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After seeing the bickering in the "Predator of Man" thread, then swifty getting a message as to why I did it (when if you read my RIP/RIA posts, I always give a reason), I felt it best to post this.

I hope the other Dominar feel the same way-- but if you start to argue violently or post rudely and start an arguement in a thread, from now on I'm reading it all, and RIA-ing it.

It will not matter to me (at least) if someone ruined your thread (it's happened to me,) or a friend's thread. I will be on the prowl closing threads.

Keep your primadonna and lordy attitudes in the Mascara threads, the Sandbox or your own journal--which I highly recommend.

Do NOT drag it into the general forums. No one wants to read your petty fights over pixels.

~N

Primadonna- Hmmmm...... I wonder if.... is reading this

It is good to see that you are working hard to keep the thread standard high.
Thank you...(and I did read the thread to which you refer).

I don't understand why people bother to bicker!
It is obvious that for the most VR members are diverse and strongly opinionated bunch...differing opinions will happen, it is a good thing...
I try to stay objective.
If someone irritates or offends you...well just move on...

Getting personal is a weak argument anyway...

Amen!!

Guys, please put aside the fightings and all. Not here, please.

I hear you, homey! I don't like people when they argue with your opinion. I mean, it's not like their argument will change it!
Shadowgirl

I can understand your point but I do have an opinion.

It seemed like many were really involved in the thread and because one came in and stated an opinion that was uncalled for it was closed down.

Seems a bit unfair to the ones who really were interested in getting the thread going tho. Hopefully the thread can be started again and the arguing can be kept out of it.

I agree, I don't know if closing a topic will act as a deterrent to someone who enjoys being an idiot in someone elses thread, and it's unfair to the thread starter, particularly if there's only 1 or 2 members disrupting an otherwise interesting discussion.
Couldn't you just send round some heavies to break their legs?

Killing a good thread does seem a bit harsh. I can see why it was done, but it still seems like there might be another way to handle it depending on the level of bickering going on.

i like this idea i have seen alot of people take things too seriuosly and unregister, which i see as dumb cause this is just a website

I also think that closing down a thread because of useless bickering is rather harsh. Especially if the thread is a well thought out thread and they have taken time to do it.

Just because a few use it to explode anger doesn't mean the rest who enjoy the thread should have to pay.

I have seen a few threads shut down because of this.

Then I have also seen some good threads have the fightening deleted so others can still post and enjoy it.

The second way is more fair to others who haven't desicrated the thread. Or those who enjoy reading it.

I must agree, and thank you Narakyndryn for posting the thread.

There is a profound difference between good hearted debating and bickering. Bickering gets people nowhere, debating offers enlightening view points so that people can see different sides to the story and form their own opinions. That is what makes these forums so great, if everyone shared the same opinion how boring it would all be!

Everyone have the same views would make the world a rather dull place to be. Debate is how some of the most ground breaking discoveries have been made. Not say that that would happen here but you never know.

Also, I forgot to add... I think that instead of necessarily closing the thread why not just delete the negative/offensive posts? If the thread is valid to start with other people might want to share their own opinion on it still.

Closing a thread cause of bickering, would just give some idiots a weapon against others.

If they dont like a person, they just go to cause trouble in their thread and then it gets closed, do you guys really want that?

Deleting out the trouble, is probably more work, but maybe it will keep people to sabotage other peoples threads. If everybody gets treated the same, that is.

I agree with you. I dont like reading arguments.

I agree with Kat and with LoneFoxAndCub.

There are people here who dislike others and flame them for no really good reason. Soemtimes attempting to politely ask someone why they are being rude results in either silence or further nastiness.

Flamers should be dealt with, but not at the expense of a good thread.

Breaking their fingers is a most effective deterrent.

I personally prefer to delete particular posts if it is an exclusive 'bickering'... if a thread is obviously a good one, I'll keep it going- I'll warn the members causing discontent, and if they do not listen... I will report them for further action to a full Administrator.

RIA... sometimes the threads just go WAY South, and need to die. But if it looks like a great involvement and the author of the thread is also still inovlved, I'd give the thread mercy. Sometimes however, threads are abandoned by their authors and get off track. There's nothing wrong with getting rid of trouble in that case.

If a thread gets closed due to someone else's crappy actions- start a new one sticking to topic- you can even find a Dominar to help if someone is ruining your thread and they will take care of that member individually.

LoneFoxandCub brings up a good point- we need to start smashing some heads, lol. Just kidding, kinda.

I've actually tried to delete the posts-- but for some reason they remain there.

I would figure that in the case with that particular thread (again, a good one), that the person's account be forbidden to post there again-- if Dominar or Admin (moreso admin) could possibly lock a particular person from the thread, or from posting for a period of time.

I would LOVE for the owner of the thread to start another one along the same lines-- but it wasn't one person's one comment that made me close it-- never think that.

It was purely the bickering between persons.

You know breaking arms or hands might be more effective. How hard would it be to type if both of your hands or all of your fingers were broken?

*imagesinwords edit* heads, heads, smash heads! lol

I too think it was overtly harsh to RIA the thread, maybe I shouldn’t have been riled by a certain post and stated my opinion but I believe what was said was unfair and cruel.

Face it, a good amount of people on this site are just here to screw with people.

Period.

If I was part of the problem then I apologize. I love to debate topics and sometimes I go to far - also once I'm "baited" I often respond even knowing I shouldn't, and I will work on that.

Keep your cool-- or make friends while bickering, right? ;)

Oh, and I found the delete button in the vamp box. :D It works. :D

*woot* or a Lunazure *hoot* ...whoah, lame. lol

Ah! Bickering, Arguing and/or "Starting Something"..... Now I understand!

I was politely and privately enquiring why the thread had been killed when I could see no particular reason why!

However, looking back over the thread I do note some "Spirited" posting.

Maybe it’s just because I'm more used to considerably more, shall we say, "lively forums" that I'd not initially noticed it!

Thank you however for clearing that up for me, I'd just wanted to understand what had raised the anger of a Moderator so as not to cause offence myself.

Relatively new here, and no two forums have exactly the same parameters.

imagesinwords, you crack me up!

Uh, not in a head cracking type way. I hope.

Druidic-- FAQ

Read FAQ. Know FAQ. Love FAQ. Dont piss off the mods by writing crap-tastical threads.

Common sense makes Moderators happy. :D

Common sense makes the Mods happy? Well I few start as few threads as possible then because I have been told time and time again lack the common sense most people have.

Narakyndryn and imagesinwords....

I definitely appreciate your efforts to keep the garbage out of the forums. Good job. But I do have one question: What do you conisder to be the difference between debate and bickering? I would think that some level of respectful debate should be allowed to take place. I was wondering what might make either of you draw the line. (If any other Dominar wants to jump in on that one, feel free....)

I evidently pissed someone off with an earlier posting though I still don't know where. I am new enough that I've tried to keep debate excrutiatingly civil. Perhaps it was my attempt to engage with most of the postings on an interactive level that someone felt made me a 'know it all'. I believe the thread in question was just the closest target.

Either way, I appreciate the support from those who liked my postings and I appreciate the killing of the thread. Once someone feels the need to begin a flame post, it's unlikely that the thread will be saved without a severe amount of work. I look at it as a euthenaisia from my perspective so no harm no foul to me, Nara.

Internet fighting is pointless anywayz, so peace everybody and lets keep the forum clean :)

I think everyone is entitled to their opinion but to bash someone elses is wrong, we should ALL respect everyone elses opinion nomatter how different it may all be...obviously, but to fight and bicker over foolish things is a waste of everyones time.

*Holding a picket sign singing the ditty...*
'Bash heads, not threads, Bash heads, not threads!'

...all in good fun folks, all in good fun =)

Just out of curiousity, why was my thread in the sandbox about Furbies deleted??? It was there one day, I never saw an RIA or RIP beside it and now I can't find it. What happened????

Interesting points all of them, but mainly i think I agree with raziel that there is no point in arguing with someone on the INTERNET you do not know them will probably never meet them don't be childish, I have a younger sibling and he acts more mature than some of you at tyimes. GET OVER IT.

:-) enjoyed reading this thread....

and for some strange reason, the tune of "fish heads, rolly polly fish heads" is in my mind but inseting smash instead of fish....why is that???

Alot of the problems could be how someone responds - hard sometimes to tell the difference with the typed phrase, so just "speak" to others as how you would like to be spoken too.

a thread about furnies..I think that ought to be self explanatory....seriously

k back to topic...
as to not being able to delete...bingo...you found a bug..tell the big man bout it
and I have also often wondered where the line is between spirited debate...and bickering....I know I get rather acidic with fools, I even flame myself for it on occasion, but I do usually try to not name names, or make the razor wit too directed at one person..so where is this rather well hidden line?

MastersJewel: I didn't see your thread about Furbies, but it probably was killed because it was about Furbies. Just a guess.

I looked at the thread in question and found no bickering. One person suddenly jumped in and started to jump down one person's throat. It should have been simply ignored. Not closed.
The person that was using a technique to reply to a past post, alright - all the past posts, was not forcing their opinion on anyone. Just trying to cover all the replies with their personal comment. This is not flaming or bickering. But naming names can be taken personal. And this is what happened. Please learn from this and move on. Don't jump out at someone, and learn there is no need to reply to every single past post. And doms/admins do not need to jump in the middle of things. Just do what you need to do.

Joins in with Images to picket "bash heads not threads"...

Or was it vice versa... darn dyslexia... can't remember...

And Billy, you rock!

Agreed. Posts should be a place to add more information, or views. Not a place to wage wars.

Individual post deletion would make an excellent tool for the admins, and in my opinion a necessary one. As others have said, it's not fair to close a thread because of a couple of idiots. Giving the administration the ability to temporarily ban problematic members for example would give a flexibility that, again I believe, is sorely needed.

Doing that would allow good threads to continue while disposing of the excess trouble that has taken down many a thread. That's my take on that part of the situation anyway.

yep, we do have the option to delete posts. Her's was not working or something like that ;)

Do you guys have some way of punishing the individual pains? I wasn't sure if you guys could do that or if cancer reserved that right.

FromNothingICome-- to back Bat up on that-- I find bickering to be TASTELESS conversation where suddenly someone has a fire strated under their keyboard and feel the need to be distasteful as a means of 'look at me, I'm an idiot.'
*bellydances the idiot dance to amuse Daermon ;)*

DEBATE on the other hand, is tasteful and intelligent-- or for those that don't like big words: not rude, crude, or put mods in the mood to kick your asses-- and for LaMuerte to add you to the list of fools.

Batchyld and Narakyndryn:

Thank you both for taking the time to clarify that point. That's basically how I saw it, but I figured we should get the official word. Hopefully this is something we can all keep in mind in the future. Thanks!

Yw fromnothingicome.. I don't mind giving an official point of view :) Nara thank you hon for backing me in return. United we stand, Divided we fall. :)

It is great to see someone is keeping up on this type of bickering in the forums, keep up the good work.

hmm time for a reversal on my usual soapbox....
instead of abuse of power issues...this time I am saying add a power to dominars...a temporary suspension power just in reference to adding posts in the threads....
if someone is being a grade A assmuch,
give them a few days of silence to think on their ways....course I ought to be careful what I wish for....being that i am sometimes aforementioned grade A assmunch..hehe
oh well at least i know I have flaws....
some here refuse to know they do also

Some people simply can't accept the fact that others can have a different opinion.

Well, I didn't think the thread was that bad, but then again you want to try a re-enactment board! 40 year old spoilt brats!

I had already read the FAQ, and whole heartedly agreed with it, I'd probably have not killed the thread myself BUT (and this is the biggy in my book) I'm not the poor feth who has the hard and thankless task of being a Mod on this board!

I may disagree with your decision, but I wholeheartedly support your decision none the less. Which was why rather then publicly raising the issue, I thought I’d politely enquire in private for just a little more information!

I apologise if this ruffled any feathers!

People do not always get along. Egos clash. Styles clash. It is unrealistic to expect people to always agree.

Disagreement, even so -called name calling is good stuff.

If one can't stand the heat simply don't post.

But gee whiz, and golly wow, this ain't the Waltons!

hehe nice one stabb....wolf and the trash....
hehe
there was a colorful couple...but ya...scalpels do work beter that machete's
when doing brain surgery

I'm definatley with Stabb on this one. If there's a good discussion going, and one or two people are fouling it up, I'll chastise them, then clear out threads if necessary.

Which is what I had already done on the Predator of Man thread, and hadn't seen any more off-topic posts after I made my edit.

thank you for the read

now we're not lumping bickering in with intelligent debate are we? I mean....if there are valad points being argues in a respectfull way it can be enjoyable and informative for everyone

i also agree. i think that when you go onto a forum you should only talk about what the subject is.

WHAAAAAA
WAAAAAAA
save the frickin drama for yo mama..cause shes is the only one who might possibly give a shit....
nara... stay on the prowl....