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i was wondering the other day about islamic/arabic culture, and vampires. is anyone aware of any vampire legends or lore associated with these peoples?
this can be any thing that might be compared to what western europeans think of as vampires (demons and such).
thoughts?
~W~

Ooh that might be a tough call LW considering that any consumption of blood is a no no in that culture.But it will certainly be interesting to find out.
Interesting thread .

You might start with the holiday of masks.I cannot really say,but this might put you on the track of what you are looking for.

yeah...i had forgotten that blood isnt kosher for them. but that said, i was talking about "the bad guys" ...ghosties and goolies and long legged beasties...

i thought they might have some sort of desert spirit that might fit the mold.

also is there an islamic version of lilith?

~W~

You know,when I thought about it,just our culture would be vampiric to them I guess.
And Im not sure about Lilith..but I will be happy to look around fpor something.

So far LW,I keep tracking back to Cain and the land of Nod.They are saying that in the City he built Vampires and people co existed peacefully.Will keep looking..

would Sir be referring to sekhmet?

Interesting,I never thought of the Warrior cat goddess to be related to vampires.Wheres the connection?

Or I should say the Lionheaded warrior Goddess .Other than the whole blood lust aspect,you see a connection to vampires?

I am a little confused actually with the mention of Sekhmet as far as Islam because Egypt was not Islamic until around 600 AD or something like that?

Maybe the Albanian Liogat ? Albania had a ppretty widespread Islamic population at one point.TJ,your post did make me remember something in that in light of Islam's ' view of women,we might be considered vampires.

This thread is very unwise my Muslim friend tells me it could fire another jihad. I think the Ghia has enough surprises without religious zealots getting fired up.

there is some demons and djinn that do drink blood in the older mythos from the fertile crescent area of the world.

also the early stories of lillith come from this area. (before her ties to the bible)

I was reading about that too Thebatt.There are quite a few reffs. to the Djin.And to Caine.
You know AN,why would this fire up another Jihad? No one has said one bad thing about Islam here.We are looking for Demons and Vampires,in the culture,not dissecting the religion.Believe me,there are far worse things being said other places and not by us.. the Jihad is already going on.That started YEARS ago.

tell your friend to go watch team america! LOL
i actually do try to be equally respectful to all beliefs as my own are a bit out there as well.

as for sekhmet, the connection with vampires is that she was called "the blood eater" and "mother of darkness".
she was known to track down certain individuals and drink their blood, and also almost destroyed human kind once....


that said, your right, not islamic. the purpose of this thread is to explore the myth and lore of the arabic cultures in general and moslems specifically.

yes, the bible says that cain went into the land of nod and took a wife and built a city there.
ever wonder who lived in the city?
~W~

I got chya about Sekhmet.But I am not going to pretend this is my forte' so please bare with my lack of education in this department.I had always heard that she slaughtered,but actually drank alcohol the colour of blood to sate herself as opposed to blood.But I see the connection in a round about way in light of what you have said.But I still lean more towards the gender aspect rather than bloodlust persey.
I do not really equate bloodlust for Vampirism, but more as a psychological Tactic to intimidate during wartime etc...At least at this point I do.
As for Cain..I do wonder now because from what I gather,the city he built was for Vampires and humans equally,where they lived peacefully with one another.Which in itself is interesting .
Then of course,he dissapears.

I was also checking into the pre Adamites but really havent found much there yet except a reff to a game which mentions Vampires and their relation to the Pre
Adamites.
Still looking around though...


There is the Nasnas which was an offspring of a demon called Shikk and a human.

what are the characteristics of this demon, and what source did you find it in?
~W~

At a glance, he is a shapeshifter and is part of Arabian Mythology.

I was looking under Babylonian mythology, Ancient Semitic religion and Iram of the Pillars so far.

might upset a jihadist??

im scared.. really.

Please.. tell them to bring it the hell on. They will get buried alive like all cowardly terrorists that come to this country. Or just have the piss bombed out of them. Either way, America is fighting multiple foreign wars and winning all of them. All because two morons decided to high-jack a plane. The last Jihadist attack blew up in their face big time. I don't think they are quite ready for another public embarrassment just yet. No offense.

Cain was not a vampire. Supposedly he was marked so everyone would know he was cast out. He was a betrayer and murderer. It is sort of like the concept of the Warlock in a coven. Warlock is not a male witch but the betrayer of the coven who is marked and generally cast out. The land of Nod is a metaphor for a nomadic lifestyle. Cain was a nomad for a long time and built many large cities aside from Sodom and Gomorrah. I believe much that was written was to slander him because he became successful and because of that, it is the real reason these two cities were destroyed but he had others. One of which was named after a son. He had a son named Enoch which was not the one mentioned in the book.

I think your best bet is with the Djinn. I have forgotten a lot I knew about them...belong to a few groups online devoted to them. They are a race unto themselves so they don't exactly fit into the ballpark of vampire but some might have been vampire-like.

Even though some won't want to hear this, a variant name for a vampire was ghoul. This is what you want to look for in Arabia.

"Ghul, Ghulah, Ghul of the waste, Grave-creature, coffin-fiend. Etymologically "Ghul" is a calamity, a panic fear; and the monster is evidently the embodied horror of the grave and the graveyard. It is sometimes confused with the Indian Vetala. The star Algol is also named after this creature from Arabian legend.

Ghouls have their origin in the Arabic/Persian/Indian tales of Alf Laylah wa Laylah - the Thousand Nights and a Night and in their root stories. The Arabian ghoul lures travelers into the desert wastes to slay and devour them, and also robs graves and feeds on the flesh of the dead, or on young children. As a result of this latter habit, the word ghoul is also used to refer to an ordinary human grave robber, or any individual who delights in the gruesome or morbid."

Now what one has to understand about the folklore is some will say these should not be confused with the vampire but if you read older writings they use this as a variant for the vampire. One should not take some of the names too seriously because there were numerous creatures that were either near to a vampire or a werewolf in their behavior.

"Sir Richard F. Burton, nineteenth century translator of the Nights, wrote some interesting foot notes on the subject

Arab. "Ghul," here an ogre, a cannibal. I cannot but regard the "Ghul of the waste" as an embodiment of the natural fear and horror which a man feels when he faces a really dangerous desert. As regards cannibalism, Al-Islam's religion of common sense freely allows it when necessary to save life, and unlike our mawkish modern sensibility never blames those who do.

Alimentis talibus usi
Produxere animos. ("Employing such food extend lives.")"


Here is why some say they are vampire-like aside from the obvious and some stories of vampires by the way state they are canabalistic. It varies from that to merely drinking blood or taking the soul/lifeforce.

"The ghoul is a nocturnal creature, and is repelled by sunlight and artificial light. Although neither cause them any real harm, their speed and strength can be drastically reduced when subjecting them to daylight, making them easier to destroy. Ghouls are highly susceptible to fire, and this is the best way to destroy these fiends. A ghoul can be burned and subsequently destroyed by concentrated acid or electrocution as well. Decapitation is also another effective way to destroy a ghoul."

So other than those called vampires out right the rest would be merely vampire-like.

Source of quotes: http://www.deardeath.com/ghouls.htm

wow azuredark, im impressed.
did that just pretty much give all the info that i asked for in the thread? LOL
~W~

I know of one; it is about a rich merchant named Abdul-Hassan, who married a woman named Nadilla. In short, she sold her soul to a demon, and became a vampire.
She was destroyed the conventional way, by a stake through the heart - in some versions she was also beheaded - and set on fire.

The story is set in the Middle Ages, in Baghdad.
Apparently, similar vampire stories have been circulating in Eastern Europe and the Middle East for quite some time.

isis
what is the source of the tale? is there a text i can find it?

there are certain individuals that seem to discount even lore of supernatural blood drinkers. this story is fascinating.
~W~

She probably said, "NO," or displeased her master in some way. Vampire, I doubt it. If she had been one, the story would be richer, and she would have gotten some destruction in before her demise. As such, it's probably a mere thread of a much richer tapestry woven to show the perfidious nature of women.

or maybe its just a legend that is a part of the area...

or perhaps its even a true story as unlikely as that might seem.

not every tale where the villain is female is the result of misogyny.

sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
~W~

Apparently only when Freud is smoking it. If his wife did the same, I'm sure it would be symbolic of some deep-seated desire on her part to destroy Freud's cigar.

Wow, this stuff is really interesting.. where did you guys learn this information? I'd like to read more as well.

Quite a cool thread you started here LordWolf! I've learned lots already (Azuredark is what I call 'scary smart').

My little contribution is a book I've been reading that refers to a group of vampires Alexander the Great encountered when he conquered Babylon. I haven't finished the book yet so I can't add much more about how he works this out but it's interesting.

Skarlet by Thomas Emson

There is one Arabic story where it is claimed a demon by the name of Sakhr deceived one of Solomon's wives into giving him a ring.The ring of Solomon.Since Sakhr had the ring,he then ruled in Solomon's stead for forty days ...or years according to some accounts, while Solomon wandered the country hungry and in poverty.As the story goes,eventually Sakhr threw the ring into the sea, where it was swallowed by a fish, caught by a fisherman, and served to Solomon. In punishment, Sakhr was made to build a great mosque for Solomon.

bm...lets face it, freud had issues.

oceanne...ive hard the story before...but when i heard it, it was a djinn. is a djinn and a demon the same thing?

justin...was that just a fictional story, or a legend you came across about alexander?

~W~

I am pretty sure one could equate the Dijin with a demon LW. Just as Satan could be equated with the Arabic Iblis..which would be considered a Dijin..or 'clingy soul" ..one born out of anger.

I apologise for the double post here but you might look at this LW..



Verses of the Koran and the Hadiths show unambiguously that the djinns were created of fire without smoke. According to Ibn ' Abbas, the expression "without smoke" means "end of the flame." Other scientists think that this expression means the purest of fires. What's important to know, quite simply, is that that the djinn were created of fire and therefore have a constitution completely different from ours.

The djinn were created before man. While the djinn were made of fire, man was made of clay and angels created of light.

In this way, the djinn are invisible. So if they are invisible how do we know they exist? Many things exist that our eyes do not see, but their effects are perceptible, such as the air and electrical current.

http://paranormal.about.com/od/demonsandexorcism/a/aa060506.htm





Of what I am reading of them they prefer to inhabit wastelands and the deep desert .I know there are Demons who inhabit other places besides the desert.I believe there are some differences in the Dijin and your dimestore demon.
But like you,LW,I am just learning about this myself,so I can only share with you what I find that might be of interest to you .

LW, the story itself is fictional. I poked around a bit and couldn't find anything about there being Babylonian 'vampires.' He was probably just taking 'literary license' with references to blood drinking cults in ancient Babylon.

oceanne...you rock...great research there.

as for babylonian vamps.
are they like eastern euro vamps or something else?

i dont doubt that something we might relate to as vamps held a place in their lore.

~W~

I actually have a book pertaining to your question. If anyone is interested, message me and I will dig the book out, and either print the book, and send you the pages, or I can type it to you.


Yes............I have no life.

thank you very much tima, i would be very intersted.
~W~

Wow.. that would be really great.. maybe you could type it up in your journal.. that way you will only have to do it once and then could copy paste from there.. but make sure you save your work every paragraph or so!! lol The worst thing about typing something long is hitting a button accidentally and deleting the whole thing!!

Typing it in my journal is a great idea. And of course I didn't think about it. LOL. I will find the book. I actually bought it at Barnes and Noble on clearance for 7.98.

I collect all kinds of Vampire - Witch - Warlock - Etc......Memorabilia. Interesting finds sometimes.

Okay...........I found my book. It is called 'From Dracula to Twilight. ' The Complete Guide to Vampire Mythology.

I swear I read something about Islamic history, and their version of the Vampire.

I do have the Hindu's version of what they thought the Vampire to look like, etc........Is anyone interested in that?

I could type it into my journal.

any info shared is good. personally i am seeking info about middle eastern/egyptian lore, but i love to find anything i can.

~W~

My book has tons on Egyptian lore~~~

LW,be sure to have a look at this article as it explains quite a bit as far as Islamic myth...

http://www.scribd.com/doc/23986191/Islamic-Myth

I really enjoyed the link, oceanne.

There is no mention of bloodsucking, although liver eating is given its own story.

The important thing to remember is that Mohammed could neither read nor write, and all his prophetic visions and teachings were from an oral tradition and very much from the Jewish, and to a lesser extent the christians. As always, the egyptian spin gets a retelling.

He's given credit for the koran, but I think that came long after he died.

The jinn come closest to vampires, but in the nephilim tradition.

Thanks Bloodmother.I agree with you about the Dijin in that so far,they resemble vampires in a Nephilim sortof way..There was one site I found that even gives us the different types of dijin.I need to round that back up and post it..

A lot of great info here - thanks, all!

I know that if there is more Islamic vampire lore out there, it would have sprung from earlier traditions, which is the norm. I'm still trying to find tales of the Islamic tradition that are also of the time, ie @ 700 AD - through the 19th century.

what ISIS101 said is exactly what i've always been told. My father is from Iraq and I was brought up a muslim, and always told the same story .

Very interesting, even more infuriating that last week the Iranian Minister has just lambasted the UK for being a Country of Chav Morons and semi-humans.

Now that's what I call rich, wait till I tell the Ayatollah...youv've got your own problems sunshine!

I think you're going to find hints of vampires, demons, and whatever all over the world. I don't understand how book of Nod fits into any of it considering that is an RPG type of thing isn't it?

i think that there will be the notion of vampirism everywhere you go just like some other people said on here. it may not be considered vampire from their culture, may be under another word, but if this is the case, would they not be considered even more evil or satanic because of the drinking of blood?

I don't understand how the drinking of blood is evil or even considered satanic. It is what gives us life. One has to respect it and by all means, i see nothing evil of such a liquid that only brings one life.

I think the 'evil' comes from the fact that drinking blood is considered a sin among Christians, Jews, and Muslims...probably in other religions as well.
Which is also kinda' wierd, as Catholics symbolically drink the Blood of Christ in the form of wine during Mass...

BTW,LW,I had meant to tell you of Līlīt and Līlītu who are disease-bearing wind spirits and have many similarites to Lilith.

The Book of Nod was created for a game but the Land of Nod comes from the Bible and it is a metaphor for a nomadic lifestyle. The Jews had many phrases like that but you learn about all that if you do deeper studies. I did because I have three ordinations but I don't quote verses...never good at memorizing, lol. Besides I am not exactly of that faith...complicated.

Here is some on Jinn (also spelled Djinn).

The Muslims, in general, believe in three different species of created intelligent beings; namely, Angels, who are created of light; Genii, who are created of fire; and Men, created of earth. The first species are called “Meláïkeh” (sing. “Melek”); the second, “Jinn” or “Ginn” (sing. “Jinnee” or “Ginnee”); the third, “Ins” (sing. “Insee”). Some hold that the Devils (Sheytáns) are of a species distinct from Angels and Jinn; but the more prevailing opinion, and that which rests on the highest authority, is that they are rebellious Jinn.

The species of Jinn is said to have been created some thousands of years before Adam. According to a tradition from the Prophet, this species consists of five orders or classes; namely, Jánn (who are the least powerful of all), Jinn, Sheytáns (or Devils), ’Efreets, and Márids. The last, it is added, are the most powerful; and the Jánn are transformed Jinn; like as certain apes and swine were transformed men (Kur-án 5:65). It must however, be remarked here, that the terms Jinn and Jánn are generally used indiscriminately, as names of the whole species (including the other orders above mentioned) whether good or bad; and that the former term is the more common. Also, that “Sheytán” is commonly used to signify any evil Jinnee. An ‘Efreet is a powerful evil Jinnee: a Márid, an evil Jinnee of the most powerful class. The Jinn (but generally speaking, evil ones) are called by the Persians “Deevs;” the most powerful evil, “Narahs” (which signifies “males,” though they are said to be males and females); the good Jinn, “Perees;” though this term more commonly applies to females.

This is from a file in a yahoo group I belong to concerning Jinn. By the way, Azuredark, Mollidew and SteelIndigo are the same person :) Can't give you a direct link because you won't have access but I took info from here.

http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/Jinn/

Exactly Molliedew.Cain was banished from Eden,went to the land of Nod(An area east of Eden) and he built a city,where he took his first wife.They had a son they named Enoch...
Now it is in this city that it has been suggested by some that People co existed with vampires.

Dietary prohibitions, including drinking blood, in the middle-east started with the Hebrews and had a reality-based health connection. Islam copied the dietary sanctions, and many other tenets of the Torah including circumcision. I'm not aware of any Christian rules against drinking blood. Interesting what each religion chooses to copy from a predecessor. More interesting how close those first two are. Even the mythic stories quoted here have similarities.

circumcision as well as many of the dietary restrictions may also have been taken by the hebrew people from egypt.
~W~

Any mythological/vampiric implications of circumcision, lw?

none that im aware of, but at least as far as the egytian beliefs are concerned, i have only just started my studies of them.
i wish to master the language of middle egypt first, and then look into it. many concepts just dont translate well from one language to another.
~W~

Since consuming blood is frowned upon in that culture.. then i would have to say that UNLESS there were rebels towards the culture (which could be a possibility) then i don't believe there were vampires from that culture.

Well but since vampires or vampiric creatures are traditionally supposed to be inherently evil, giving some malevolent entity the attribute of consuming blood, human blood in particular does in fact make sense.

ive found this thread to be interesting, but i think we have milked the possibilities dry.
see ya on the next thread!
~W~