The Ultimate Vampire Resource and Directory

alot of people on here seam to be moaning about the amount of 'kids' on here i'd liek to ask them a efw questions

how old do you have to be not to be a kid??

imagine you are, say 13 and obsesed by vampires and every one in 'the real world' looks down on you for it and then you find some where were intrest in vampires in common place and you are shut out there as you are too young. also many people today are as mature mentaly as people who are say 20

I think you got a point.
People that bitch all the time about the 'kids' seem to forget that they were once kids too, and if they were kids now, they wouldn't like to feel pushed away because of the spelling, because of trying to get attention, all those things that seem to bother their so well achieved ages.
One of my favorite songs from Eric Clapton strats like this:
"Before you accuse me, take a look at your self..."
remember: No one turns 30 without first turning 13.
I know this for a fact because I'm 30 :P

As far as I know the site is for over 13 year olds,so it's normal to find teenagers on here.

I agree with you.I find nothing wrong.If teens want to join let them be why not?

It's not fair to judge by age.

I know of mature 14 year olds like immature of 30 years.

I guess for kids they referred to under 18 years of age.Yeah sure as if every over 18 year old is mature!

And in a way who are they to judge?They're not even administrators!

If this site was for over 18 years only or maybe 21 whatever, it would have been done in the system when joining in.

I make it a point to try to ignore age, but there are limits. If someone is young and they present themselves in a manner that shows they are here becauase they have an interest in vampires and can conduct themselves in a mature fashion, then great, but I've seen profiles where there was very little content, save the major use of foul language and the notation of how "they up in this house to do....." That is where I draw the line and look at them as children. I am here for the reason of expanding my knowledge, meeting cool people, and sharing my written works with the public at large. I try to accomodate everyone, but even I have limits to my patience. Kids or not, contribute something useful, be a positive member of this site, or don't waste the bandwith!

Well, have to agree with that too.

I gotta say as i'm usually not one to judge person on basis of how they look or age or stuff like that ,how they act is a representation of maybe how they were brought up or maybe even a lack of parental supervision..

Vampwriter and Tears both make valid points as does Synthetic.

Not all 13 y/o's are molded the same we each live in various environments and were brought up differently in our households .What might be good for one house, is not good for another!

It's a matter of varying degrees that makes us who we're are when we are young and as we get older.

Only thing that distinguishes us as an adult from a child, is the willingness to learn from ones mistakes and not repeat them over and over and understand whats right and wrong .....

I've encountered many a supposed adult who acted like a 13 y/o and vice versa :)So i would'nt really base maturity on just an age!

Lol and I didn't?

I see the level of maturity with behavior here is a bit difficult so mostly it's how the person approches you but sometimes behaviour is seen here as well.

i myself am nearly 18, but ask anyone here, does it show? do i act 'childish'?

is age really defined by a number?

I am well known for my ability to act like a child, though it is usually done in a fashion that makes it fun for everyone around me. I especially enjoy it when my kids are around and I play. It's like I'm their age again. Most of the kids on my block love it when I come out and play ball, or simon says ( you should see some of the stuff I come up with). But you're 100% correct, Batty.... it isn't the age, but how one caries themselfves and how much their willing to accept the responsibilities of their actions. Here, we are under the public eye and I for one try to conduct myself in a manner that leads by example. I have seen many an instance where that never comes into play. Shame shame on the adults who get bested by children.

I don't judge kids by age, I judge them by how they present themselves. I don't care if they're 13 or 17. If they are too ignorant or immature to do a little research before immersing themselves in a community, then they are a child and they should be treated as such.

i try to not judge on age. some young people are mature, others arent. it is the way they approach you or respond. if a
"kid" as you put it wants to be on this site then s/he should try to fit in and respect any other member as much as s/he would like to be respected and taken seriously.
i am talking to some young people who are really smart and mature.

I'd have to agree with the consensus so far. Anyone here should be judged on how they present themselves. If you act childish, it's how you will be treated. I have met plenty of young adults on this site that have carried themselves better than someone with more age under his/her belt.

It's old and corney...but 'don't judge a book by it's cover' .

i am 14 and i find it very annoying when people go on about 'kids' especially as i joined when i was 13 or so

I don't judge anyone on age. This site is called a resource and directory and I believe those young people that come here can benefit from the experience and knowledge of those who are older. Perhaps their exposure here will even point them in a constructive direction they may never have found. That's a wonderful thing.

My discomfort begins when grown men are bitten by 13 year old girls. When these same girls post pictures bearing their cleavage or they write suggestive messages and entries.

I completely understand the adolescent years are rife with sexual exploring. I am also not a prude. But there is a legal issue to consider.

However and as I am certain will be pointed out, I am neither the creator nor an administrator of this site so it's not my concern.

I am just stating my opinion.

I think you've stated a good point!

Certain people have vulgar pictures and vulgar vocabulary in their profiles and portfolios,but as young ones do it so the old ones.

However it gets more annoying to see a young one behaving this way,with all the pedophiles that can take a look at the site and with all the rape stories that happen all the time.

This drives me nuts too. I do start to get annoyed at the constant barrage of adolescent profiles claiming that "OMG I'm such a bitch and if you dont like it I'll slit your throat". That said, those profiles dont always belong to kids, and many of the teenagers here have tons of valuable info for us all.

I was 14 a mere 11 years ago. I clearly remember who I was, what I felt and what I needed then, and having adults on a Vampire site berating me for my age would've been the very last thing I needed!

Ah, actually I forget that the kids are here and any different except when they start to mention their classes and such, then I remember because it brings back memories...

At 11 years old, I was making sure rent was paid, food was in the house, and trying to make sure my mother didn't kill herself..

Age is but a number, I was more mature then than I am now!

at 14 i would not conside my self a child as i look after my farther who is mentaly ill and help my mother etc etc

I to am 30 years old. Some good points have been raised here. First S.D you had six misspelled words in your first post. That irks many adults. Try proofing your work so others can't use it as a reason why younger people are annoying. If someone, regardless of what age they are, wants to join this site they are welcome. At the same time many young people fill their profiles with nothing but self hate and anger. Mature people don't carry on in this manner. Personally I could careless you joins this site. I have a block button for teen aged girls or anyone else that bothers me, but thought I would explore possible reasons for others dislike of young people on here.

well i would have to say that i have ran into just as many adults that dont act their age as i have ran into kids who act more adult then adults do now adays. but no one really wants to look at someone without classifying their age first. oh your a kid what do you know about anything. and what i want to do to those ppl you really dont want to know.

I happen to fully agree with danzig...I openly explain which young people irritate me in my profile...some of your poetry and ideas are amazing and I enjoy reading them..but I do not enjoy getting bites and "hey baby..." messages from 13 year old boys...if you approach me in a mature fashion, you will be treated likewise. If someone writes about what irritates them...don't take it personally unless you are guilty of it;-)

To me age is but a number....along the path of life, we can meet some very mature kids whom I can enjoy sharing experiences with....and some very childish so called adults.....which can be very trying too...

So my ideas are is to give everyone a fair chance...to get to know them....no matter the age.....

Only think I dont like is being hit upon by teenagers who dont have class.....it doesnt make them look older...it makes them look stupid...same goes for some adults....

Enough said....Be well and enjoy the journey of meeting new people from all walks of life and countries...

Well as far as maturity level (IMO).

Women tend to be/act mature around 20-25.

Men dont tend to mature till they hit 40. I myself have just over a year to go.

So when will you mature?

*runs away fast*

when dom finally slaps some sense into him ::grin::

This has nothing to do with the number of minor members of this site.

This has to do with the fact that some people will always find something to bitch about. It is in their nature and you won't change their perspective.

I ignore them. I refuse to cater to them.

I, myself, have no grip with anyone 'age'...I treat everyone the same, based on their behavior

#1 Age, to me, only displays the number years I have been on this earth, it doesn't say how I've lived so how can it alone say how 'mature' I am

#2 Maybe I come in here so I don't have to act my age, this works both ways...Maybe I want to act younger...MAYBE, no one takes me seriously on the outside world and I come here to speak and not be measured by my age/looks/gender/hair color/lack of hair/etc

#3 It sucks but it happens, maybe some of these 13 yrs olds aren't....

It's not so much the fact that there are teens here that bothers me. As was said earlier some young people are far more mature then their age would suggest. Just as some adults are far less mature then their age would lead you to expect.

The ones that have concerned me are those teens who are here in a setting where there are a large number of adults as well who have things in their profiles like "I lost my virginity to my drunken daddy and I love to F*** and message me if you want to have a good time" and the ramifications to this site and it's administrators should one of these teens with such a attitude meet up with an adult they met on this site and a situation result that could bring them harm and lead to legal actions being taken against those who could be viewed as having "offered up a venue" for a sexual preditor to meet up with a young child.

It's not just a concern in the case of this site, but of any where adults, children and teens mingle in a group setting.

There are a lot of sick people out there and a lot of them do prey on those they meet first online.

I personally don't think that young people should be denied the right to come here and participate and have information made available to them. I just think it should be done in a way that provides them as much of a safe enviornment to do as is humanly possible.

The thing is that there are just so many people here that it is next to impossible to see how Cancer or any of the other staff members could truly monitor every single profile and conversation, so there really is no simple solution that I can see.

elyriabloodshadow speaks powerfully. Her words should be heeded

To me... you're a kid if you feel like one. Being a kid is fun and I'll never grow out of it. I just wish my age look didn't change to some old... wrinkly... old fart.

Thank you Fangor. I think that having valid and accurate information available to young people on the topics discussed here is important. They need to have some place where they can go and feel like their questions can and will be taken seriously and answered in the best way possible.

But I am also the mother of three teenagers and I see and hear the horror stories all the time of things that happen when kids interact with adults online and one of those adults turns out to be someone who is a preditor and who does manage to gain the trust of the young person and convince them to meet up, often with disasterous results.

Of course it happens to adults too, it's not just teenagers who are victimized, but I know as a parent that I feel much more comfortable about my children getting online and searching for information in places where there is at least some form of monitoring involved when it comes to the other people who use that site.

Add to that the number of law enforcement agencies out there who have adults posing as children online in all sorts of sites trying to bust pedophiles preying on kids online and you really just can not be too careful these days.

It boils down to protecting the younger users of a site and covering your own ass at the same time if you think about it.

Give them a safe environment to ask their questions and gain their answers and you keep yourself free of any accusations of child endangerment of contributing to such things.

ElyriaBloodshadow,

There have been no court rulings to my knowledge where an ISP or a content provider (website) have been held accountable for the illegal activity performed by CRIMINALS.

A male criminal reads the newspaper. He finds an ad for an auto sale where the contact name is feminine. The criminal calls the number, makes arrangements with the female to view the auto, and then upon meeting rapes and kills her.

Is the newspaper liable for the actions of the criminal? Of course not.

What about criminals that go through the phone book? Has the phone company ever been sued because their book aided a criminal in a crime?

Companies like Yahoo Personals, et al. have been dealing with this for a very long time on a much larger scale than VR.

VR cannot stop a criminal who is intent upon engaging in criminal activity.

People need to take more personal responsibility.

Elyria,

I believe you echo the concerns of many here. It is unfortunate and I think we all agree that there are real monsters out there. Paedophiles stalk the naive young people, who, while I would grant that MANY are mature in some respects, are still prey to these scum.

Look at the victims of the most notorious serial killers: Speck, Dahmer, the Green River Killer, BTK, hell, even Jack the Ripper. Most of the victims were of an age many would call mature.

Do I believe that there are paedophiles here? Yes. They are everywhere online and Cancer and the others cannot stop them. That being said, I DO think that for legal purposes, a disclaimer of sorts would be appropriate. God forbid something should ever happen to a young person here. The courts of law look at age very seriously and there is no black and white.

Indeed, I DISAGREE with certain age restraints: I think that if you can die in battle at 18, you should be allowed to drink. And I do not advocate censorship to consenting adults. I think however that VR is a great place, and a simple, highly visible disclaimer on this site will protect its owners legally, and it will let the paedophile know that such action is NOT tolerated.

VladVoivode.

I understand Cancer. It is just a concern a lot of people had been voicing off and on, and not merely here in VR. It's not really a matter of preventing or being held accountable for the actions of the criminal element so much as making it harder for them to find any form of outlet for their behavior in sites such as this. No one can stop them from doing what they are intent on doing, but we can (those of us who run sites where young people are present) make it a bit harder for them to find easy prey in our domains. We can't change the whole world and make it safe for everyone in it, but we can have some effect on our little corners of it.

Very good points Vlad. I have to agree with you.

Vlad,
You are so correct. There are pedophiles on every board out there, but what makes it so dangerous, and what I am afraid of is that some of these so called kids, want that danger in their lives because they think that this is what it is all about. I personally know alot of kids that think the "Goth" scene is supposed to be dangerous and I am forever correcting them, but I dont want to see someone like that be put in harms way. I guess being a mom makes me worry.

And Cancer, please don't think my posts were in any way a personal shot at you or how you run the site. It's an issue that has been addressed in many places online and off and is a valid concern to anyone who has children who spend time online.

There is no quick and easy fix, there probably never will be a workable way to prevent such things from happening, but there are ways to help assure at least some small degree of safety for those who frequent the various sites. Again, no one can ever stop people set on doing something to cause harm to another, but neither do we all have to make it easy for them to do so.

Not just here, but anywhere we might have a means of establishing some preventative measures, online or off.

The best course of action I feel, in that case, Elyria, is to face them directly- expose those who seek to deceive.

I love how people will philosophize about utopian ideals, yet at the same time offer no practical method of implementation.

This site follows all US law regarding minors and the Internet. You must be at least 13 years old to have a VR membership (Children's Online Privacy Protection Act of 1998). If a member is under 13 and we find out about it the member is deleted immediately.

How many of you have read the COPPA? I have gone to great lengths to make sure VR is in compliance.

Now, onto the next matter, age. Children LIE. If I was to make this site 18+ the ONLY way I could implement it would be to require a credit card for access. Even that is not fool proof.

You can rant all you want. But until you invent a method of keeping children (of whatever age) off this or similar site's it's moot.

I prefer to focus on practical ideas.... Like improving Premium Memberships.

well why should the age of children be under 18. i'm 17 and i'm a sophmore in college. i'm just as mature as the next person. i don't complain. i don't jack around. what is the age that you stop being a kid?

I think the issue is not that all 'kids' are immature and a pain - I like to think I was fairly mature for my age at 13, 14 or 15 - but I was *not* hanging around online (ok, it wasn't as available back then) sending sexually aggressive emails out to 30 year old men.

It's not about who is legally responsible for someone being harmed it's about awareness. Acknowledge the fact that there are 14 year olds who most definitely are into self-mutilation and are harming themselves, 15 year olds who think that girl on girl is great because it makes older men look at them, and 13 year olds who try and emulate 25 year olds because they think it makes them cool. Acknowledge it and STOP ENCOURAGING IT.

And by this I mean, don't rate them a ten and offer some "great profile" or “ur sxy” comment - tell them what's wrong with it. Is it your responsibility? Of course not - but is it the right thing to do? You're damn right it is.

We've had topics asking people if they have kids - and half of you do, as do I. Would you want your 13-year-old daughter thinking it was ok to show her ass all over the internet? It's obvious these are the kids whose parents already don't pay attention to them so they don't have any idea of what is and is not acceptable.

So the "adults" out there can either act like adults and tell the kids they're out of line, or they can perpetuate the problem and complain later when it's 11 year olds doing it because their big sister is here and getting letter after letter from the nice pedophile who wants to buy her pretty clothes..

And I must say, just because "there's always something to bitch about" doesn't mean there's not a problem. That apathetic attitude is what gets us into stupid situations like, oh I dunno - Bush being given another 4 years.

wow nyx you have a really good point. i was trying to take a pic of my 13 year old sister to put on my myspace account and she started with a "sexy" pose. it's kinda disturbing. i didn't even think she knew what it was to be sexy. i mean what the hell is everyone teaching teenagers. i never knew about any of this until recently. it kind of worries you about who she's talking to on the internet that wants her to pose like that.

Nyx,

I choose not to complicate existing problems. If your 14-year-old daughter is on a community site showing herself off in an inappropriate fashion the fault lies with you as her parent.

Be a good parent. Police your children. Do not make webmasters into babysitters.

kids are more enthuesastic about this site cuz there parants look down on them evry one that looks down on them gives them motive to come here so y should we complain about the number of kids pluse we were all kids once

You are so right, it is up to the parents to police their children. When my youngest one is on the comp, I know what he is doing at all times.. Not that I stand over him, I give him his privacy, but I know enough to check and I know people on every board he is on, so its easy. But ultimately, it does have to do with the parents.

Well I agree Cancer, and no, I don't have a 14 year old yet. I wasn't speaking to you directly, but everyone on the site who seems to have issue with this.

As I said, I know it's not our responsibility, but not encouraging it is the right thing to do.

I have to say, this is the first site I've run across where there was this size population of under 16 kids around - not that it's good or bad, just the way it is. And having seen some of the things these kids are doing online, you're god damned right my kid won't be online at 14 with the "freedom" to do certain things.

But as I also said, not all parents are as involved with their kids as they should be. Since this is in our faces (and not their parents') then I feel we should not encourage it. That doesn't mean you should stop it, it means everyone should take a role in not encouraging the behavior. It's a very simple thing to do as everyone runs through profile after profile judging the content.

Besides, young teens care way more than they should about what other people think of them. You show them that people don't like it and they'll bend over backwards to do what will get them accepted. (Ok, 98% of them will).

i'm 14 and have had a few older guys trying to get in with me but i wont have any of it and i can stand up for myself. my mum and dad dont knwoni even go here they'd hate me if they knew how much i liked vamps

This is a very old topic which will most likely never fully be agreed upon. There are a lot of immature people, young and old. Yes maybe some younger people shouldn't be on certian websites because they haven't learned the right social skills yet. Just like kids shouldn't be going out to parties and staying out all night because they don't have the "street smarts"
Yet there are older people who shouldn't be here because they take it for all the wrong reasons.
I have met horribly rude people at the age of 50 who I couldn't believe were so immature or mean. And I have met the same sort of people, only 11 or 15 years old.
Honestly I must say, I have met more rude and immature 11 or 15 year old kids simply because they are young and they do have to learn. We've all been there, we've all been young and have done foolish things.
We shouldn't bitch about rudeness whether it comes from a young or older person. But we shouldn't allow it. If someone is rude to you, block them, if they rate you a 0 just because, don't sweat it. Can you honestly be that insulted by someone who just comes on here to bug people?

To Cancer,

I have no doubt that you have laboured and continue to labour to ensure that VR is in compliance. That being said, I think you should realise that we are NOT bitching at you. We bring this up because we CARE.

I do believe that having a disclaimer, a simple sentence will go far to covering you in the event - and as I said God forbid that it DOES - that it does.

I have seen these things happens in much larger and corporate owned sites where there STRICT age controls and even seperate chats and forums for those under 18. Age IS an arbitrary indicator I grant you, and to me this is not a philosophical discussion but one of great practicality brought before you from a truly concerned community that ALSO wants to help imporove what is a great site.

What more can I say except that if we did NOY think you were doing your best, we would not be here. That is not a threat but rather an indication that there is a high level of members wanting to assist.

Even though you ARE in COPPA, is it a bad thing to post a simple statement that "adult themes and images exist on this site and are not necessarily the opinions of the owners of Vampyre Rave"

You are the Prince here, and what you decide; how you decide to address this is your prerogative. But, remember that not every comment is a slam against you.

Be well Cancer.

GAH *falls over*
whew...informative....very official. Hmm...I don't know I can't make suggestions. Maybe if we all loosened up and practiced minding our own buisness.

I feel the same way about there being to many 'kids' on this site. But the age of said 'kid' is not the point. Too many people on this site act like kids, whether they be 13 or 30. It's not the age, its the action.

"So It Is Written, So It Shall Come To Pass, Quoth The Raven, Nevermore..."

I didn't take it that way. But the majority of the posters to this thread suffer from a lack of perspective.

For me this subject goes beyond the Internet. It has to do with parenting and child rearing in a free society.

This issue is older than the Internet.

Hehe well I'll try to be then everyone will make fun of me ^.^

Age is a number, this and people moaning about user names is bugging me lately. We were all God damn kids once, yes they can be ingnorant and assholes, but some are so mature I think they are older than me. Why is society so judgmental?

Interesting points raised here

Age is a mere number and how a person acts is how they act irregardless of their numerical age. I have read posts from people I have applauded, bith young and old.......and I've read some so full of trite that I could scream, and unfortunately not all from the young members here. Ignorance does not have an age limit.

However, I have to agree on the other points raised by El Vlad and Nyx.

We all have our own places elsewhere and we have an over 18's rule. We have adult forums and content, ranging from various spiritual, vampyric or down right bitchfests lol and we take it upon ourselves to make sure those viewing have some of what it takes to join in.

There is knowledge here and a lot of ignorance, about many subjects some of which, if placed in wrong hands or wrong minds could be harmful.

I've seen what happens when people 'play' with the occult, darker paths,.... lifestyles where they don't know anything and can misled by people who claim so much but give nothing and take everything. This happens to adults, a young mind eager to learn something about the 'spooky' the macabre, the oh so enticing dark is far easier prey.

And no it isn't an easy thing to police. The set up here means that with all the profiles it is a lot harder to police, so when a few point out they feel there could be a possibility of a problem occuring then forewarned they say is forearmed, and perhaps if the predators are aware that some will be keeping an eye out for the more vulnerable that are here, and these not necesarily being the youngest of the members here, then I don't see how anyone can have a problem with it.

The point made about parents being responsible...yeh well in an ideal world they would be. But this is not an ideal world, a lot of parents can't look after themselves let alone any offspring, so there are times when others have to take on the role, albeit grudgingly.

Ok to me age is for the most part just a number but and I have onlly been on the sight for 2 day so I might have my meanings wrong but I have been bit by 5 young womne alll 16 and under and flattering as it is I am a 31 yr old man and it feels kinda creepy