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i got this from watching the matrix and it does make a good point.

do u belive that choice really exsists, or is it just an ellusion, cause no matter what someone chooses to do, there is always going to be someone with more power telling them weather it is a good or a bad choice they make.

that is a hard choice to make in itself.

I belive that choice exists.

You can for example choose if you kill yourself or not. I know a bit of a drastic example, but one that lies in your hands.

Of course if you are locked up in a mental institution, where you are tied to bed, then you can be prevented from killing yourself.

So there are forces that can prevent you from doing what you chose, but the point is that, unless you were brainwashed, it was you who chose.

yeah i suppose choice does exsist but there is always going to be someone with more power either permitting or preventing u from carrying out what u choose to do.

just because you die are you relly dead.there will allways be someone trying to make them for you. wrong or not , others feel they are the best and you can't think for yourself

choosing not to choose is already a choice!
so choice exist about free will and fate, i think i already answered that...

there is almost always a choice in every thing. even in the worst situations it was a choice that put you there. i belive that no other person has the right to deem someones choice good or bad because it was there opinion and there judgement that made it happen. even if it had negitive effects on you that was there choice not yours. but everyones choices are there own. (sorry if i reapeated myself im kinda tired!)

I started a thread about Determinism a few weeks ago... and we all got confused and carried on asking the same questions. Its something you can't answer as it isn't a linear arguement; which will make this another interesting thread :-)

Choices does exist eventhough we are nearly always influenced actively or passively by others. We still have choice to do it as we want, and its just on us if we will be so powerful or so "crazy" to go for it even its very hard...cos some things are simplier some harder to reach...

Yeah, anyone interested in this topics should go to Echo's Determinism thread and bring it back. It had some very good points in it.

Freewill - RUSH

There are those who think that life
Has nothing left to chance,
A host of holy horrors
To direct our aimless dance

A planet of playthings
We dance on the strings
Of powers we cannot perceive
"The stars aren't aligned -
Or the gods are malign"
Blame is better to give than receive.

You can choose a ready guide
In some celestial voice.
If you choose not to decide
You still have made a choice
You can choose from phantom fears
And kindness that can kill;
I will choose a path that's clear-
I will choose free will

There are those who think that
They've been dealt a losing hand,
The cards were stacked against them-
They weren't born in Lotus-Land

All pre-ordained
A prisoner in chains
A victim of venomous fate
Kicked in the face
You can pray for a place
In heaven's unearthly estate

You can choose a ready guide
In some celestial voice.
If you choose not to decide
You still have made a choice
You can choose from phantom fears
And kindness that can kill;
I will choose a path that's clear-
I will choose free will

Each of us
A cell of awareness
Imperfect and incomplete
Genetic blends
With uncertain ends
On a fortune hunt
That's far too fleet

i believe everyone does have a choice but something must happen for them to be given a choice

every living thing that has mind has a choice(unlessed there is a force of somewhat holding them back).....we have a choice of religion for example, we can choose to be a worshiper of god or of satan, my point is that choice exist in everyone (even if your dead)

Thanks for the advertising there Obelisk, and as I remember you put some good arguments accross in there my dear :-) x

Well.. on the grand cosmic scale of life .. (being a smart ass) hehe

Well what if our choices are given to us. so we don't choose our choices so even still we are captured in a game like rats in a maze. No matter which path you choose, that path was built for you.
ARGH I don't really believe that but I wanted to say it...

everything we do in life we make a choice
no matter if some one else says if its good or bad ... only ourselves knows if its
good or bad,no one can know that but you... and in that is a choice...whether you let others say it is good or bad or you.

I think people almost always have a choice in things. You make choices every single day of your life no matter what happens.

i believe there is choice and if someone tells me whats a bad choice and whats a good i say its my life let me mess it up if i want to this is me not u so if u think u know whats best for me guess again i'm not you...and if they still tell me its a bad choice i say you know what this is my life so if u must be in it SHUT UP.. its up to me not you

But who or what provides you with those choices? And do they already know which choice you are going to choose. And if that is right, then are you really even making a choice since the outcome is already know by a higher being...

if there is a higher power deciding what choices to give us or directing us on a certain path then that applies a meaning of fate or destiny to choice.

choice is a symbol of free will, if there is such a power as destiny or fate leading us in a certain direction, then free will is also just an illusion.

choice determines fate, and if fate has already been determined then whatever you choose, is the right choice.

Choice? No, we dont have it. Whats meant to be will be no matter what we choose.

I think that choice is just an illusion, given to us to make us feel like we are the ones in control.

*applauds tigra* Great answer..... It may seem as though we have a choice, but who's to say that, that choice was already made for us? I believe in fate. It keeps me sane! ('ish)...

well im not one to belive in fate that much though i just let whatever happens happen i dont think of the reason behind it, i leave choice or reason up to whatever or whoever is makin things happen.

i do belive though that choice is an illusion, i agree totally with tigra.

Complicating

Until we are able to think and act for ourselves we do not have the power to choose. A child does not make the choice to go to school everyday, they are told to do so by an authority figure.(Parent/ Guardian)

Our lives are predestined, foretold already by the fates themselves. the path we follow though is not a single straight line. There will comes events where the path will fork off into two or more differnt directions. It is at these times in life do we make the decision to choose the path to follow. Though a higher power has guided us to this fork, the decision remains with us alone in what to do, in where to go.

Until we are able to think and act for ourselves we do not have the power to choose. A child does not make the choice to go to school everyday, they are told to do so by an authority figure.(Parent/ Guardian)

Our lives are predestined, foretold already by the fates themselves. the path we follow though is not a single straight line. There will comes events where the path will fork off into two or more differnt directions. It is at these times in life do we make the decision to choose the path to follow. Though a higher power has guided us to this fork, the decision remains with us alone in what to do, in where to go. Will you take the blue pill or the red one?

Well, I belive that all of us ALWAYS have a choice.
I don't belive in destiny and I can't imagine that someone/something controls my life. I couldn't bear that

i believe that no matter what choice u make weather people think its good or bad that ur going to have conquiences

What did you have for breakfast? That was a choice.

However. The big choices, the ones that matter, those are already pre-determined. If they were not, how could one fortell te future? Call it destiny, call it fate. My life, your life, the people from here to eternity, everything has been pre-determined. Written in stone. It is as the past, it cannot be changed. You may alter it for a second, but the end result is always the same.

there are always choices
but ultimately
everything leads to the same end
La Mort
is the great equalizer

hey life is full of choices. just maybe it really does exist like our dark sides in charm

to post or not to post
well post
so choice made

you can't really answer things like that

I'm still having a problem with this ketchup toast thing.