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Do you understand the difference between this religion and the actual practices of magick? Do you focus the currents of nature in your life to make your life better or do you suffer through when you other wise don't have to? Have you read or made attempt to work out for yourself the correspondence tables present in alot of the works that have been published since 1960?

Have you a working knowledge of the history of wicca since it inception by Crowley in the early part of the 20th centuary? Do you feel the advancements by authors such as Cunnigham, Buckland, Crowley, the Farrar's. Dion Fortune properly gauge the setting for a religion?

Would you feel that Silver Ravenwolf, and other like her have done justice to the ceremonies and the symbolism that was attempted to be formed into this erotic naturalistic path by the founders of this religion?

i found as someone said not so long ago it is a tourist trap for the road to ascension lol
nothing wrong with it just the amount of miss guided information from those who are jumping on a rather lucrative book selling thing ….
As for wiccans I love them … they have progressed forward in a most positive way blessed be

i do liek silverwolfs books but study mostly from cunningham and buckland

I like Silver Ravenwolf, i think her works & books on wicca is rather helpful...i've also read other books by other authors tho their books are good & explain things well i dont find then as helpful or as interesting as that of Silver Ravenwolf...I am however kind new to the whole wiccan religion tho i've looked at other religions and have been interested in wicca for at long its only been in the last year or so that i've really put myself in to it!

I waslucky a teacher of Wicca came into my life. For 4 years before her passing she taught me much then a book, but yet magic I am careful for what I put into the universe.

I think that , silver ravenwolf While a excellent writer , in some cases can be practical , but she does not give very thorough , emphasis on certain things, i think that , where the mystery truly lies is in side ones self, for that is were the battles are fought everyday, Personally i think that before one can examine religion one must first examine them self.

Before this turns into a "Silver" thread...she's not Wiccan folks.

Well, for one, Wicca is not a religion..

And furthermore, there are many different writers out there to study and learn from. The one wonderful thing about the wiccan path is there no correct one for each. There is no doctrine and there are no churches. One does not have to be in a coven to believe or practice, due to the fact that there are many many many solitary witches and wiccans out in this world, just like myself.

Wicca is indeed a recognized religion, even by the US government and Veteran affairs. I know, go figure. Buddhism was not a religion at one time too but "a way of life." Things change. There are also churches. Non-profits no less.

Wicca may be a recognized religion but it is more of a spiritual belief system or path than a organized religion. But to each their own.

I tend To not relye on what others write or say but to relye on what I feel and what I see. I am a Lone Practitioner and tend to read yes but I also tend to take it with a grain of salt and do what I feel is right...Its not all about reading and studing..Its about finding your own way and what You feel is the right way to train and studie in the arts of Magic and wicca...

Those who would categorise wicca or the purity of those who search for its wisdom are as worthless as wheels on a tomato... the know all nerds who profess that "this is this" and "that is that" should remember that this country was built on an idea... not a dictionary...

I agree with Uzziel its not for others to dictate how one should practice Magic or studie it. Its for the individgual to dictate Him or Herself. I myself have been practicing for quite some time Alone..And I have found that its with great care that I choose thoughs people to help me..Yes I have people that are helping me learn. But I do not go by books or other writings. I go by what I feal and what I know I can do..If I need help with smomething Like protection and don't understand how to do it ..Yes I will go find someone to teach me..But I do not relye on them for wisdom..

I read a little bit... and tried to practice from my learnings but it just didn't work for me. Ever since i've been practicing from my own experiences.

It is the thing i love about Wicca it isn't a completely organized religion... But maybe the findings of others will work for others. Depends upon the person in my opinion.

InfernalImage, to answer your question, yes I do understand the difference between the practices of magic and the religion part of Wicca. The trick of it is to be able to blend them successfully together so that they flow usefully through your life. Every obstacle does not warrant a spell to take care of it; sometimes sitting in quiet meditation while talking with the Goddess and God can let the answer come to you.

I have read several different versions of the correspondence tables and have studied them yet I find they do not resonate with me or my craft. I have read several of the writing of Crowley and admit he does not connect well with my current understanding of Wicca. While some of that may be due to the generational differences I think in the end he saw it as his link to the future. This in my opinion made him exaggerate his own importance. Or as Stabb666 pointed out it may have been his power trip.

Each of the other authors you named brought more information to the thirsty minds of those seeking it. Cunningham and the Farrars are still personal favorites of mine. In Ravenwolf’s earliest works I found some interesting and useful information but as she became more and more geared toward the teenagers I didn’t like the tone. It seemed to me to be encouraging an “us versus them” attitude pitting the teenagers against their parents or guardians. I saw no reason for this seemingly deliberate attempt to cause isolation and confusion for these kids. I stopped reading or recommending her work at that point.

Stabb666 also pointed out the current trend of conservatism towards sexuality in the craft. This is far different from the teachings of Crowley or Buckland. While some of the differences may be explained by the sexual revolution that was a big part of that era it does seem to point toward the conservatism being used to help Wicca “fit in” more among the worlds major religions today. I do support a greater acceptance, not only of Wicca but also of all the different religious beliefs of other people. But Wicca by it’s very nature seems to be a fluid type of faith and anyone declaring themselves an expert whose words must be heeded as fact is asking to have their foundation washed away. I enjoy much of Fox's work but accept no one as the master or leader of this religion called Wicca.

i find that when im seperated with nature and the elements that i am miserable and unhappy. i am a flower child and feel happier when i am on the go following the raod wherever it may take me.

Well I have got to say I was wiccan for years but i saw that all wicca was, is people going around making up stuff saying about the 3 fold law and I dont even believe in the 3 fold law because if you think it will happen then it will happen. If not then it will not. But that is the way i see it 100%.

Some people can get easily confused. You can use magic without being Wiccan.

I have got to agree. Wicca is wicca but witch craft is older then anything.

I didnt think you had to be any cretain thin to do witchcraft ????

Wicca and its kind are a path not a destination. It is a path of learning and not a formal set of dogma and doctrines.

It can take you far down the path to practical Magick but Magick is not the goal and end of Wicca.

Properly practiced it should be life affirming and joyful. It should not lead down the dark path of despair but up the lighted path of fulfillment.

I think the popular authors have by and large done a great service. Even though they may not have all the answers they do ask the questions and open the door to further discovery.

Since it is a path of enlightment I think it is only natural for a true student of the Craft to study its history and more especially it development and enrichment since the time of Crowley.

Often times the questions are more important than the answers.

What doors can I open for you?

hmm....wicca....the catholicism of the pagan world
After numerous books on open pagan ideals, and then reading some that were distinctly wicca...I see a trend towards the wiccan one being "religion" as in a church and control mindset, while general pagan books are more about faith than form
open more to personal interpretation
cunningham I think is a good writer in this regard...but sliver ravenwhatever is the absolute LAST writer I would recommend to anyone who asks me.

It’s odd , I like Cunningham too … but Cunningham is a name given to those who helped hunt witches in Devon England….. cunning folk was the name and pigs or ham is an insult … so cunningham is not good in the SW of England.
Just like smith or baker was based on your job…. Cunning folk helped dispose of witches and hunt them …
Funny old world

I believe that religion is a choice regardless of who "re-birthed" the religion. It is rather pointless to say more.

Wicca is indeed a recognized religion in some parts of the world but in the UK it is looked at as devil worship. most people at work dont understnad me and becuse i have the pentical around my neck people call me the devils girlfreind or some shit when im walking around with the pentical hanging out ..... why cant they teach it at school

I agree most people view us as devil worshippers. My group has a meeting once a month. This meeting is held in a public place. We even put out a sign as to who we are. When people read the sign they not only walk away from us but they practically run away

Ive read Buckland and Cunningham.. I think Buckland is stuck on him self but who am I to judge? Ive read a few other book but Im not sure who wrote them.. personialy when I read a informational book (like someone else said) I tend to take it with a grain of salt.. this is what they think or see when practicing.. this is what THEY feel when doing whatever.. this is what they think is right.. Im a different person.. I will see things differently..

I believe Wicca is a guideline to a life one CAN live.. being Wiccan is a choice, to live with nature.. I consider myself Wiccan but I have never done a spell, or cast a circle.. Im still learning.. and I perfer to keep it that way until I feel its time..

books are books... is what you feel that matters..

I dont read books on this subject i learn from practice and from what i learn from the other members of our group

I'm glad I came across this thread.I just starting to learn about being wiccan have learn from you guys,thanx for the info

As I sit here and read the posts in this thread a few things seem relatively clear the main one is that there is a lot of confusion in the air. Wicca, as a religion, has no true principals as everything was admittingly taken from other religions. Note the word "TAKEN". These beliefs that the wiccans hold so near and dear to their hearts were primarily taken from the celts. Second off a witch is a witch is a witch is a witch. Can you be a witch and not a wiccan? Well, of course you can. "Oh but I'm a male I'm a warlock not a witch." Warlock by definition is a witch who has been banished for betraying their group. Once again I say a wtch is a witch is a witch is a witch. That point being made I ask you this... How many of you condemn the christians for placing all their faith into one book while you read only certain authors picking pieces of what they have said out for your own belief structure? At least when they they look down upon you for your beliefs they will admit it. The only thing worse than that is to be an "ecclectic" if you are not sure what you are just say general pagan if you have formed your own belief structure from many different religions keep your theft of esoteric knowledge to yourself and please do not inflict it upon ofthers.

I use to pratice wicca, but it is just like all other religions, so now i practice spellcasting, candle magick, ect it is a lot better than following a bunch of rules, i guess i think of myself as a warlock or male witch instead of a wiccan...

I am wiccan but as a so called religion I consider myself a Pagan.

See , some say it is a religon and some say no......so what is what,,,???

i am very new to this i just resently started studying it and would like some help on which books are the best to learn from for someone just starting out in this.

i have no religion ...as a child i was baptised catholic .... i do not practice in any religion i am still tring to find my path
so i really dont know too much about religions

eternaldarkness1~
A couple of good authors on wicca are Scott Cunningham and Raymond Buckland thoes are good authors to learn about wicca from...

thanx Ravenknight i will check them out

I think religion is not really a word...Everyone has beliefs...and ideas..I believe it's just a frame of mind. But we have to put ourself in a catagory.

Remember the Wiccan Rede: "An it harm none, do what ye will." I take that, in part, to mean that after learning all you can, you must ultimately find your own path in practicing The Craft - as long as you "harm none." That's key!

I have realized, that after finding my chosen path in Wicca, my life has changed for the better. In the way I life day to day, night to night, the way I feel about myself and the way I see things in a different light. Being more of an Elemental type with Nature has such a refreshing experience and willingness to it for me. Also helps make it easier for me to gather chi and other energy that I require.

Actually Shamanism is older than the witchcraft or Wicca and I , as a solitary do some of all three.

Each walks their own path and none should say what is right or wrong.

This is where much strife comes from.
Accept it or deal with the self caused strife.

* smiles*

Be Well all.

Wicca, like Norse Mythology or Chaos Magick or Satanism or Christianity or Judaism or Atheism or Agnosticism, or any other "lifestyle," is viewed as a religion since it is a collective arrangements of thoughts about this life, the life afterwards, and usually including some notion about where we came from, which is all religion really consists of: lifestyle choices concerning the present, past, and future.

Personally, I think Silver Ravenwolf is overrated and full of bull. I've read solitary witch, teen witch, mindlight, to ride a silver broomstick, and to stir a magick cauldron: but I found little more than overprocessed stereotypes about magick and sorcery and angry, defensive passion likening to that of D. James Kenneday and Pat Robinson.

Your "lifestyle" is not to be taken quite so seriously (lest you fall off your reality in a bang), but certainly she could have done a little more research.

I think she has hurt the Wiccan image considerably and mostly singlehandly in the last 14 years. Wicca isn't my favorite paradigm, but I can at least stand it without all the love spells and "harm ye none" BS.

Disclaimer - I do not solely blame Ravenwhelp. She's just one of my least favorite. I understand a lot of authors and practitioners are probably responsible for the fluffbunny stereotype.

I am a witch i pratice witchcraft but to others its just easier to say that im wiccan because eather way they wont understand anyway

Many say that Wicca is a religion when it truly is not. It is more of a way of life with roots dating back to the days of the Celts. Back then it was called Druidism in its purest form.

my first question should be why its a big deal to anyone wheather other people think its a religion or not that completly defets the fact that whether as a path a realigion a set of ideals or any other way you could name it one of wiccas gratest values is not to argue or let yourself sway becuse of what others think. in fact this whole thread is going over itself in circles becuse of that fact.

hello everyone, i too practice wicca, in fact i have been amde an elder by the elders themselves, i have been practicing now for a good 10 years straight, i have fun with it myself, but when it is time to get serious i do what i have to do, the best part of it in my eyes is the reading, the more i know the wiser i become, does anyone feel the same way

Wicca is the old english word for witch. just so you know

I would have seen this thread forgotten about like the others that have passed away.

People here have not done their homework it seems of and on for the last few months Ive seen this thread linger.

Wicca itself has been turned into a religion. The path people forget is witchcraft, none of the fluffy bunny garbage that is spiewed by many. Its all a waist of time for having the children to stupid to seek out anything with substance. Its a good catch all. That is its ownly redeeming feature.

I know only from what I have read and researched, there are many different views and paths one could take on this subject but then again nothing is set in stone one way or another only