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Profane
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23:31:18 Jul 10 2007
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Atlantis has incurred the thoughts of many, many intellectuals throughout the 2400 years it's been spoken of.

'Atlantis' is Greek for 'Atlas's Island'. It was first spoken of in 360 BC by the Ancient Greek Philosopher Plato in two of his Philosophical dialogues Timaeus and Critias.

It was said to be a simply huge island whose capital was broken into rings of land and sea.



It, the capital, was also said to hold the most significant engineering and architectural feats of its, Plato's and our own time. Simply Magnificent. It was held to be completely self-sufficient as well.

It, allegedly, was around in and throughout the years of 9400 BC.

It was said to lie past the Pillars of Hercules in the Strait of Gibraltar.



Its demise, as I am sure you all have heard of, was by sinking to the depths of the Atlantic Ocean triggered by an earthquake after Atlantis failed to conquer Athens, Greece.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Some say that Atlantis was a clever story used to metaphorically display Plato's idea of Politics.

Others discussed the possibility of a Genuine Atlantis Island. This idea was one of Conjecture from the time of Plato up until the Fall of Rome. The story's popularity saw a sharp decline during the Dark Ages and was picked up again and mused upon more thoroughly when the Enlightenment and Renaissance swept through Europe.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

My Ideas:

If I were to attack this myth, head on, I'd first look at the possibility of Atlantis being an island at all. In Plato's specifics, it was said to be past the Strait of Gibraltar--just South of Spain--in 9400 BC.

How are islands made? Especially islands of the size and magnitude Plato spoke of?

Volcanoes. Volcanic Activity is the only thing that could be responsible for an island of such a grand scale. So I looked up Fault lines in the area of Gibraltar:



If you look just above Africa and South of Europe, you'll see a Fault line stretching from the Arabian Plate to the Caribbean Plate.

With that said and looked at, I'd say that it is and was possible for an island that large to be in that location. This would also support the idea of the earthquake that sank Atlantis into the ocean "in a single day and night of misfortune"(Plato).

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

There is my two cents...Do with them whatever you please. Look into Atlantis more, see what you can find.

Discuss the existence of Atlantis. Do you think it could have been there? Do you think its story is true? Discuss.



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Cerberos69
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23:45:02 Jul 10 2007
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it is very possible that it was here once. if it was on a fault then a large enough earthquake could have sunk it. or a volcano could have blown it up. i like the fualt idea. (gives me hope for california)



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Trivia
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23:47:23 Jul 10 2007
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Your post is FANTASTIC. Your research is solid. Excellent work...

Being a science teacher I saw where you were going immediately with the tectonic plates. What a refreshing and excellent idea.

I believe that Atlantis existed. An idea to support your volcano theory...look what happened in Herculeum and Pompeii. The cities were destroyed quickly by volcano.



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WynterMourn
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00:01:25 Jul 11 2007
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I do believe Atlantis was a reality. It makes sense there that it could have been done in by either a massive earthquake or volcanic activity. It seems though, that it should have been easier to unearth than it has been.



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Cerberos69
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00:57:18 Jul 11 2007
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as for finding it ,, if there was such a force to destroy it couldnt it be buried reall deep? we havent explored but a fraction of the ocean.



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Profane
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01:03:33 Jul 11 2007
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Yes Trivia, Pompeii and Herculaneum were destroyed by a Volcano, Mount Vesuvius in fact, but they were not destroyed akin to what Plato seemed to be getting at. They were more over bombarded with fragments of earth and ash, effectively being buried in this debris. Plato specifically describes Atlantis's destruction being the sole effect of the island, as a whole, being sunken into the ocean in which it rested.

If I may, I am going to present a few more tid-bits of information on Plato and his myth of Atlantis as gotten from both of his dialogues. Let these facts mold your own opinion of Atlantis's supposed existence:

-Plato believed excessively in the use of fictional stories to mold an imaginative and adventurous child. An excerpt from his increasingly famous Republic, his idea of a perfect society and governance at the time:

"In this education, you would include stories, would you not? These are of two kinds, true stories and fiction. Our education must use both and start with fiction ... And the first step, as you know, is always what matters most, particularly when dealing with those who are so young and tender. That is the time when they are easily moulded and when any impression we choose leaves a permanent mark"(Republic 376).

-Plato was an Athenian by Birth, Life, and Death

-Plato made Atlantis disappear after the mythical land waged a war against his beloved city-state of Athens

-This disappearing act of Atlantis was one of catastrophic proportions, sinking into the Atlantic over the course of one night--Fitting for someone that which dares go up against his home city-state

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

And to you, Cerberos69, we haven't explored the ocean floor basically at all, you are right. But we have sent our nifty little sound waves down there and topographically mapped the entire earth's surface, above and below water.

A plateau--which is what I'd imagine the remaining parts of Atlantis would look like after 11,000 years-- of such a large magnitude on the ocean floor would have turned heads, undoubtedly.


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Aoibheal
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01:05:46 Jul 11 2007
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I too believe Atlantis actually existed. Even though many try to convince themselves it was nothing more than a myth, there seems to be more and more evidence to support the facts of Atlantis being a productive culture.

And the theory of an earthquake or volcano eruption being the force of destruction is gaining respect among many.


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kiwiking03
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01:12:45 Jul 11 2007
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I hitnk that it may have existed, but so far there isnt enough evidence to support it. they have found lots of ruins that could have been, but nothing definitive.. I hope they do find it, it would be awsome to know the truth



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Profane
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01:24:21 Jul 11 2007
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Aoibheal, what is the mounting evidence comprised of? I'm very interested.

Plato, himself, did state that it was an earthquake that plunged the Island into the sea.


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Profane
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03:56:22 Jul 11 2007
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~Runs in and Hugs Sevenn~

Thank You =]

She's right =] Greece was still basically unheard of at this point. Egypt, Mesopotamia, and Canada were really the only places on the globe being developed at this point in time. Even then, cities were barely even heard of yet, there was one or two in the Middle-East though, most prominently Jericho.

Athens as well as almost all Hellenistic society didn't start until around 1300-1000 BC. Some 8000 years after Atlantis supposedly sunk.

Sevenn's point that neither Greece nor Egypt had anything recorded on Atlantis is a major point, however insignificant it may seem. Nearly all ancient civilizations only sought to preserve won battles in writing. If Egypt, Greece, or any other society from the antiquity were to win a battle, it'd be the talk of the century, it's be brandished everywhere, people would be named after them and everything. But, if one were to lose a battle, you'd never hear of it. NEVER. Egypt was especially gifted in omitting embarrassing history from ancient runes, walls, edifices, etc.

It has been projected that Plato did base this myth of Atlantis off of either the stories of the Trojan War or the Thera Eruption. The Thera Eruption is the largest volcanic eruption in recorded human history. With it, the island that held it was completely obliterated and the Minoan town, those that Sevenn described, were also completely demolished. And was quite able to be manipulated into a story by Plato, as it was for the Exodus, in the bible, and many other collections of stories.

By the way Sevenn....This event only contributed to the demise of the Minoans. It was the only volcanic eruption to contribute as well. All of the towns on Thera were destroyed and only the Eastern half of the island of Minoan Crete was affected by the ash and debris because of the wind patterns. The Minoans still had most of Crete to work with for another 200 years when they finally fell. ~tear~

Also, I am not contradicting myself in my post made in response to Trivia. I still believe if Atlantis were to have sincerely been there, it would have been washed away...not Exploded. =P


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CryingMist
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04:12:32 Jul 11 2007
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I know this is pusshing it, but when I was young(yeah I am old lol) in our physic class, our teacher say there was an hypotesus that the Atlantis poeple might have discover the nuclear reaction and destroyed themselve by their own power, and hand. Jus tan hypothesus from my science physic teacher, I think it would be possible and would explain alot.



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BellaEternity
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05:41:13 Jul 11 2007
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Plato speaks of Atlantis as large Island
(assumed) to lie west of the Straight of
Gibralter and to have been destroyed
and submerged by an earhquake. Has
anyone voiced it may have been hit
by a major storm ( hurricane) . Is storms
in that matter possiable in that area?
Islands have been known to sumerge
for that reason. My self the one I belive
is earthquake, but hey ya never know.



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temptation101
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07:34:54 Jul 11 2007
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I believe that Atlantis existed as well. I think that the theory of an earthquake is very possible. I have seen a few documentaries about a volcano eruption, on the west coast of Africa, so large that it could wipe out the eastern side of the United States. It could cause a tidal wave so large that it would devastate the east side if the USA.
So I definately believe that it is a possibility for an earthquake to open up the fault and swallow Atlantis. There are many theories out there about what happened or if it really existed. I believe if there is a story about, then it was more than likely real.



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goodgirl17
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09:28:01 Jul 11 2007
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I have always been intrested in atlantis and i belive and have always belived that it did exist. I love your fault line idea, i will look more into this.



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RavenKnight
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09:32:03 Jul 11 2007
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I belive it was here, and i belive it was destroyed by earthquake, volcanic activity or some other natural disaster, and one day i belive it will be discovered...



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LordFangor
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14:26:49 Jul 11 2007
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"Way down below the ocean where I want to be" - Donovan -"Atlantis"



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artemka
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14:32:15 Jul 11 2007
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I haven't enough time left to read this whole thread but please, please, please put all that together as a members article :)



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cadrewolf
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16:34:32 Jul 11 2007
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Like the others I too believe the island of Atlantis did exist, yet there is no know truth besides Platos calling of this island. much like the spear of destiny and the cup of christ these are yet to be discovered or proved. but the thread started gave good insight of this legend. very good explaination of all.



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Cinnamon
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23:17:59 Jul 11 2007
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Honestly, the only thing that I knew about Atlantis was that is was an underwater city. *hides* I know. It's so childish, but seriously. I've only ever heard the mystical side of this story. It was very intriguing to see it from another point of view. I have a question though? How did it evolve into such a mystical story--with mer-people and what not? How did it get out of hand? Or did it? Was it always a tall tale???


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Carvall
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00:02:35 Jul 12 2007
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I wish I had a science teacher like yours Cryingmoon...........mine was more interested in that which could be proven scientifically lol
I think it was a nice story nothing more.



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mtsoul77
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01:41:34 Jul 12 2007
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I believe that Atlantis existed, and also that it will be found.



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VampiressWarrior
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02:13:22 Jul 12 2007
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personally i would say that anything can be real or true if you believe it is
that is the only way it works is if you believe in it
but yes i think that there used to be a time and place where there was technology and medician beyond anything we have now or will discover later on



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Crimsonwolf
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02:18:28 Jul 12 2007
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awesome post well thought out and researched ..... I beleive it exists and one day will be discovered



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carlton999
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06:04:19 Jul 12 2007
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based on all of the information gathered, i believe Atlantis to be Cuba. on the southern part of the island it is said to once have been land where there is now water. they are exploring the bay to find evidence of Atlantis.

based on all of the stories of Atlantis and its geography, Cuba is the most likely place.



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xxKagexx
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06:16:35 Jul 12 2007
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I don't see why not. I mean, if you think about it, millions (or possibly thousands or hundreds) of years from now, Florida may become a modern day "Atlantis". Some scientists have said that it may be sinking. Could you imagine Florida becoming a "great legend" or a "tale of mystery"? lmao. Sorry. It's just funny for me to think about.



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Profane
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06:29:56 Jul 12 2007
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Carlton999, if you wouldn't mind, please point out the evidence you saw in this thread or of your own reckoning that led you to the conclusion that Atlantis was and is the Southern, sunken, tip of Cuba.


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carlton999
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06:39:49 Jul 12 2007
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there are numerous shows about Atlantis. National Geographic, Discovery, History Channel, and Sci Fi channel. these are stations that show most of the Documentaries about Atlantis. the Cuba Theory is relatively new but makes the most sense.

unless you believe in the "mantle slip" theory and Atlantis is Anartica.



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Profane
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06:50:17 Jul 12 2007
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Well, I'm not going to flat-out deny that theory's possibility, but, to me, it seems pretty outlandish.

The main problem I see with this theory is that the Greek would have then had to come in contact with someone who's seen Cuba.

This Southern Tip of Cuba may very well have had some similarities with the Atlantis myth Plato wrote of, but how in the blazes could the Greek have known of an island more than 5,600 miles away? Mind you, this trip to Cuba would be there and back as well, making the grand total distance well above 11,200 miles.


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carlton999
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07:01:28 Jul 12 2007
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your forgetting.............the people of Atlantis were technology way ahead of the rest of the world. they left there influence on the entire world as well as colonized it.

traveling from Cuba to Greece would have been a hop skip and a jump away. i have kept up on all of the theories of Atlantis for the last 30 years. make sure that you know everything before dismissing something that you know nothing about.



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ShaolinWicca
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07:05:24 Jul 12 2007
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I believe Antactica is Atlantis. There is much evidence to back this up.



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Profane
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07:11:44 Jul 12 2007
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Carlton999-

"make sure that you know everything before dismissing something that you know nothing about." This insinuates that you do know everything O.O Cool. Can I have your autograph?

Now, even if you knew all of their theories.....~Ahem~ They are still theories.

Also, Atlantis was technologically ahead of all the rest of the world 8000 years after it sunk into the Atlantic? Enough still to get all of the information of their own demise to Plato for him to write about? That's some act of God, wouldn't you agree?

Or, or were they Time Travelers too!?

And, as for you following these theories so closely for the last 30 years....I am sincerely sorry...


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Whipped
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08:32:32 Jul 12 2007
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I also feel it did exist and I agree there are alot of Theories, on this subject of Atlantis. yet I do believe that if we actually go deep enough we would find it, I think that would be the mother of all Mother loads LOL! to actually find it one day. I would love to be there.

I have always found it fasinating, and wish I had the money to sponsor the search for such a wonderful place, that has been talked about for so many years.



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NickV616
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15:23:37 Jul 12 2007
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i'm at a loss between whether it existed or not. There are so many theories that are completly possible, but at the same time i would think that with modern technology we would have found it by now. I still like to think that it exists.



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twilightsmile
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15:26:00 Jul 12 2007
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Very awesome post Vain. Atlantis is one of the greater mysteries of this world. I wish I did know what truely happened, and more about it. I always thought, that when the world start to shift around that Atlantis sank to the bottom of the ocean, where it lies in the deepest, darkest depths. But that is just my opinion.


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AngelInHell
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15:26:28 Jul 12 2007
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well I love this post because I do believe that Atlantis did exist and wish that we could find it, maybe we just need to go deeper on our search for it. Would love to be there when it is ever discovered.

Thanks for all the info, very interesting.



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Priss
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I for one DO NOT believe that Atlantis existed...not knocking the thread or anything...I think you did a great job researching your material AND you even put up some nice pix too...they're a bit archaic but hey...they serve their purpose...right?...

I think the "idea" of Atlantis was contrived by philosphers...maybe to use as a teaching tool...who really knows...I have not seen enough actual scientific material from the varying theories to make me think otherwise...I have seen numerous documentaries on findings and "new" evidence that Atlantis "may" have existed...I still think it's a pretty story though...

Good job on the thread Vain...:)



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sportsfan
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17:56:09 Jul 12 2007
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I do believe Atlantis was a reality. It makes sense there that it could have been done in by either a massive earthquake or volcanic activity. It seems though, that it should have been easier to unearth than it has been.



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artemka
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This is an awesome thread.

I know you have said that Plato told that Atlantis sunk and wasn't blown apart by a volcano, I am sure that an island of Krakatoa was blown away by a volcano

It's location, I don't know - there is no other land on any major fault lines (because they move I guess) and Atlantis would have taken a few years to develop, I think the fault lines would have prevented a stable island from ever forming long enough to become anyone's home.

I'm not sure about that because me and geography really really don't get on

Someone mentioned there is growing evidence that Atlantis was Antarctica but didn't say what this evidence was. I thought the Atlantis people were strong and healthy people always shown as bare chested .... they must have been freezing.

I have never heard of a vampire from Atlantis as mentioned, again the source of this information would be nice

again, an awesome thread, thank you



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Profane
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19:16:33 Jul 12 2007
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Artemka-

It is entirely possible for human activity to develop on fault lines, even on islands. Seismic activity--earthquakes and such-- may only occur on a drastic scale every few hundred years, or even longer. Japan is a good example of this, there are 3 fault lines associated with the island nation, but life continues there as normal...aside from the minor earthquakes and tremors.

And, you are right, it would have taken an island the size Plato describes Atlantis to be a few thousand years, maybe more, to be developed by cooling lava and magma.

And, if you are going with the Atlantis-is-Antarctica theory, Atlantis would have had to move to where Antarctica is, thus it's disappearance. This movement would have been a part of a Mantle Slip, where the whole of Earth's crust becomes detached from the gooey magma under it and then slips and slides over top of that magma. If there was a Mantle Slip at any point in Earth's History, it would have been something like 530,000 million years ago. Not within Atlantian....or even Human existence. (That number of years is gotten from the fossil records concerned with those periods)

Now, concerning vampires, Atlantis has been confused with the small circular, Greek, archipelago of the Southern Aegean Sea, a bit North of Thera and Crete, mentioned in an above post. Santorini is famous for it's myth and lore of vampires. lol I suppose I'll leave the rest of that to another thread.


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Deadlyviper
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In Plato's account, Atlantis, lying "beyond the pillars of Heracles", was a naval power that conquered many parts of western Europe and Africa, over 9,000 years before Plato's own time — approximately 9400 BC. After a failed attempt to invade Athens, Atlantis sank into the ocean "in a single day and night of misfortune".

As a story embedded in Plato's dialogues, Atlantis is generally seen as a myth created by Plato to illustrate his political theories. Although the function of the story of Atlantis seems clear to most scholars, they dispute whether and how much Plato's account was inspired by older traditions. Some scholars argue Plato drew upon memories of past events such as the Thera eruption or the Trojan War, while others insist that he took inspiration of contemporary events like the destruction of Helike in 373 BC or the failed Athenian invasion of Sicily in 415–413 BC.

The possible existence of a genuine Atlantis was actively discussed throughout the classical antiquity, but it was usually rejected and occasionally parodied. While basically unknown during the Middle Ages, the story of Atlantis was rediscovered by Humanists at the very beginning of modern times. Plato's description inspired the utopian works of several Renaissance writers, like Francis Bacon's "New Atlantis". To this day, Atlantis inspires today's literature, from science fiction to comic books and movies, its name having become a byword for any and all supposed prehistoric but advanced (and lost) civilizations.

( Taken from wikipeda)

Based on the infomation, I believe atlantis did exsist, but i dont think there was civilisation on the island. It`s more of a mythology now, i believe some aspects of atlantis are true but various other points seem rather exaggerated.


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titangoddess
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20:16:32 Jul 12 2007
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I would love for someone to find it in my lifetime, but I do not think that will happen. Now, if it does exist, I am sure that we will create something that will admit toxic gases into our atmosphere that will find it for us because we can't ever get enough of finding the truth.

Humans are so engrossed with finding where they came from and how they got there to not try to break every myth and legend known to man. Who knows, maybe one of them holds truths. But Plato told/wrote a story of this island that was destroyed many hundreds of years before his own birth. He was passed along this information, if I am correct. It is said he told this information to others as a warning of belief in pagan (false) gods. Although Plato was a man upon men, he was biased like all who have used religion and education together. It is possible to have an entire world believe a lie if that lie can't be proved.



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Fizbop
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03:43:37 Jul 13 2007
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I found an intresting theory on this subject thanks to Wikipedia. The theory of a continental Drift.

Based on this information. I can theorize that after the great war erupted between Atalantis and another empire. That the gods got upset for some reason.

Causing massive flooding and earthquakes. Now here comes the theory. The earthquakes caused the plates of the island to go under a bigger continent, Perhaps Spain, or even a slight possbility Africa. Or even the extreme possibility of america where some have believed it was closer too.

So to close my theory. That it sank but it isn't on the sea floor it's under another continent.



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poesraven
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03:56:11 Jul 13 2007
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i think it may have been crete. wrong time though, i think.



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Carvall
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17:46:01 Jul 13 2007
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Symbolism as a tool for teaching has been around for a very long time.

I wonder if Plato is laughing his socks off at us wondering about Atlantis.



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athurius0532
athurius0532
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Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

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Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
04:54:45 Jul 14 2007
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my intelect tells me that it is posible that it was a island in the mettiterranian between sicily and crete. there has been several places in that area that was wiped out due to earthquakes and pompii was one of the ones most often referred to. thats where i would start my search based on fact and philosiphy. but everyone has a opinion.



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BloodxXxOverDose
BloodxXxOverDose

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09:01:57 Jul 15 2007
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atalntis-it is a great possibility that it did exist although vastly it is still greatly is a mystery and yet so much to be discovered but we can only learn from what others have written about



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Profane
Profane

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18:51:53 Jul 16 2007
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~Releases a giant sneeze that blows the entire Atlantis Thread to the top of the Forum~


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XxImhotepxX
XxImhotepxX
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Member of Legion (Coven)
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19:30:39 Jul 16 2007
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Great research ! I do believe Atlantis existed . when every single culture that supposely didn't interact with one another all have a very strong and valid reference to it . I start questioning things . It I believe it was both a real place and based off of Platos politcal ideas .



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• • • • THIS THREAD IS CLOSED • • • •
•  Closed by Vain on Jul 19 2007  •

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