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Why do people want to be perpetually mystified, and astonished?

Why does everything need to have some deeper meaning?

I think we're just wired that way, Dab.
We come from a long line of hairless apes who are easily impressed by the gods of wind and fire.

Because Dab, the humanoids need to believe there is more to this life than there really is.

Thus, the reason we have funerals instead of making tasty crackers out of their corpses.

If there isn't more out there, what's the point.

everything else is mundane. we're losing interest in doing things we dont enjoy, and aren't really seeing the benefits of working for things when other people get to slack off and get them. So we get mystified, scared, lovey, or other things. It's just self-medication to stave off boredom

Human beings need to feel they have a purpose to their lives. I guess the mystical fills the need for excitement we all have to a certain extent, it would become pretty boring if we never questioned or sought to find out if there was anything else out there. We are the only species to enjoy the abstract and mysticism comes under that umbrella does it not?

It becomes apparent many would have their mysteries, and yet still claim to others that they are all knowing.

Is it not all speculation?

dabbler, it's our innate hubris...we strive to comfort ourselves with the perception that something "greater" exists out there and that we are "special" enough to perceive it or experience it...

I can't help but think its because we are so desensitised to the world that we need something to make us think. We need something to make us go wow, and ponder its meaning.

We have computers who think for us, TV that drums crap into our heads, technology pretty much does everything for us. So maybe its boredom as well.

Wow ok so NOBODY in this thread has ever had a moment in time where they have came across something that left them in a state of being mystified? I'm quite shocked to hear that honestly. To those who have never had such a moment, would never know that all things around them have a deeper meaning. If you just look at a rock and say "oh that's just a rock", then you must have very dull lives. For a person who actually looks at a rock, thinks about it's purpose and meaning....actually gain more personal enlightenment than those that don't take that time. Just saying.

I have had my moments of being mystified ImmortalAngel, mostly at the stupidity or stupid acts of others. lol

I like to be confused or puzzled mentally because it isn't hard for me to be in that state of mind : )

Then there is also the pleasure of being able to decipher something that has eluded for a period of time.

Um...if a person is mystified by a rock, perhaps it is that person who leads a dull life...or perhaps just an uneducated life...

...just saying.

There is a great saying 'beauty is in the eye of the beholder'

Just saying lol

I didn't know this thread was about "beauty."

I find many rocks to be very beautiful, they just don't mystify me.

I can be intrigued by a rock, and find deeper understandings of the rocks nature. But perpetual mystification? No thank you, picture a deer caught in the head lights.

I can, and do get astonished over a Performing mentalist, who even though people know they are tricksters still baffle people in "what-ifin'"


In plenty of cases regarding alledged phenomena experiences it appear the person doesn't want their experience to be the source for astonishment, but themselves personally, how transparent, when they speal some vague fabrication of "Oh I was so weirded out.. " yet apparently they forget to remeber a single detail.

So no I am not easily mystified, or prone to perpetual astonishment, I like mysteries to be solved, I can admit when I am taken by an illusion.

No actually Zombie my life isn't dull at all. I'm just the type to contemplate everything around me and it's usefulness. That's more than i can say for certain people. :)

Contemplating..

vs ?


I often wonder what phenomena is practical for. Aside from mystifying people, and entertaining those who dwell so much upon such things.

Like for example,

"I saw a ghost."

So, what of it? What application is there to that?


More people want people to be astonished over them (the alleged witness to alleged phenomena) then they do the alleged phenomena.


So is Phenomena Novelty?

Is it an attempt to extract envy from the "Unexperienced."

Because I see support for that.

I also see people say, "Your just to afraid to accept that something exist that is unknown."


What leads a person to make such a transparent statement?


Another example is why when even after a previously accepted phenomena is debunked, do people insist people "keep and open mind". How "Open" can a mind be before it becomes a dust bin for hair balled vague rehashed material.

ImmortalAngel, contemplating and being mystified are two separate things.

Who's to say you can't get something more Mystified by contemplating?

I was about to mention that as well.

If i handed a person a glassy rock who never saw a glassy rock, and they worshipped the rock, they would be astonished, and mystified by the rock.

If I say the rock came from gods, then use it to start a fire.. ASTONIShing the people!

Those who study the rocks, and minerals no that from different areas come different rocks. They set out to demystify the rocks, while the mystified keep appeasing the messangers that brought the god blessing.

So you don't question maybe how that rock got there? Where it journeyed from? That it could have been stepped on by aliens? Sure it's just a rock. It's also just an example here....but maybe a child is mystified MORE by simple things than say, adults who have lost their imaginations or simply being able to ask questions like that.

Mystified overdone is stupefied. Why would anyone want to be perpetually stumped?

I notice most people assume that to have an air being mystified makes them deep, when in actuality they lack any personal depth, and tend to graft to "mystifying" concepts to bolster themselves, and their desired self image.


Imagination is a wonderful thing, and speculation is healthy, but being mystified is "short dope" and often an abused leisure one at that.

Sure, if I see a rock that interests me, I wonder where it might have come from, was it a piece of a bigger rock? And other such questions. But, I am not mystified by the rock itself.

To be mystified by a thing is to not understand it. Once you understand a thing, the mystery is gone.

Oh ok so basically what you're saying is that people who spend their lives, like Buddist Monks for example, have no personal depth and they are people who only want to come off as nothing more than being mystical because you feel they have no real answers to offer in life?

Just curious why you feel people who have to have a meaning in life are just kidding themselves here? Exactly who are you or anyone for that matter to say there isn't one?

Personally, I can accept my insignificance.

My true goal is to understand Life, and those that I encounter.
To learn what they would teach me, that I may apply it to my Life.


As for the Meaning of Life, Monty Python is most appealing to me so far, and yes I have sought, and traveled the paths of faith, and philosophy.

I add that I am Awed by the Vast Universe, sufficiently without being mystified by the many Ideologies, and Beliefs that are ascribed to it.

I take nature as it is, and still I am elated as a child when something new is discovered.


Yet mystified people are often to jaded for something so non-phenomenal.

..Because, if we are not mystified, then, there is not too much reasons to continue with our existence. we are humans and humans love to be "on" the spot.

first it does have to do with desensitization.

but i do find the posts amusing that say "because people need to believe that life is about more than it really is"

i enjoy people that know exactly what life is about...they must be almost godlike in their wisdom.
LOL
~W~

Markus,

To a degree I agree with you, a little "on the spot" time is healthy, but can easily become all a person wants, and before long they are a person who feels entitled to be amused by everyone, and everything, and then they want every one, and everything to be sympathetic to them.

Why do people want to be perpetually mystified, and astonished?

To be perpetually mystified indicates a desire to be purposely bewildered and confused without end. To be astonished is to be filled with sudden wonder or great surprise. Anyone can be astonished, usually at learning something new they did not expect...as a loving and dutiful wife may be astonished to find her husband in bed with her best friend or a child astonished to see his/her first shooting star in the night sky. To be astonished by anything is the spark that creates hunger for knowledge and to seek out an explanation.

However, to be perpetually mystified is more directly related to persons, uneducated and not following an approach of analytical reasoning would rather purposely bewilder and confuse themselves by an object or belief simply because they are gullible. I don't truly believe anyone would purposely be gullible as the root of gullibility is centered around being easily decieved or tricked and why, if not that those being tricked or decieved are not misinformed by disinformation but blind because of misplaced trust?

Why does everything need to have some deeper meaning?

To evolve ones thinking to ascertain deeper meanings is drive behind philosophy and Aesop's Fables. All things have a surface value percieved by our senses. Yet every object percieved physically has its own inner universe and is made up of particles not obtained through physicality.

I don't think there is a "need" to have deeper meanings to everything as much as the fact that our perceptions of deeper meanings is based upon our desire to know that which we want to know. This does not always include knowing a single thing in its entirety but often denotes that many are satisfied in knowing and believing certain things regarding any one particular object, person, place or thing.

...AS long as Vanity don't take over the situation.

"but i do find the posts amusing that say "because people need to believe that life is about more than it really is"

i enjoy people that know exactly what life is about...they must be almost godlike in their wisdom."


LW, no one is claiming to know what life is all about for everyone.

The reason I stated what I did was to make the point that too many people over-complicate life and thus are dis-satisfied when life doesn't astonish all of the time.

Keeping things simple and not over-complicating life would make life easier for most people.

Honestly, I believe it is mainly those who are constantly finding themselves bored with life. My grandfather always told me to never complain of boredom and I asked him why. He said, if you're bored with life, you're just a boring person.

The meaning of mystical and mystified is different. Some of it is upbringing and how it impacts the person, but a lot of it seems to be merely in the brain. It is similar to why does one person like a certain food and another hate it or like certain colors and others hate the very same thing. For some I think, being associated to the mystical makes them feel closer to whatever it is they believe on a spiritual level. Some want to understand these things and they make it their live's work to try and figure it all out either from the standpoint of an occultist or a scientist. Why? I think it is their experiences, personality and brain make-up.

This is a deep subject and I think it is presumptious to insinuate that some just live to be noticed because they believe certain things. It is a judgment call that is being made. I ask, why do certain people have to be so judgmental and pick everything apart? If someone doesn't believe in the mystical or why others do it is an individual thing and perhaps means there is a difference in their frontal lobe and other integral parts of the brain that react to such experiences normally, who knows. Researchers have been trying to understand this but I have to say, that scientists are obviously mystified by things as well or they wouldn't be trying to find the "god particle." Here is an excerpt from an article which you can read here about associated research:

http://www.dailygalaxy.com/my_weblog/2007/04/neurotheology_i.html

"Dr. Andrew Newberg, University of Pennsylvania neuroscientist and author of "Why We Believe What We Believe," is working on ways to track how the human brain processes religion and spirituality. It's all part of new field of study called neurotheology.

Why, for example, do we continue to be fascinated by God, religion, UFOs, conspiracy theories, and miracle cures, even when science can dispute many of these claims? Simply put: Why do we believe what we believe?

After spending his early medical career studying how the brain works in neurological and psychiatric conditions such as Alzheimer's and Parkinson's disease, depression and anxiety, Newberg took that brain-scanning technology and turned it toward the spiritual: Franciscan nuns, Tibetan Buddhists, and Pentecostal Christians speaking in tongues. His team members at the University of Pennsylvania were surprised by what they found.

"When we think of religious and spiritual beliefs and practices, we see a tremendous similarity across practices and across traditions."

The frontal lobe, the area right behind our foreheads, helps us focus our attention in prayer and meditation.The parietal lobe, located near the backs of our skulls, is the seat of our sensory information. Newberg says it's involved in that feeling of becoming part of something greater than oneself. The limbic system, nestled deep in the center, regulates our emotions and is responsible for feelings of awe and joy.

Newberg calls religion the great equalizer and points out that similar areas of the brain are affected during prayer and meditation. Newberg suggests that these brain scans may provide proof that our brains are built to believe in God. Echoing Jung, he says there may be universal features of the human mind that actually make it easier for us to believe in a higher power."

One of the commentors had this to say:

Another part of the work was the recording of the brain activity of dying persons. More than one hundred volunteers of an elderly hospital were examined in advance and questionnaired for their religious beliefs also. When they were up to die, their brain activity was recorded and the concerning images were reconstructed, finding characteristic sequences, like that reported by near-death-experiencers. There was almost always a tunnel experience, followed by some kind of judgement tribunal chaired by an old man, some kind of life film and afterwards a sequence showing a paradise garden, or alternatively hellfire, or a "black hole" before brain flatline. Interestingly, hellfire and black hole sequences seemed to be significantly increased for atheist volunteers, whereas the paradiese garden sequences were found more frequently for persons with strong religious beliefs.

from mysteries we can learn things. Not in a way that's so ethereal that it's so difficult to understand, but dvelop ourselves in a truly spiritual self. If we just exist, there's no growth in our spirits, and those people stagnate and mold, and for me that's not living.

MM2

Azure,
Scientist are capable of being Astonished, yet when faced with a mystery they tend to gathering data, and engage in comprehending the matter.

How we hear from True Believers, even after for example M. Lemar Keene announced he was duping people as a spiritualist , still insist he was a medium, and that he delivered messages to them from their loved ones.

When I see people desperate to make others as enthusiastic about something they saw that they determined to be phenomenal, I have personal studies that taught me how people relate (account) such things.

A person who has experienced something has a noted demeanor, and cadence when they relate something they truly witnessed. Something they had no idea what it was.

So a rigged effect triggers a sighting, and I listen to the accounts.

Then I compare that to fabricated stories.. that are obvious and I get a gauge, yet funny enough.. people who believe in psychics, don't (or opt not to) accept that deductive reasoning can see thru BS.

So I ask, what is the intent of someone fabricating a Mystical, or Phenomenal experience?

I suspect it has something to do with an inadequate personality being compensated for.


Vanity they name is fabrication.


What is tragic is that people who would like closer to actual anomalies they witnessed are lost in the shuffle, and skeptics are grated into cynicism.


Somethings are best shared in same minded company if one seeks only to testify, and not be subject to inquiries, something that BSers hate to be subject to.

I also don't understand how people expect others to be as jazzed about what they claim to have experienced. As we all know seeing is believing, so how does a person expect their often ambiguous, and vague testimony? Especially a third party version.

If a person takes the effort to develop a fair anecdote, I say throw in some details, like the atmosphere of the area.. how others reacted that may have shared the event.

Welcome questions, rather then scold people for being genuinely interested, otherwise it becomes obvious that you are spinning yarn, and want people to applaud you for being so blessed, gifted, or brave.

People are naturally inquisitive creatures Dab.
At the core of our being we are explorers, and inventors... the fact that we have the ability to see the awe in everything is what has made us the dominant species on the planet. The idea that we do have the ability to reason and rationalize information means that there are times when we can't or don't use those abilities. We literally are where we are because of what we are, and if you try to remove that you have to remove it all.

Take that away and mankind becomes... ZOMBIES??
Present company excluded. lol

We advance, and progress by solving mysteries, and accepting new frontiers. By discarding unproductive impractical concepts, or at least placing them in context. However so many who subscribe to phenomena resign everything to being "Unknowable", and "beyond understanding", they then carry on about how knowledgeable they are.



Yes we can be mystified by a stage production of a man sawing a woman in half, and restoring the halves to a whole but I for one won't be astonished, or mystified by someone swearing that they have witnessed an actual woman being sawed in half and reconnected.. unless they provide medical records, and verifiable witnesses.

I am astonished that people still get taken by old parlor tricks presented as mystic powers. So I am mystified why people still
sink billions into such things.

Excellently stated, dabs.

We are naturally mystified by things and phenomena we do not understand. However, it is how we then react to all such that separates the intelligent from the knowingly ignorant.

For those like you, dabs, and myself as well, such observed experiences cause us to ask why and to attempt to understand such, recognizing all such as explainable and comprehensible rather than unknowable and/or supernatural.

Unfortunately, there are far too many that are in the exact opposite camp: those who actually prefer to have any and all such phenomena remain unexplained and who purposefly do not seek to find understanding of all such.

I guess both are well encapsulated in the familiar oft-quoted quip by the late Senator Robert Kennedy: "Some men see things as they are and ask why, I dream of things that never were, and ask why not?”

And while, when first considered, Kennedy's pie-in-the-sky dreaming might seem praiseworthy... yet when seen by otherwise intelligent Human beings in the real world (such as ... here!)... one begins to understand what a superstitious curse of ignorance such a fantasy-driven mindset can become.

Frankly, we're seeing some of this "fantasyland-hits-the-real-world" political and economic fallout happening all around us as we see what extreme Liberal-dreamt-and-championed bailout funding and their healthcare nightmare is now just beginning to cause in our country. And... the Reality of trying to legislate into being their fantasyland of trying to so stupidly spend ourselves into prosperity is only hastening our economic downfall.

Understandably, Kennedy was... after all... a Liberal, too. ;)

The point is... if you base your worldview strictly on the cultivation and promotion of fantasies and "mysticisms" ... eventually Reality is gonna come along and slap you upside the head pretty good.


- Upir'

because we always find everything boring after a certain time... so we need to be entertain.

Dab for some it may be as simple as an addiction. Lets face it everyone has some hang up in their lives. To me its like looking at someone who has an adrenaline addiction. Its the wow factor. Its a type of rush. This of course is simply my opinion.

Everything can be interlinked if you look hard enough but that doesn't mean its meant to be interlinked, someone just might see it that way because they want to.

I think people need to be mystified because they have a need to go outside of their normal lives. It takes them away from their ordinary everyday lives, and it gives them hope. The only thing still left in Pandora's box btw.

As for everything needing to have a deeper meaning. I don't think everything has a deeper meaning, and I don't look for deeper meanings where I don't think it applies to the subject or situation. But sometimes I do look for deeper meanings when it comes to certain topics, like esoteric things or whatever. I think we need deeper meanings in some arenas because we don't want to think we lived a hard life for nothing,lol, but true.

I am just trying to understand the maining of life and our purpose of existing in the Universe. I think it's because humans are curious about nature, and we look for a deeper maining to reality, and trying to investigate and experiment with our conscoiusness to search for a deeper explaination to everything in the Universe and the world around us, and how everything came into existence. I always apply sceptism and scientific thinking to my theories in natural science and the supernatural.

We are the only 'animals' capable of abstract thought. It therefore stands to reason that we ponder, muse or question our existence, our experiences or our universe, does it not?

I agree, and that is why I am all about obtaining a deeper understanding of our universe, and world. On the surface is sufficient for me. It is as if you are not mystified you are boring, I strongly disagree with that. Sensational fizzle out, and tend to dull most non-phenomenal experiences in life.

to respond to the original question.. 'coz the majority of people need to validate their existence somehow .. and, the mere fact that they are, just isn't enough for them.

Scientists want to unlock the secrets of the Universe, because they want to gain a deeper understanding of creation. Having a deeper meaning to everything in the world is important, because it leads to new discoveries.

You crossed the two.. deeper understanding advances the race.

Why does every thing need a Deeper Meaning?

Because humans have questioned and expanded their understanding of everything further then what they already know, which is allowing humans to think outside the box. Humans have a high capacity of thought and reason, which has led to new advancements in science and technology. Humans have been mystified since the dawn of time, since they began to think and ponder about everything around them.

three ways of looking at this:

why would someone want to be mystified?
to seek illumination, learning, to be curious; aware of their place in the world.

why would someone want to? to sekk that higher being, that nmade them, as they can't deal with the possibility that this may all be one glorious accident.

why not appreciate how wonderful, a blade of grass actually is?

Alot of stuff is mundane and we tend to fall in the pattern of dwelling on our past and missing what is in store for us now. We hide all what is now do to the past and we do not have time to do the things we enjoy in life . Family is most important and familys do not even get together any more.
My children are most important

Magic 25,

What you speak of is a result of seeking a better understanding of the universe, and planet, it has nothing to do with "contemplating ones navel", Aka seeking some deeper meaning.

I think to many people take their beliefs far out of context, and miss the whole applicable purpose of faith, or belief.

Everyone wants to be shocked, or to affront others in a shocking way. it just gets so bland when all the testimony becomes so shallow.. if your going to relate a phenomenal experience, do so in a phenomenal way. If your going to fabricate a story, at least make it palatable.

People are stroking themselves in an attempt to out mystify each other.

Is being perpetually mystified healthy?

Angelus,

A blade of grass can be wonderful, because nature is so unique, but I would like to look deeper into the blade of grass at a cellular level to see it in more depth.

and that is deeper understanding, not deeper meaning.

perpetually saying ..

"We know nothing about {Insert New Age Anecdote}" is all false pursuit.

Why can't this be it?

This actual world is sufficient for some, and people will havbe to learn that some people don't find it practical to "keep an open mind" about things that bare no fruit, and do not advance our understanding of the universe.

Because all they want is to be dumbfounded and say..

"We just don't know." Blah Blah Blah..

**still scratching my head at someone saying it's all mundane**

mystified... ?

I am perpetually mystified, as to how people can say 'I'm bored.'

Is that cecause they see Life as mundane and without mystery, I wonder?

Humans could be mystified, because they want to explore their experiences and seek out some kind of enlightenment.

You know, when you see on the news that some chick has just fried her baby in a microwave, everything else is mundane.

Bored with life? Sorry, I just don't see the mystery in all things.

People all the time tell me to go stand next to the ocean. That it will make me contemplate things.

To me, that is so foolish. Why not just fill up a bath tub and stand and stare at the water. I've been to the ocean many times, I'm not impressed.

Your talking about being inspired.. which is not close to mystified.

You see an ocean as an ocean, nothing wrong with that.

I personally think people who declare themselves bored to others are selfish, and expect to be entertained as if they were royalty.

Such people need confetti, and whistles to pop out of everything they touch, or pay attention to.

Just look how easily the electronic gizmos are pushed after adding one new feature, everyone (the bored) buys the newest model that advertises that feature. Fascinated.. Dears in head lights. If enlightment is staring into a light source then I Opt out.

I'll be the one turned around looking at what is illuminated.

I think it might help the discussion if we can agree on what it means to be "mystified". Is there a single definition we can all agree on?

I see mystified as Castor Syrup, a dose is one thing, but too much, and watch out.

Thank you Mr. Thoth,


mys·ti·fy
   /ˈmɪstəˌfaɪ/ Show Spelled[mis-tuh-fahy] Show IPA
–verb (used with object), -fied, -fy·ing.
1.
to perplex (a person) by playing upon the person's credulity; bewilder purposely.
2.
to involve in mystery or obscurity.

I think that the need to be mystified, to find a deeper meaning in life to take the boredom out of daily living. Its a moment in life where we can find excitement and wonder like when we were children we can recapture that lost innocence for a short period of time.