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Do you believe in an afterlife? And why do you believe or do not believe?

I think upon death the brain fires off many thoughts at once, and this creates an image, like a dream that one has for about 10 minutes. I think this is the only “afterlife”, your final thoughts and then your dead.

” Death is not an event but a process in which various systems fail successively and at different times. Brain death is now generally accepted (by the 1976 UK Conference of Medical Royal Colleges and Faculties for example)”Dictionary of Biological psychology.

“Brain damage starts in 3-4 minutes, after 10 minutes the damage is so extensive that you are clinically brain dead”(wikipedia).

So, then in those 10 minutes, I assume this is one’s “afterlife”.

“Do you believe in an afterlife? And why do you believe or do not believe?”

He means an afterlife as in...floating around heaven as an angel or burning in hell as a damaged lost, soul.If you believe in that...and also he could mean as a ghost that haunts the place they died.Also if you believe in that.

And NO I don't believe in an after life.I do believe that when you die you die...your life ceases to exist and your body is void of breath and a conscious.

I believe that everyone possess not one, but two souls (conscious and unconscious) and upon death they divide, the conscious loses it's memories and go on to new experiences (reincarnation) and the unconscious becomes stuck in heavenly or hellish dreams built out of it's own memories.

Ok then which one you think we are going to experience? both at the same time? We are in hell or heaven subconciously, while the other one is somewhere else in a bird or a slug?

Heaven and hell are ones own creation. We make of it what we will, if you ask a 100 people what heaven and hell is then you would come up with 100 different answers. If you ask me heaven and hell do not exist, it was a story created to scare people into believing and being good. But that is a different story.

If you ask me, our bodies die, but our souls live on on the earth in peace. The souls can see all the other souls and all that, and are aware of 'us' the living.

But i do like the 2 souls idea. i haven't heard that one before and it could be quite feasible.

Seeing as the consciousness is the result of neurons firing, when these neurons cease to fire, the consciousness ceases as well.

I'm still curious whether the brain really does retain consciousness for up to 10 seconds after being removed from the body. If that's the case, I want to be beheaded when my time comes, so I can see the crowd from a severed head before my brain dies.

La6Muerte66, it can yes, but only in some people, there was one of Henry the 8th wives who was beheaded and her brain was still functioning when it hit the ground, but you would have to take into account many things, im not sure which things, but yes, it is very true!

Religion faith based on all most all aspects teaches us that there could or is an aftrelife. whether heaven or hell or traveling the firey waters styxs. And some do believe in the concept of the here after.

I believe in death for it is known, we as humans could not define the term of another life, Sorry still a mystery and the time of death all may come clear. Death is death, the body once again returns to mother earth and this is where the cycle of life ends.

We all wish that their is something more, for this is why so many fear the aspect of death itself.yet the believe in a concept of another plane in life our logical mind has not been shown this.

The issue with the head remaining conscious after being removed from the body is that I hear the body immediately cuts off consciousness when the spine is severed, but I can't seem to find any corroborating evidence for that. Most of the tests were apparently performed back when beheading was still a common method of execution.

Anyway... There is no evidence that the consciousness survives the death of the body, and so I feel that it's most likely that death really is the end. All these suggestions of separate consciousness and duality are merely arguments from ignorance and faith-based fantasy, more inspired by one's desire to live on after this life than the actual reality of the situation.

I belive in an afterlife , only because i belive my soul has left my body on many occasions . I have still retained my consciousness when out , but i have no idea what would happen if my body were to die . I,ve heard of souls spliting . I,ve recently read a Siberian explanation of what they belive happens which i quite like .

"Upon death a persons three souls separate . One stays with the body , remaining in the land of the living as a spirit or ghost , one journeys to the heavens and evenually finds it,s way to Pon , the supreme being , while the third goes to the land of shadows , where it becomes a shadow itself . Sometimes , a persons soul journeys to the land of shadows when a person is asleep or ill ." "Once the soul has become a shadow , it continues to lead the same life it has knowen in the land of the living , The shadow soul joins the shadow souls of relatives and friends it had on earth . "

I,d like to think a soul chooses one of these options , be a ghost on earth , return to the source , go to heaven . I,am just not sure about my soul splitting , it,s a difficult concept to wrap your head round , separating different layers of consciousness .

I do believe there is life after death. This is simply because I subscribe to the belief that energy only changes forms and does not just cease to exist.

Hmm do you believe Suicides are enough to prove that there is life after death? I mean if our logic as biological beings looks for what is fitting for survival, then why people self-destructs if the nature of the life essence is the survival in all biological entities, it is something I think not seen in the nature of another species other than us, those who posses rationality and consciousness over their actions... you may think it’s a disease cause by depression but it’s enough to prove that there are emotions and consciousness involved discarding the brain corruption, its un-evidenced that we have a concrete proof of a wandering specter, but I think if our decisions and emotions change the world around us there must be a higher thing purpose of our existence, if we were randomly created only to survive, eat and reproduce we wouldn’t need rationality just basic instincts, think about it..music, dance, art, poetry, writing, love, to say this is all the key for survival for humans beings I find it very incoherent. I’ve heard: “suicidals and those who haven’t delivered their message stick in the earth as lost wandering souls”…who knows, can someone with paranormal investigation experience broaden more on this?

One does not need paranormal investigation skills to broaden on this topic.

I have witnessed a couple of paranormal experiences as well as a slew of OBE. I am very skilled at the OBE. To me, there is enough proof that I have witnessed first hand, that there is another dimension that the sould does transcend to. as well as the many layers and extentions of the other dimension.

As for the unexplainable phenomenon, from ghosts and hauntings to shadow creatures and possession, this may be proof within itself as seen and heard from around the world on seperate occasions.

Suicides are often hauntings, as well as murder victims. bodies that die in very harmful ways are more often then not, hauntings after a short period of death. The experience itself would counter the individuals frame of mind as in "happening to suddenly" to know if they have passed. Thus tricking them into thinking that they are still alive...Thus the hauntings.

I have an assurance of what death is. One thing I ponder is that for those who accept an afterlife, and that being after here (this life) and how fast they claim to have a connection to, or sight into, that accepted afterlife. Then how they expect others to revere them as more "blessed" then others. Piety Sucks.. sure believe what you want.. but to press sensationalism really crushes those who have rational accepted sufficient assurances.

I believe in an afterlife, where i am able to be with the ones that i have loved in life. And i also believe in reincarnation- so my afterlife may be a little short than most- if i have unfinished business that i need to finish.

I personally believe in the power of one's own soul. If you think about it, people say that they've experianced things like seeing God/ Buddha/ Allah/ Whatever. They really believe they've seen these things. So, are these hallucinations or not? That's for you to decide if they are wrong or right. I believe that what you've been taught all your life is what you are going to want to see after you're gone from this world. Therefore that is what happens. The power of faith and belief is very strong and it can create anything at all. Anything physical, spiritual, manifested, good or bad. It's the power of belief and faith that carries us, even through death. Sometimes, it's all we have, and it is definately more powerful than any real explanation.

everyone can have these experiances. It depends on the person and their belief system. How strong they are in their faith. The truth of your belief depends on you

For everydoor that we open another place we seem to see. belief has taught us on many aspects that something would exists. And i do not falter thyose who presume that there does. i personally hope that life holds more meaning besides living and dying.

death is not the end..

Thats why the movie K-Pak with kevin spacey, and Jeff bridges( of Star Man ) is so cool, the possible alien, is in the consciousness of a man that was a vegtable. I just totally thought of that after reading Muartas post.

K-pac was a good movie dabbler, yet my reasoning is how do we determine this to believe in afterlife. For the guy thought he was an alein after the death of his family.

Faith or beliefs are the doors to ones souls and possibly the key to the here after. Many things are yet known to us especially the speculation of the points after death.

i believe in an afterlife and past lives ..... i have memories of things i have never experienced in this life but when i remember these it is my face my eyes my heart and my soul i see and feel ... i believe that after a period of rest to refocus what was learned in this life time our souls are reborn into the next life be it an animal or a person

But people want the added sensational contact on this life with the next, it is really lame when such pious people spout off about alledged experiences with peeks, or communication with their idealized after life.
People with base core beliefs are hosed by such pious sensationalist, I could care less about what people chose to believe, and I wont waste time considering yours, or anyones software.. I already had a prelude to the final hallicination, it fit me fine, so why would I yoke myself with what others expect to see as they die.

I really don't want to offend you or anything, but if you really don't care then why did you even bother posting in this forum?
I just shared my views and so do the other people. I'm just saying, you don't have to be hateful about it if you don't agree...
I mean if you want to be hateful then thats you and you have that right, but it's kind of pointless to argue about something that everyone has different views over.
It's just up to you whether or not you decide to sit back and let them believe what they want to.
Thats the beauty of the american constitution anyway.

It is the sensationalism that is pressed onto others, when they poke holes in others core beliefs, or Pshaw those who have no beliefs.

It is not the personal matter of Dying and watching what ever soft ware one loaded, it is the people who profess to have some dialed in connection in this life, the pious people that belittle those who are rather content without such sensational expectations, imagine being a person who is told everyday after church that someone was touched by angels.. so that person never feels that, or claims to (which is usually the case with the others) once a person takes their concept of the afterlife and presents it as anymore real, or likely then someone elses then the line is crossed.

I only ask my friends to share their faith, or reasoning related to dying in case that chance comes when I am there when they die, seeing people say "He is going to Heaven now, and Making God Life" when George Carlin Passed appear to have missed his who Routine, and Presentation.

It doesn't matter to me what people believe, and you use the word pious a lot. It isn't necessarily a bad thing. You can call them what you want but at least they have something.
EX- Jehovahs Witnesses are probably the most annoying branch of christianity on the planet. Everything that people hate about christianity is probably because of them. They are close minded and they shun people who are too worldly. They don't celebrate holidays because they are pagan, they have to adhere to a ridiculous code of rules. Yet they still knock on my door every chance they get.
I don't slam the door in thier face, or tell them to get lost. I just let them know that, this is not what I believe after I've let them have their say.
I learned the hard way that you can't change peoples beliefs because they are going to believe it anyway. It pisses them off really badly when you challenge them that way. Thats why I let them do it. They may not be right but its honestly none of my business.
Again, whether or not that is your choice is up to you.

You are aware that I only addressed those who profess physical affirmations
of their accepted after life, this has nothing to do with belief, pious people will create hoaxes to place them selves in a posistion for praise, and reverence, by such obviously fabricated testimonies of interacting with their after life, people are lead into cults expecting "the touches of angels" so those who are settled with a base belief( the after life is after life) are crushed by sensationalist. Fanatics know this all to well.

I never said it was a good thing. YES there are crazy people on this earth NO it isn't a good thing. BUT until the government takes freedom of religion out of the constitution what are you gonna do about it? You can't do anything but gripe. And griping is REALLY annoying. More annoying than those ignorant and stupid people you speak of.

I just want to make it clear to those content without the sensational religiousity that they are not required to support, or endorse any sensational
"signs and wonders".

Such people thankfully are seldom long term devoted, and can create mutiny in grass root chuches ( churches I enjoy actually).

Once some people feel they are no longer fussed over as a member, they tend to grandize their religiousity. Thus the denominations, sects, and cults.

Even science had psuedo science and fringe science.

The human head can stay alive for a few hours after decapitation when blood is percolated through it and hooked up to machinery. And up to a couple of days on it's own after being in intensive care upon reattachment to another body.

Dr. Robert White of Case Western Reserve in Cleveland, Ohio. Is the person who has ran studies and experiments on people, rats, and monkeys. It is not called a "head-transplant", but a "body-transplant". The correct term is also "discorporation".

Chet Fleming a Harvard law school graduate who made it his personal crusade to warn people of "discorporation". He is paranoid that "discorporation" could keep future Hitler and Stallin's alive. He placed all his studies, experiments and thoughts in a Harvard law school record. He also wrote a book entitled, "If we could keep a human head alive."

They both said with " discorporation", a severed human head can keep consciousness, blink, have adequate and correct facial expressions for certain responses and sitautions, can look around, observe, and be aware of it's surroundings, and EVEN speak, yes speak.

**Creepy**

The decapitated head can be reconnected to another body and function properly. But does not survive long. If they could regenerate certain spinal tissues and nerves the body transplant could be a complete success.

A man could have a weightlifter's body or even a woman's body. Same goes for women.

I got all this information from, "Why things are: answers to every essential question in life" - Joel Achenbach

As for "Heaven" and "Hell", I believe. I've had far TOO many experiences and occurnces NOT to believe.

As for Dabbler, you are in NO position to criticize ANYONE'S beliefs. For you are a MAN, and only ONE man. You do not hold within yourself the knowlegde of EVERYONE'S beliefs and as to who is "correct or non-correct".

You are continually using the word "pious" for piety, when you are making yourself out to look pious, and quite a pariah.

You may not believe in an afterlife. Cool beans. Whatever. But YOU as a person are only part of the whole.

Instead of looking at the spectrum one way, flip it around. Or if you wish not to, or claim that you have, if you don't like what's being said "don't read it."

No it is not as you see it. You yourslf profess to have had experiences, so then you need not to concern yourself with belief.. Or faith correct? You ate so much more spiritual then those who have not had experiences, why so flustered bloody mother??

I can't help but wonder what is the relevance of the "head transplant" excerpts to this discussion. If you want to start a separate discussion on it, by all means start a new thread. This has now entirely left the topic of death and the afterlife.

Wow ! yes I do believe in life after death . After all we are engery its self . So I believe that engery consist after deat and travels on to some where ?

I believe in the afterlife. For somethings have happened to me in my life to "wake me up". Suddenly stopping the car in the middle of the road because something "told "me to(a feeling) and out comes a kid running across the street. This feeling has happened quite a few times and a long as I did follow my gut all was fine. If not I was sorry later. So a vote here for afterlife, you follow your heart .

Definition: Energy is the capacity of a physical system to perform work. Energy exists in several forms such as heat, kinetic or mechanical energy, light, potential energy, electrical, or other forms.

According to the law of conservation of energy, the total energy of a system remains constant, though energy may transform into another form. Two billiard balls colliding, for example, may come to rest, with the resulting energy becoming sound and perhaps a bit of heat at the point of collision.

-http://physics.about.com/od/glossary/g/energy.htm

Yes I do believe of life after death. I think that gives us a way to keep improving on our lives. there are things in my life to hard to explain otherwise. Sometimes in my subconsence mind I feel like I have done this or been there before, when actually this would have been my first time. to like de je vou

What a nice idea, that this life is only the infancy of life itself. It makes you wonder if there is a "magician in the sky" and if so why he didn't just pull a heaven out of his magic hat and stop waving his magic wand there. Why he had to act imperfect by making imperfect things like Earth.

On another note, why do most people fear death when they are convinced they go to heaven when they die? I mean if its such a great place why do people wear seatbelts and look both ways before crossing the street? You would think that if they truly beleive in a soul and a pleasent afterlife then this life surely (to them) would be some kind of a hell and something to escape from. get it over with quick like a band-aid so to speak.

It wont gain me popularity but that's just the way i see it.

Yeah that is why i think those who believe in such things as religions, condemned all their life with fear to do things right in base of their beliefs, living a life of fear and restricted to live it to the fullest, not knowing for certain what lies after death, becoming prisoners of their own beliefs and idealistic morals. I believe one should live in base of what they feel is right, not what others make you think its right, once you have the maturity to think how everything works and what to really believe, question where they are standing and why, most of the people just are ignorant robots that simply accept everything that they are taught. But i guess that comes with the process of raising your childrens, Coming to think about it, sounds like a perfect plan to make the world a "better place", you raise what you will have in the future, Robots controlled by fear.

All people who live their lifes through religion are not restricted by such ideals, Every religion and bases of structure is different. Guide lines that society puts on individuals have more restrictions than religion based faiths.

Death on all walks of life religion or strucure is percieved different. even the afterlife thoughts that dwell within ones mind.

Unexplaniable yet rationalized in thoughts of what could be on the other side.

yes because energy as with matter can not be destroyed only converted from one for to another .. so it must be with out essence

And once again I find myself pointing to my post about energy...

~Cadamia~
What ~L6M66~ is trying to say is that you do transfer that energy to another state of matter, but not the way you are thinking of, your body decomposes and seize all your organic compounds for others organism to feed from, say "maggots" and other scavengers, or it could break down to ashes to the point of minerals to enrich the soil, depending the way it decomposes its how it will play the roll in the energy transformation cycle, its like what happens in the water cycle to put it in a more complex example, When the element of water in the ocean its put under temperature pressure and it reaches its boiling point it rises to the clouds as an evaporation phase, when the gas particles get to a certain level of saturation it changes in water droplets and it’s called precipitation phase, eventually the cloud will not hold many droplets so it will condense and falls down as rain once more, the water did not disappeared but transformed in to different variation, That Law he putted there explains how every matter in the know universe say, star, galaxies, a rock, a person, scrap metal, everything reaches to an end and the energy it releases can change/transform into another compound/action, may it be gaseous, liquid, kinetic force, potential force, matter etc , that energy transfers into different ways depending on the nature of the elements decomposition, if your body dies you are not going to be floating like a spirit because of that energy, your body dies and it breaks apart so other organism or soil enriches/benefits itself, that energy you speak of is not astral/spiritual, for what we know. That reminds me of an article I once read that talks about how people tried to explain how much the soul energy weights and because the corpse weights certain pounds less when you die they correlated that to the souls energy weight, then scientist explained that when someone dies all the mechanical body functions stops and all the kinetic energy(movement) that takes the blood to circulate the organs to function and electric purses of the brains stops that is what makes it weight less in the point of a body decomposition, and often people thought it was the spirit energy that left the body.. lol

I believe in an afterlife, whether it be heaven or hell. Both are there for those who believe or do not believe. The truth is in people's hearts. Do you really think you'll be gone after you die?

It is the assurance that I am living this life.

No there is no assurance, reminds mo of the story where the man relives his life and the last thing he knows is the rope snaps his neck.

What if we are on our death beds and the life we see is actually recurring from the life we once had.?

I think it stems from the fear of death that these ideas become based on other realms after death.

Of course it does. No one wants to die. It's built into our genes to avoid death at all costs. It's not at all surprising that people who didn't understand dreams, death, or other phenomena of the mind would come up with strange, supernatural explanations for them. What else does one do when faced with such a terrifying phenomenon? They make up an explanation. Don't understand thunder and lightning? It must be Zeus, king of the gods, throwing his bolts from the sky...

There are different ways to look at life after death. Some of you guys hit it right on the nose. Life is like an acting role. When this role is over, there will be another role for you to play.


You may see your body, you may see your knowledge as a costume. The body is but a costume, covering your consciousness. The knowledge is but a script which you use to portray in this life, but your consciousness is you, and you endure as that great actor, or actress in consciousness, regardless of what happens to the role or to the costume.

I truly believe that is the ultimate security.

If you also wish to have that kind of ultimate security so that when threats come into your consciousness, when your role is threatened, when all the body of knowledge that is accumulated in your experiences is seen as a script for this life, and when the physical body that you have acquired through nurturing, eating exercising and attending, is available to you, and when these two things are threatened with extinction, you may wish to preserve them, and you may do all you can to preserve them, but it is important that you not be terrorized inside if they are threatened, for your consciousness endures, and that consciousness is the ultimate you, for these things are your past life when the curtain is drawn, and you may have future lives and roles and scripts for you.

And if you no longer are terrorized or threatened or fearful or worried about previous lifetime that you lived, when things didn’t go well, and again, it may occur that when this lifetime loses, when this play is over, you may lament and be saddened to see this end: the final certain of one great glorious play, but it is only the beginning of the next great play yet to come. Until you find out who you truly are.

So, I would suggest that you put away terror and fear regarding your life and death. Get into living fully; living your life to the fullest in accordance with the values that are the Highest and Best and not those that are based on fear, religion, and terror, for those values that are based on fear, relgion, and terror tend to drag down the soul, tend to weaken the soul, tend to diminish your capacity and ability to serve as true deities whom you can be, whom you descended from, whom you truly are, when you rise above the petty self.

Your Higher Self IS Cosmic Consciousness! Become cosmically conscious and you will have no further fear. You will be guided to play the role you are most needed for in this lifetime. You will be guided to discover the knowledge, to witness, to share the knowledge, to help others gain the knowledge they need to develop their Higher Self.

To make a long story short, there is no Heaven or Hell. Whatever you want to do in this world or the next you cannot only do but also create it.

I personally subscribe to the afterlife theorum, for humans death is only part of the journey i believe.

I believe that everyone possess not one, but two souls (conscious and unconscious) and upon death they divide, the conscious loses it's memories and go on to new experiences (reincarnation) and the unconscious becomes stuck in heavenly or hellish dreams built out of it's own memories.

i believe death takes you on a journey on a differant plane of exsistance and it is the beginning of a differant life ...its just an idea i have about how death works i have no proof for being right or wrong on this but i know i felt all dreamy like when i had a near death exp.

quite honestly, none of us know for sure what happens after we die. But guess what, You are going to die. I am going to die. Your family, friends, fish, lizard... hell even that cutie you flirted with is going to die. It is quite inevitable. We can sit here and discuss the topic and share our views (which is great and all) but I believe what I want from my experiences and Dabbler believes what he wants from his knowledge and experiences and so on and so forth. I know Death is coming for me some day. I know that I've led a good life and done good things for people, whether or not I gain some kind of Karmic reward doesn't matter. If I die, and nothing is carried over, then at least I know that I'm dying with respect and good will. Death is inevitable people. You are not a vampire, werewolf, mummy, or any other mystical creature. You eat, sleep, drink, love, cry, feel pain just like the rest of us. And guess what, you're going to die too!

Peace

Yes, I believe in an afterlife. The ghosts among us have convinced me. Heaven and hell, not so much. Why? That's what my "gut" tells me and believe me, I've learned to trust it. As one of our "unknowns", the most controversial and unknowable, it certainly makes for good debate but until we each reach it, or don't, well...let the debate rage on...

yup...i do believe in reencarnation and some sort of afterlife.
why? its my explaination of children with memories of dead people, and of ghosts (of which i have seen one, and experienced more).
if you dont believe it...no skin off my nose.
if im wrong...frankly no skin off my nose either.
:c)
pax yall
~W~

I belive that there is an afterlife. Since I belive in God, I belive that is where most likey I would go. Not saying that in perfect, just saying that is where I'll be. I would be seeing those of you who do belive there to.

i dont believe in god, rather i believe we are all gods.
after life is not an after life, we had many lives prior to the one we "exist" in as we see. Death is gonna be unimaginable and even beyond peoples dreams.

Im a christian but i dont judge anyone. My answer is simply this. Once you pass away you are sent to heaven or hell based upon your actions and the way you lived your life here on earth. You either serve the devil and get tortured for his sick pleasure while your flesh burnes from your skin. While your in hell you will have all of your senses to feel, see, smell, taste, ect. and you will feel everything that happens to you. OR if you go to heaven you will be a beautiful angel in the sky above us. You will be Gods friend and sing happily everyday and walk by his side. No work needed in heaven. Its already perfect!!! Im sure people who read this will either agree or disagree but hey its a forum post its for your thoughts and thats what i think. ^_^

I don't believe in anything, I only hope.

Hope that if there's an afterlife it'll be better than this one, otherwise I prefer to cease to exist.

Everytime I come in here in either name the debates are nothing more than the same old people saying the same kinds of things (for the most part, not all) and certain ones are very predictable in wording and demeanor (and misspelling even though we all make typos). I do not like what I say to be copied and pasted and then answered like I am in a chatroom or a child. One should be able to address issues without that. I honestly don't care if you are a skeptic or believer in an afterlife. I will respect your view and I don't need mine torn apart because on this topic there is no right answer. WE don't know, we believe certain things from our own personal experiences or belief systems.

No one knows what death is really. It is the cessation of electrical responses of the brain or some say vital functions. I have a problem with that. There have been numerous cases of someone being declared dead and waking up minutes later. (don't ask me to cite all of them because I am not going to do that) Luckily for them they hadn't been taken to the morgue as yet. Science has set parameters for what they believe to be death. It's obvious to me that isn't quite right but we haven't discovered any better way to decide this factor. There are far more correct pronouncements than incorrect but the fact that they can be wrong is very shocking to me.

I feel no belief in life after death or belief by religious means or paranormal beliefs as so many want to poo poo in here is anymore viable than the other. We don't know what the paranormal is. We have inklings but there are some folks that I could say here are wasting their time debating on the topic. You would have to die before you would even believe any shred of evidence that points in any direction.

When the body ceases to be functional there is an inkling that there may be an essence of that person that leaves; that it is merely a vessel holding a non-physical form. Sort of a symbiosis to be able to function on a physical plane. If it is true that everything is energy then it follows logically to me that we just release that portion of us that is non-physical to move on to other things. As for a heaven or hell that is man's explanation of what will happen for the deeds they do in the physical. That I couldn't comment upon because it is generally based on either religion or NDEs. Some factions believe we create our own reality, then perhaps we go to a place we have created for ourselves, who knows, I certainly don't, but I do have beliefs about it. I believe it is thought generated. All I will say on that area.

There is a lot of anecdotal evidence from NDE's and from paranormal experiences of loved one's dying for me to believe I will live on but it is not in the way we think of as alive. OBEs also if a real manifestation, show there are at least two bodies, one physical and one non-physical. (based on whether you believe in them) Death seems so finite but it is nothing more than a word that is used to describe when the body stops functioning. Could it be wishful thinking or anything else in that ballpark? Sure it could be but like those who believe via a belief system or metaphysical views, there is more evidence for some of these explanations I think, than against. Speak with Dannion Brinkley or read case studies of Dr. Melvin Morse. He has done numerous NDE studies and many with children who have not as yet formed any opinion about the afterlife. Some say it is the brain that causes a sort of dreamlike state while in the death process, but why then do many of these children have similar experiences with no indoctrination into what the word even means fully?

This man is among many others including Dr. Thelma Moss who passed in 1997, who said this and was "Adamant that "none of us none of us, is made completely of matter" and the life's great value is in "our own awakening," she appears a turbocharged Doris Stokes, but took satisfaction in the' 1976 Douglas Dean award from the UN for bringing the Soviets' Kirlian photograph, to America." Dr. Thelma Moss Ph.D., was an international authority on parapsychology. Dr. Thelma Moss, was a research psychologist at the Neuropsychiatric Institute of the University of California, Los Angeles at one time. She was essentially a Parapsychologist. "Parapsychology is a discipline that seeks to investigate the existence and causes of psychic abilities and life after death using the scientific method." She was doing this at UCLA. The reason she left was due to the Entity case from what I understand. (I do not know for sure as it could have been a rumor)

Read about Elizabeth Kubler-Ross and her studies on death and dying. She passed in 2004 (some say she is still alive, lol) but there is a foundation continuing her work.
http://www.deathreference.com/Ke-Ma/K-bler-Ross-Elisabeth.html

If you look on the net you will find many nay sayers in regard to these women and others who study death and dignitaries in the field of science who respect them. Unfortunately though, death is paranormal in its nature at this time. Yes, I believe in an afterlife as much as anyone who can who doesn't remember the death experience. I have a hard time believing all those who say they do OBE easily due to having studied Monroe's researches and others of the same ilk. I feel I do them in dreams but I am even hard to hypnotize, my brain is so active. So to try to get to any rememberances from a regression or something of that nature would be difficult for me. My ideas are purely from belief and studies. No I am not pious, meaning not "marked by conspicuous religiosity, marked by sham or hypocrisy or showing loyal reverence for a person or thing." I have none of these things. I just believe something because of my personal experiences and other things I have delved into. I am not a follower of a person but I respect when someone has at least done more than just conjecture and I believe I have a fairly open mind, well most of the time :)

I settle for a final hallucination. To me, beliefs people have are nothing more then "soft ware", so when people press such absolutes on others, I see that as throwing static in their "soft ware".

As far as I can tell from every post I read it is the skeptics that are forcing their viewpoints toward anyone that has one. I don't see any absolutes here, only individual beliefs expressed that should be respected, mine being I believe in a life after death for things I have studied, read, personally experienced and the like. That is my view and not relevant to anyone else. I respect Christian views that have been expressed because they could hardly call themselves that if they didn't believe in such a way. I think the question was what do we believe and why and not what do you believe and how many ways can you tell others theirs are ludicrous.

I sincerly do not press my beliefs as a skeptic I do not subscribe to beliefs, for community social networking, and support I find religion, and metaphysics offer to those who devote to or study in moderation.

What presses the issue is the grand sensationalism that is perpatrated on others that have different beliefs, or are content without subscribing to beliefs.

Personally I hsllicinated a horizonless expanse with a fiber optic like cord , as blips of light zoomed over head, and shadows loomed across the ground, attached to , and anchored by all that which they could not let go of, or those that cannot let go of them.

:sen·sa·tion·al·ism

1 : empiricism that limits experience as a source of knowledge to sensation or sense perceptions
2 : the use or effect of sensational subject matter or treatment

How does one decide what that is unless one makes a judgment? I have never said this here prior but quite frankly I think constant skepticism is a way of grandstanding for attention. This remark is no different than the ones I have been seeing by certain skeptics. It is fine if some say I don't know for lack of evidence or they believe there is nothing after death and leave the platform open for others with a different opinion and why.

Empiricism:

1 a: a former school of medical practice founded on experience without the aid of science or theory b: quackery , charlatanry
2 a: the practice of relying on observation and experiment especially in the natural sciences b: a tenet arrived at empirically
3: a theory that all knowledge originates in experience

I don't think anyone has implied that totally but that it is apart of something that cannot at this time be measured by science. Parapsychology is a means of transcending between both of these views, but I just presented this aspect and I don't expect anyone to believe it if it goes against their beliefs to do so. It was merely food for thought and what it is. I don't know what it takes in here to be taken seriously or how many degrees and experiments must be made by those in the academic world to be taken seriously.

This is my last post on this topic because the thread was not followed as asked by some and merely ended up a critique of others beliefs. Death in MY opinion cannot be judged by science except as far as declaring someone is dead. If they could, they would know if anything lies beyond what they have declared as such. Since there is no information other than empirical or personal viewpoint; spiritual beliefs and such, I think that puts an end to something that really wasn't suppose to be debated but merely and succintly stated as to what the individual believed and why and why not and not what others think about the viewpoint. Many did just that. These are all subjective by opinion. I don't exactly believe in either way but a combination of many factors. I stated what I believed personally and why and have no problems with anyone else's beliefs and would never say someone is silly because they don't agree with mine. Subjective: modified or affected by personal views, experience, or background. I am disgusted with these constant diatribes that go on in here relating to people answering from different perspectives. Rather than let it be someone's rightful answer they are critiqued when none is requested by the person who started the thread. No one was asked if they agreed with anyone's opinion here. I am done with this one Doru. I apologize for digressing and it was a good topic if it was only allowed to be answered by each person without someone making rude comments on each person's point of view or some of them, whether it was scientific, paranormal based or religious and how they don't believe in this or that. I saw no request to answer why someone didn't believe in someone's belief system. There are ways to answer without doing that. I personally feel most skeptics are simply closed minded. Again I apologize and will not intrude on your thread any longer, there is no use.