or so within their lives, and I do not mean by any so called "awakening" process. If anyone thinks they are differant physiologically then anyone else then please give a medical document stating thus.

If by definition they think they grew through the evolutionary process by metaphysical default, ie spiritual awareness, then they are still entirely HUMAN by default. Their spiritual path is simply differant, nuff said.

I think the only reason why some would have a problem with the community is because the community loves to segregate itself into a set stereotype instead of thinking for themselves rather then having someone or a group of individuals actually telling them what they think they are by "teaching" certain principles or ideals.

"If more of us are prepared to discuss our lifestyles it helps those who are non vampyres to integrate better."

let us not start an Opera show here. This is not an AA meeting. Not all of society cares abotu what lifestyle anyone else chooses for themselves as long as they behave in a mature fashion and not flaunt it in their general direction, making that other individual feel less then adequette in their own self esteem. There is no integration here at all, just some individuals that feel as if they do not fit in or belong and seem to want some clarity from others regarding themselves.

"No one has the right to say another is a role player or to judge and say your not a vamprye because you do not spell it right."

A rebuttle would be that all of society has the right because it is both the freedome of speech as well as the freedom of choice. It is also the right to walk away from the conversation as a choice as well as the choice of not taking offense to any short coming statements that may seem offensive or negative.

Again, it is not the spelling factor but what the word spelled with a "y" means to certain individuals. the claiming that the spelling with a "y" are energy users and manipulators, when this is clearly not the case at all, just an entitlement that those certain individuals gave to themselves to describe it best.

We also call Psychics, Wiccans, Alchemists, etc. energy manipulators and feeders, but they are not vamp"y"ric at all.

No one "needs" to survive off of energy alone, by this meaning that no one can just randomly touch another individual and pretend to be as healthy as the next individual without eating the proper physical foods as well.

"Its time we embraced each other and excepted each others views."

I will start accepting other's views when they become less contradictive and have proper descriptions of their views rather then just a long rant going on about what they think they are.

It seems this thread may be stemming from the last post you made regarding a "new council" and some sort of "protection" from whom ever.

This statement is one that I would like to comment on at this time:

"Lord Ryu I hope you can bring the community together"

There have actually been several individuals of whom thought like Ryu more then a few years back and several who always come and go like the wind. Nothing ever really gets accomplished by them. Most of those who do try to get things started are seen as nobodies since they had not established themselves properly within the community itself. Most that I once knew never heard the name Noctem Aeturnus, nor the name Ryu save for within the past year or so, so my question to you Ryu is...

What makes you any differant then the rest of those who failed miserably? One needs a bit of backing from those surrounding them for starts, respect is not gained, it is earned by community deeds that have been accomplished and merited by the community itself. Just because someone comes up with a fancy name for a House, then starts a "Halo" that is distinct with the "strigoivii" philosophy, does not mean that they are respected because of it. Most that I know have a distain for anyone that associates with any member of the "strigoii" family because they are usually seen as trouble makers.

New Councils, old councils... Whats the differance? Nothing has been accomplished within the last 20 years that the supposed community leaders had claimed their ground. So what makes any of this lobbying any differant then any of the others? How much backing do you really think you have in any sort of lobbying other then within the "striogoii" network? Who do you think will actually take your plight seriously?

These are just a couple of questions that need to be answered. Without flaming, ridicule, threats, or any other B.S. retorts, comments, or remarks. I am sure your audience of this thread wish to know.

SS I think we are going to get into another debate lol sorry

I understand why you dont like the mundane terminology its derogatory and I confess I use it myself.

You say, so called "awakening" process. Where is your eveidence that it is not a bonafide process? Those who are awakened have nothing to prove. I for one am not here to recruit avid folowers, only to share my experience so I have no need to make glorified statements that are not true to attract attention.

If by definition they think they grew through the evolutionary process by metaphysical default, ie spiritual awareness, then they are still entirely HUMAN by default

I like the way you use the term THEY by therefore segregating US from YOU by defult. Also we are not entirely human, but we are trapped inside the human form as that is the nature of reincarnation and vampirism is the transgression of the immortal soul, not body.

(I think the only reason why some would have a problem with the community is because the community loves to segregate itself into a set stereotype instead of thinking for themselves)...by constantly refusing to take our points of view on face value you are sterotyping US all into madmen and preachers of lies

("No one has the right to say another is a role player or to judge and say your not a vamprye because you do not spell it right."

A rebuttle would be that all of society has the right because it is both the freedome of speech as well as the freedom of choice. It is also the right to walk away from the conversation as a choice as well as the choice of not taking offense to any short coming statements that may seem offensive or negative.)

I like your reply to this the best because it shows you are in league with being a Racist. Bt what your saying, people have the right to stick labels to others regardless of how that individual or group of individual will be hurt by that name calling. I am not saying your a racisit just that your theory of free speech without consequence stinks of it.

(We also call Psychics, Wiccans, Alchemists, etc. energy manipulators and feeders, but they are not vamp"y"ric at all.) Thats because they are probably not lol VampYric means that you have to feed from the life source of energy because your body needs it! and before you bleet about food, we also need that too, we HAVE to have both, humans only need food.

(I will start accepting other's views when they become less contradictive and have proper descriptions of their views rather then just a long rant going on about what they think they are.) I have been consistant with the way I describe myself except for the spelling, its not the intention of the spelling that makes me spell but rather just I do not make a distintion between the two spellings, if you do thats your problem. I also do not care if you accept my views, it makes no difference to my life, I do not rant I simply reply. I understand that your not talking purely about me in your post but I can only answer from me.

No offence man and none taken

it sounds liek a nice idea

but relasticly i just dont see it happing

~LordBaalNox~, your post of clarification was not needed and could have been sent as a private message if anything. As it does not relate to this thread, save for which direction members disagree with one another therefore proving Ryu's point of "why can't we all just get along."

I couldn't really care less if the community gets along or not, society is not perfect. As well, you failed to mention what good could come out of the community by putting a "chosen one" scenerio out there for the blind to lead the blind into something that may never happen because no one will ever agree to any sort of "council" scenerio. This is not the Vamp"y"res: The Masquerade, there are no juris-my-diction lines, no siding with friends nor enemies... To call for protection is to instigate drama, when no protection is needed unless the protectors are vigilante. This is what the local law enforcement is for, learn to use it.

Like I said, if it has not happened after 20 damned years, it will never happen at all. Because no one really cares about who has authority over who for what purpose. Unless that authority is actually getting paid to govern, then they are just a group of, shall I use the term again? "roleplayers" or lifestylers just for the sake of belonging and trying to create a world within a world that a few would like to call, dare I say it? An "underworld." Give it a break already. No one governs over anyone.

Those who want media exposure know the right places to dial into networks for the sake of sensationalism.

One last thing... If you are going to rant, at least keep it on topic. I am a Liberal and Patriot. Therefore, I choose to live by MY rights in the name of FREEDOM. So keep the "racist" assumptions for private messages because the TOS does not allow for such conversations to take place.

I must have hit some sore spots because your posts are still about you and not about the topic at hand. Again, try to remain on topic in the future... Otherwise you will just be proving Ryu correct with his original post.

Oh, by the by... "Feeding" off of energy is what human kind does. Energy comes from all aspects of life and not just from food. Where do you think depression comes from? A lack of energy source. In this case, society is by your definition "vamp'y're" in a nutshell. Since the buddhists believe in reincarnation, my point is proven.

Try as well to be more open to others beliefs, a quid pro quo is more then welcomed. Instead of back and forth debate and rebuttle.

*Chuckles* On a side note, regarding this paragraph...

"I like your reply to this the best because it shows you are in league with being a Racist. Bt what your saying, people have the right to stick labels to others regardless of how that individual or group of individual will be hurt by that name calling. I am not saying your a racisit just that your theory of free speech without consequence stinks of it."

Sticks and stones, lad... sticks and stones.

My point then is exactly ON topic because it shows that society does not get on, there is never going to peace and harmony because people cant except things on face value.

I feel you will never be satisfied with a persons theory no matter how they try to justify it but what you fail to realise is that I really dont care, only enough to keep replying and standing by what I say no matter how you try a wriggle your words to suit your advantage. I may not be as good with words as you which is why to the reader it will look like your points of view are more stronger than mine. But lots who frequent this forum are Vampyres and whether you like it or not its a fact.

Bringing the vamprye community together is a lovely idea but I have to agree with ss on this point it wont work, i do not bow down to anyone.

It's not about bowing down to any one, but about working together, and respecting each others views.
There are Ronin. aka solitary Vamps. that help out by giving their input and putting in their time to teach, as well as other house holds, that that have their own head yet still work with others. why is this so hard to do? why is it so hard to believe that I have all the power I need.. its not about power. ITS ABOUT UNITY, COMMUNITY WORKING TOGETHER!

I will repost this in conquest of some answers:

What makes you any differant then the rest of those who failed miserably? One needs a bit of backing from those surrounding them for starts, respect is not gained, it is earned by community deeds that have been accomplished and merited by the community itself. Just because someone comes up with a fancy name for a House, then starts a "Halo" that is distinct with the "strigoivii" philosophy, does not mean that they are respected because of it. Most that I know have a distain for anyone that associates with any member of the "strigoii" family because they are usually seen as trouble makers.

New Councils, old councils... Whats the differance? Nothing has been accomplished within the last 20 years that the supposed community leaders had claimed their ground. So what makes any of this lobbying any differant then any of the others? How much backing do you really think you have in any sort of lobbying other then within the "striogoii" network? Who do you think will actually take your plight seriously?

well ss Not all who support are from that path, we here in va work together and Noctem Aeternus is the only house with Strigoi backrounds, we are NOT TODD. what we are asking for is to grow together learn from each other. its not about power but community, I mean how can we call our selves a community if there is no unity?

I suppose there is no harm in comming together for communication purposes and for networking providing that belief structures are not rammed down the throats of other Orders and Houses.

I can see why you want to do it, I can also see the benefits of it too but someone will want to be in charge of it and thats where the problem will start and why it is doomed to fail.

Sometimes we cannot see what is staring us in the face untill that which we cannot see slaps us across the chops with a wet fish and says WAKE UP MAN

I'm curious exactly the point of uniting other than for someone to feel the need to be more around others whom are similar to their own viewpoints and ways. If it is not about power and more about unity, what exactly is the purpose of it? What is wrong with just simply BEING? Is that not good enough?

Surely you are experiencing unity just by simply coming together onto this website as an example.

Sounds to me like there are some people whom needs to learn to come to terms of that.....

First off, as others have said before...we are all kin, why is there such a need to be so hateful towards one another?..I can understand genuinely not liking someone because they have wronged you..but because they think a little differently than you-you have no right to condemn them. Those of us that really are what we claim to be-know that..and don't need the validation from any other individual..nor do we really need to convince anyone of it either...Alas, I feel that even though we so ardently attempt to bring others at peace as a group..it may be damn near impossible to get others to coexist peacefully..I guess when you get so many strong willed individuals in one room..something bad is bound to happen.

However,

I understand the intention behind what is trying to be done...and I can commend you for trying to bring together kin with an open heart. As you have already witnessed, people can be resistant to change..in whatever form it may be. I never really understood the fuss about making some distinction with spelling. To me, calling oneself a Vampire or Vamp(y)re is a form of labeling. We are what we are..and we do what we have to in order to survive...why is there so much hostility against one's use of a word? I don't feel this mission is one of tyranny or a metaphoric kissing of one's feet. This is to bring those of like mind together and create an environment that is safe and structured for everyone. Whether anyone wants to admit it or not, those that label themselves of such a nature...are separating themselves from society and even though we have to adhere to normal laws of society..we need to have boundaries and guidelines within our own separate community.

as a true community we can learn so much more from the many view points....as far as a leader look at the U.N. they all represent their home lands and cultures. and they work together. why can't we? why is it so hard to understand we can be such a grate community if we came together and stop trying to think of something like this as a power play.

Again ryu you make a good point however my question to you is are you attempting to unite the community under strogi II? for this would rub many ppl the wrong way

No just bring them together

I am with you. Many of the true Vampyres or vampires may have many things in common and are one of the blood, but no two people are alike individually. It is time to let go some of the opinions so many state as facts.

For my part, I know I am not a Vampyre in anyway, but that does not mean the next one down is not. I know I am at least human like many others, and that I am still narrowminded in many ways. But I am not about to let my flaws stop me on the quest of the truth and of knowledge.

I will learn sooner or later why the Vampyres' call themselves beautiful. Sooner or later I will sense the spiritual energy that flows about the whole world. And sooner or later I wont be so narrowminded...

I think getting back to basics is a good Idea. But I think that those are not here for that purpose should move they're profiles to the other groups that are available

Very good topic and a good idea if done correctly. I'm sure there are many who would help make it happen. Though I'm also sure many would try to stop it as well unfortunetly

Established religions have denominations.

To expect Baptist, to join in league with Penecost is
is not reasonable. Sure penecost, and baptist have a core belief in common, but they seperate on interpretation of text, and a few other concepts.

I am curious Sara, you say "someone will try to stop it" Who would you suggest that "someone is", and what purpose would they intervene in a collective attempting to consoladate?

What distinct factions in the mentioned vampyre community are being referred to? For clarity.

What base ideal is presented for the consoladated
collectives?

Would there be a set Discription of what constituetes a vampire/vampyre?

I notice the predomant spelling here is Vampyre? How would people be determined as "worthy" of being
"Vampyre"?

Who would be excluded from the consoladation?


One thing I read in this forum is the undertone that "mundanes" need to "get with it." and "just accept that you are what you believe you are." Is it okey with you if people could careless?

I am curious as well, why group together a stereotype of individuals? Why a unity? It seems a bit like highschool. Why does the community need a supposed unity? Against what? Is it for the sake of a utopia? No one individual will get along with several others because their opinions would clash. Two head strong individuals would always fight because they have views that are seperate. This would cause a struggle of civility in my opinion.

Again, this has been tried several times. What makes you differant then all the rest? You ~Ryu~ have STILL not answered the question. How can you say that you wish for a civility within the community, when in the past you have done things that others within the community dislike and are seen as a bad person by several? You do not have a good reputation. What makes you think that you could be a revolutionary leader when in your past you have done ill toward others?

It always seems like people that are outcast, or rejected attempt to 'reconcile' there previous biases.

At one time being very outspoken about those deemed unworthy, then recanting when it becomes evident that they are burning bridges, and gaining negative attention.

Especially when people that once bought the lesser accepted factions pitch, start learning of the more appealing, and better organized groups, and ditch out on the lesser organized.. more usery fractions (read cult). I could imagine that it would be easy to get jaded when self proclaim leadership is constantly ranting about "those' people, and how "society just doesn't get us'.

People simply want to be around people with basic ideals in common. Not people that are out to start a revolution based on person interpretations of ideals.

When i hear people say, we need to unite, I hear, "I want to be a part of a dictatorship."

Is it your opinion Ryu, that a consoladation will "Bring out" Vampyres to be "embraced by society.

because face it, even if I subscribed to Vampires/vampyres I would place you personally at a slim likelihood of being such.

It appears that a majority of people who believe they are vampires are more intrested in what others think of their beliefs anyway. Something is obviously wrong with that.

The word conformity keeps popping up in my mind. Is it conformity to your interpatation of Vampyre that you are implying Ryu?

"It appears that a majority of people who believe they are vampires are more intrested in what others think of their beliefs anyway. Something is obviously wrong with that."

"Cry me a river" comes to mind with that bantery.

Which is the point that I am getting at. I couldn't care less who's beliefs are out in the open, who recognizes them and so forth. It is up to others to communicate on their own level and not be so strung into a political way of thinking.

Two individual may have a conversation, and debate about it all night. But, if a third individual comes in with contradictive notions after two hours have passed when the first two have already made quality points, then that third individual may be laughed at or ridiculed because of their supposed contradictive statements relating to the conversation. It is like walking in on a conversation when points have already been made and the individual makes themselves to look the fool because they had no idea what was said prior to their entry and no idea of what the conversation was previously about.

Hence my other point.

to answer your question dab, I don't know who would try, or even want to stop it. But I'm sure someone would. History shows that someone always tries to stop such things. Hopefully nobody would though.

On the other hand, someone always tries to start it. Hence the "treehugger" mentality. No society will ever end in the Utopic fashion. Such is life and the way of human existance.

Very true. Though the hope is always there. Improbable as it is.

It does bring to question, of which ~Dab~ has already answered in brief, but...

Why would someone seemingly so untrustworthy wish to unite a society? The respect as I have witness is very lacking, since others seem to mock them because of wrongings wtihin their immediate past? Drama seems to be always at their door and yet they try to administer a peace mongering as if that drama does not exist even if the drama came from both sides?

I mean, I could have sworn that if an individual were wanting to start some sort of peace within a community, that they would need to have first established for themselves a following of trust and a presence within that community first and formost.

The only reason why I ask this is for the fact that everytime I hear the name "Noctem Aeturnus" it seems to always be in a negative light. Am I missing something here?

Why would someone with some sort of negative light surrounding themselve, wish for peace within a community when the drama comes from both sides and seems to be started from both sides?

Like I said, this thread seems very political in nature, which is why I am asking all these questions. Of which, still have not been answered in kind.

are you saying I am un trust worthy? SS

I am simply pondering as to why you do not answer relevant questions regarding your supposed station. Avoiding these quesitons could be a sign of immediate guilt. It is simply that trouble seems to follow you.

As far as this thread is concerned, I still wonder why you are trying to fix something that doesn't seem to be broken.

Unless there is physical voilence or threats thereof within the offline community, then this threat is a moot point. If there is, then it is up to the higher stations within those cities or towns to deal with the trouble makers accordingly and not just one individual from a site to call for any type of "peace treaty" or what ever.

Just because one site has a few individuals on it that contest others convictions, does not mean that others sites do it as well. There is nothing wrong with subjecting any individuals composer and or convictions to testing. As this method lets the audience speculate for themselves based on the tested answers given.

It was never about "why don't you believe me" plights of sympathy from the whiners and complainers out there, but about who we really are and the fact that we just don't care about what others within or outside the community thinks of us. Most of the time it just reminds me of an "emo" crying in a corner or something to that extent.

Like it was written above, just because one site has a bit of a problem with a certain few individuals that claim to be this or that, does not mean that there is not peace within the whole of the community. One site is not the be all end all by any means when it comes to drama mongering or the communication within the community.

Online is not offline. Half the individuals that claim to be this or that, could just be looking for some type of sympathy because their lives may be void of it or they just want a reaction from others. Now, if this were offline and you came up to me based on true events that were taking place, then I might have listened to your plight. But fortunately this is not the case, as I have not witnessed any community associated mishaps that would deem the community as rebellious and not at peace. By this, I mean the entire community and not just one or two small squabbles within certain areas around the world that are dealt with within five to ten minutes and are soon forgotten about after that.

Very well expressed, SS, and argued.

We are already "united" as much as any free society can be or should be. We are already a "vampire" community... filled with people from all over the world who either consider themselves to be or who find fascinating or who simply enjoy the topic of... Vampires. And here we are already a free online community where all have the right to express their views and put forth the results of their own research and experience... so long as they respect others and their equal rights to do the same.

That is what primarily defines a free society and a free community... be it in real life or online. And thankfully this is exactly what we have here... and who we are here.

And given this undeniable fact, logically anyone arguing against such a free community and for the stripping of such foundational freedoms as we all enjoy here is most assuredly not doing so for the benefit of the community, but instead... for the benefit of himself. After all, if we give this person our freedoms and our trust, then we are no longer a community... but instead an autocracy, ruled over by that person or persons to whom we have so freely and foolishly given those freedoms.

This is the unaltering course of history each and every time a society gives up its basic freedoms. And convincing others to do so is the indisputable path taken throughout history by all its myriad despots. And it is precisely for this reason that never once has any of them ever been... trustworthy.


- Upir'

trouble? The only trouble that seems to fallow me is you, and I have nothing to feel guilty for...I stand up for who and what I am. you have always tried to say I have underlining motives when that is untrue. it seems to me that you are the one who seeks the ugly in all things, thus I have no time for ones such as you. instead of giving ways to work together you seem to focus on putting the idea down.
thus the lack of my responses to you.

This is a difficult topic. Difficult to me because most of what is going on and many of the problems that are rampant have only existed in the last, what, maybe 20 to 30 years.

Buzz words do bother me because it tends to create cliques who decide that they are the ones in the "know" and if you don't use their systems or words you are then labeled as you mention. Since I am old, I find it all very comical quite frankly. I find using some of the tags to be embarrassing and right out of fiction. The age ranges are too spread, geographically we are spread and cultural heritage is very different for many. You have a big obstacle to overcome not to mention belief systems that are entwined from Christianity to the Occult varying by individual. Then there are those that think everything is 'dark' while others don't want to be identified in that manner which they feel is closer to novelistic fiction and superstition. For instance, I know the word ronin that was mentioned, but who started using it for vampirics who don't align with any group or organization and prefer to be solitary? Someone who has never really been involved with the "scene" will not know these words or if they have not looked up what some person on a website is saying if they use that word and not some other that is also made up? From what I have observed is that unless things become a little simpler and less emphasis put on silly things like what color someone wears and style of dress, I don't see people coming together to actually address real world issues.

Since we are all human basically with some differences obviously, how can you make things such as wording the same for everyone when it isn't any sort of vocation? All of that in my opinion is part of the social "scene". I think one should get away from the idea of unification because the world is too large for anything like that. Let people choose who they want to affiliate with in my opinion and leave it at that. We just need to be a step ahead of condemning others who have different opinions to a more "live and let live attitude" and deal with whatever best serves individuals in your geographical area. Be yourself and if others don't understand, that is the way of life isn't it?

If creating more organizations was going to help then it would have a long time ago. I think more should just gather with what is already established and work to make those groups the best they can be rather than create more splinter groups. I think it is commendable that some want to try and bring goodwill to all but the problem is that a hierarchy has been created and no matter how one looks at it there are those that believe they are "stars" and I think that is where one should start with learning more about humility and dealing realistically with living on this planet with everyone else.

"it seems to me that you are the one who seeks the ugly in all things, thus I have no time for ones such as you. instead of giving ways to work together you seem to focus on putting the idea down.
thus the lack of my responses to you."

I am going to make this quite clear for those who seem to misunderstand my tact, including Ryu and the rest who read this.

I go by the ugly in situations before the ugly is found, to avoid possible negative scenerios by outlining them first. This makes it easier to work on or for any and all positive scenerios after the ugly has shown its face.

Once the ugly has been outlined and dealt with by questions answered, then should the positive make its way through, it would therefore be easier to carry out what ever task is at hand. Since all questions asked have been answered ideally. So those who would ask future questions would already have the answers they seek just by reading what was written down in the past, to satisfy their emotions toward what ever endeavor takes place.

The positive and negative both need to be addressed. I just tend to start with the negative to get it out of the way. If the positive outway the negative then by all means continue, but if the negative has the most foundation and weight, then all partaking of the endeavor know what they are looking at ahead of time.

It is not that I put ideas down, it is the fact that I go by the old motto "don't fix whats not broken". To call a society unpeaceful or proclaim it to be not at peace is a sure sign of instilling negative connotations within that society. That is my whoe point of rebuttle.

If there is something troubling any part of the community, or any part of a certain House, Sect, or group then it is up to the leader(s) of that part of society to handle the trouble mongerers accordingly.

There will always be tiny drama(s) within any community. But if that or those dramas are not dealt with accordingly, then others tend to get involved even if they were not part of it to begin with, just to stand up for the little man. Which in turn, turns it into an all out struggle for who may have been right and who may have been wrong, thus the whole thing seem to have been taken out of proportion.

If there needs to be a call for peace within that certain community, then I am sure that ALL the leaders or Elders within it will call for a meeting of some sorts and broadcast it around their Nation accordingly, instead of just one lone individual trying to broadcast independantly.

Thus, I see that this thread is moot because no "Court" as some like to call it, has been called. Thus, I am sure that the leaders and or Elders are well aware of anything and everything within their community and deal with it accordingly, thus there is really no need for any type of "Calling peace within the community".

I do hope you understand my point now.

You guys should know better than turn threads into personal disputes. We shouldn't have to read any more back and forth words that should be made via personal messages. This forum is not the place for it. It doesn't matter who starts it- neither stops it. All other posts get overshadowed by it. So before it carries on any further...