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Well we all have an angle and some are speaking from facts and logic, and some are pulling it from leftfield on crack.
I would like to address Karma to point out it is not three fold and to let you know I find it irritating to try to link the two like someone who eats with mouth open, no need and totally ignorant. lol


Karma is really Dharma a lesson to be learned, if you don’t learn from it, bad Karma.
The lesson could be stealing or killing, if you learn from it your ok even if you did steal or kill.

Three fold… amplification of mental imagery from the mind affecting time and space or dimensions returning amplified three times.

what is your view?

It never even occurred to me to connect the two. Physics and spirituality aside -- these topics are unrelated. To stretch -- one might apply karma as an act of not learning from a "rules of the craft" mistake and find they're on the threefold receiving end of things... but again, I said that's a stretch.

I do not believe in either of them. These are only for those who are guilty of what they do. If you feel that something is in due order then why feel guilty of it and why should you be punished.

HHW
So you don’t believe in supernatural forces?
Is that a satanic teaching?

No true Satanist is guilty for anything they do. They did it and that is that. If you dwell on the things you did or might do, that will bring you negative feedback from the supernatural world(s) if they do exist. So that kicks the 3 fold law out your window.

Now let's knock the karmic factor out down the stairs and right out the front door, shall we. If we were to sit here and pretend that if I do something good for someone, it will come back on me, that is hope. Another thing the true Satanist does not have. We have truth. The goods things that come to me are because I wanted them, not because I walked an old lady across the street or picked up a wallet and took it to the person or what ever. I could have taken the wallet and reaped my Karmic Reward right then and there, but didn't, because I can care less about someone else money. I don't give a rat's ass if I am placed in prison for taking the wallet either. Why? Because it was my choice. Responsibility to the Responsible.

It is possible there could be a connection. However from what I've heard the three fold law is what comes back at you for a certain magick cast. Karma being something that happens for something bad you do, normally seen by the Buddhist religion [or something].

Hell:
From a Satanists point of view, which I am not -- it seems you're in the a very finite space of black & white. Things either are or are not.

There are those that have something called "faith" and for them, it works and they feel it's been proven to work. Karma is part faith, part theory and, for some, a way of life. No reason to knock it.

The threefold law -- there, I am with you -- if you did something, you did it. You'll either get caught or not. You're guilt will wither drive you wacky or not. I don't believe in 3x3 or any such thing. It's like telling children stories about monsters that eat them if they don't be good.

if you believe in karma and you do harm to some yes it can come 3 times the fold

Karma is a word most often understood by those who have no concept of the original meaning, it was imported into the western world in the 1960s from Asian belief systems which permeated the thoughts of those looking for alternative theology. The concept found its way into witchcraft beliefs which were also imported in the 60s from the UK. This is not to say there are were no other witchcraft beliefs originating from other places, including the US, but the major contributers were the Gardnerarians and the Alexandrians at that time. The "threefold law," of witchcraft, that any spell you caste upon another shall return to you with 3x the impact, was added to give those who practiced witchcraft a morality clause so as to give a suggestion of how witches should behave, and give non witches the idea that witchcraft was a "right hand path" religion, so as not to fear them. This is nothing more than an adaptation of the "new age" definition of karma applied to the standards of neo witchcraft. However "And harm ye none, do as you will" was the original form of the morality clause, it was morphed into the 3x law by witches who wanted more definitive commandments to their religion.

I am wondering if karma and the three fold law was mistakenly joined together because of how karma is said to effect three parts of our life. Past, Present and Future!

Just so you know, my last response, it was a response to someone else.. i wouldn't have said it like that had no one said anything

Hi Demiana
Nice point you made, I just want to add some facts
I happen to know in the original teachings of Gardner and Alexander there is no mention of three fold.
It was transmuted from a student in notes and appeared in 1970 Raymond bucklands book.
And is mutating ….. I do understand a lot of wiccans use it as gospel … I just think it is making dogma where it is not needed.
It also has nothing to do with Karma lol

Blessed be

I fully believe that what goes around comes around. I have always thought that if you do something wrong to someone you'll have worse done to you. I've also always believed that if you wish something bad on someone, you'll have something bad happen to you.

I believe in Karma greatly!! I have no doubt that some of this life I live is based on Karma happenings.... if not all. Yes things happen for a reason...... and so does Karma.

I belevie in karma and agree that what you but out in the world bad or good willl come back to you

I believe Karma will come back at u for the bad stuff u do in life. But the 3 fold rule I know has to do with magic and if u cast a spell to cause harm then it will come back 3 fold

Honestly, if you want my opinion. I dont know what to think. I just believe that doing bad things will have bad consequences. Simple.

I have always believed in Karma as I feel it will come back and bite you in the but on day. I always think that if I dont something one day when I need help or whatever I wont get it.

I wish...there are tons of people who've done terrible things and never paid....

in nursing, it seems like the nicer the person is, the faster they die - the nasty ones - they live forever!

Praying is just as pointless as believing in karma and the 3 fold law. Why pray, get off your lazy ass and makes amends with those you did wrong, if you really feel guilty for it. If you did it for a reason, why fell guilty for it in the first place.

Think outside the box people.

The Buddist has a eight fold path...The Path of the Fourth Noble Truth: Right Understanding, Right Thinking, Right Speech, Right Attitude, Right Livelihood, Right Effort, Right Mindfulness, Right Concentration.

http://dharma.ncf.ca/faqs/glossary.html

In Wicca think if you hurt someone's feelings or you intentionally did someone bodily harm because you were angry at the them. Would it not hurt your heart, you would think about it feeling bad you did it...your mind. Which in turn would have a affect on you spirit of the body being sad.
So I agree with the three-fold law it can affect your mind body and your soul.

I agree what comes around goes around.

i do not believe in a three fold law.i choose to believe karma is a pattern we our born into to refine during our life.i follow no such limiting belief that always for my will to fall into anothers line of reasoning and deem my intent good or bad.however, i think it is more a code of conduct.. and a way to live your life with respect for self and others.

Well made point there as truly they both are rules of conduct.

I do not necessarily believe in either of them but have seen cases of where a person has treated someone badly and although they may have went years with nothing bad happening that eventually the wrong that they have done to someone has come back later to "bite them in the ass".

HHW

Has a good point, if you did it you did it for a reason, justified by yourself.
Those who place a controller like three fold , karma or gods always are judged by outside force.
Personally I don’t believe outside forces have my best interest at hand.

Well I never have thought about connecting the two because it just seemed stupid and doesn't make any sense at all.

i always thought the 3 fold was connected to wiccan teachings, you know, to stop practicioners from causing harm

sorry to double post, but, negative energies seem to follow bad people around, and brings them horrid luck, i know a few people like it, really kind of funny, huh

Three fold is a modern invention that got attached to the Wiccan movement and not very old. There are also some who speak of ten fold as well. Since I am a spiritualist and have been closely connected to those who espouse metaphysical views, my leanings are more in keeping with a modern view of karma. Many tend to lump them all together as New Age Thought. Essentially they are which people don't like to hear. This doesn't mean the ideas don't come from much older concepts. It just means that the views have been modernized to societal beliefs at this time.

Hinduism and some other faiths that have similar beliefs have had their viewpoints on karma infused into newer thought and not always represented in the same ways. As for most who speak of Satanism they are talking about LaVeyan most often but there are others. Just like Christianity has many flavors so does Satanism and they don't all believe the same nor that it deals with self. On this topic it can only go the direction of personal belief. I don't hold any of these beliefs at all but I have found through magickal practices that guilt plays an important part in what might return and kick you in the proverbial arse.

I belive that karma is real and that it comes back to you 10 times fold

My personal most recent experience with Karma was a few months ago when a co-worker with a drug problem stole my cell phone out of my coat in the break room. I realize that was a non-bright moment on my part, but I obviously thought I knew everyone enough to feel comfortable. I was extremely pissed, I was walking around everyone with the store phone calling my number to see who suddenly started ringing, and some managers would check later on too with their own personal cell phone. Everyone was upset over this, and I had one of the managers talk to me and calm me down. She said just wait, it will come back to them. And I did calm down because I knew freaking out wasn't going to fix anything. But sure enough, a few weeks later that girl got fired, over a pretty small incident, but the higher up manager that knew nothing of my cell phone going missing. I ended up working with that manager that calmed me down the next day and everyone was still talking about the girl that got fired like it was a tragedy. That manger looked at me and said "I told you!" and I was the only one that knew what she was talking about.

Now, in comparing personal property being stolen in relation to loosing your job.... I don't know if that breaks down to "three fold" or not...but it sure is a greatter strike to loose your job!

I believe Karma if used for good is fine, but if you use it badly that the saying is it will come back to you three folds. In my head that means bad luck three times over.

We can go on and on with the intellectual stuff,but I find there is no real need.
For every action,there is a reaction.Eye for an eye.

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