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I had a conversation with Waza, trying to explain that you can be a "vampire" and a vegetarian.

He obviously found it so funny, that he started a thred about it, without even mentioning who he got the message from.

So I thought I would actually ask a question. Why do so many people scoff at the idea of a vegetarian vampire?

i guess because there is a draw to meat... m'lord loves a barely cooked steak and to me there is something so primal about that... i dont really like red meat and have done the vegan thing once or twice... maybe its because they see vamps as so barbarian... have you seen the movie "Shark Tales"? I guess it is just about as shocking as that shark being a vegitarian

coz the first image that pops in their minds is that of a blood drinking vampyre ;)

Sharks eat fish.
Therefore yes, that would be unusual.
We however are omnivores with a right to choose.

Not every person whoe eats meat is a vampire, so why should every vampire eat meat?

vampirism is a utilisation of energy, not eating steaks.

Drinking blood is not eating meat though. He likes the steak raw because he enjoys the blood juicing out of it, not the actual meat itself.
There is nothing wrong with this type of vampirism, and theres more to it than drinking blood anyways.

OK Lordvampirio...

What is the first image you get in your head of a blood drinking vampire?

Probably of them drinking HUMAN blood... not eating a chicken casserole.

I don't see one single reason a vampire couldn't be a vegitarian...

We've already came to the conclusion that 90% know that vampires like in the books don't exist... at least not totally...

Most people who believe in vampirism have to realize to the rest of the world, your saying your that old fashion sterotype..

No, Im not saying that Im that old fashion streotype. I dont know f that was what you where syaing, but if you are, then you must undestand that I am totally against that form of "life"

ahhh ok... are you a psychic vampires?

echo has some good points

*nods* I really didn't mean to imply anything.... just wondering what wrong with being a veggie vamp

People just don't associate one with the other. In fact, people tend to think its a rather huge impossibility. I, on the other hand, don't think its strange at all. But thats just me...

nothing, its the preconvieved notion that vampires are all carnevours

Echo....That was a stupid attempt from his side in order to get some blimming attention which explains why I got ticked off.....
I stated something on his thread which I don't usually do but I guess it was called for...

Echo on that thread I joked at the term not the meaning.. as I mentioned I agreed with your ideas, so believe me when I tell you that no offence was intended, it was rather to hype up some spirit, anyhow I see how some are hollow enough in their brain cavities to misunderstand (no, not you Gorey don't worry)..so I'm making this straight here & now.. I love you guys :)

oh...such a squish squish moment......
I can sense a group hug!

What I think of when I hear vampire is a being that takes its sustenance for sentient life forms. Be it through the blood, the life force, or the devouring of the soul.
So a vampire getting such from a plant ammuses me.

It entirely depends on the type of vampirism you are talking about.

I will still firmly argue my beliefs that you cannot be a sanguine vampire and a vegetarian.

Which would also be the reason most would scoff at the mere mention of a vegetarian vampire. Sanguine vampires tend to be the first thought at the mention of vampirism.

Ok, so here are my thoughts. Maybe people think Veggie and Vampire don't mix because it's the vegetarians respect for life that does not allow them to feed on living (or dead) creatures... But vampires just need prey, no matter if we are talking about blood or meat here anyway.

Vegetarian does NOT mean respect for life.
Many vegetarians choose this diet for that reason, but far from exclusively.
Vegetarian means excluding animals as food.

OK, but for what reason?

to each his own. The concept of a vampire is simply a life sucking (or just energy draining/using) entity so you can have a vegetarian vampire in theory.

They find it funny cause they believe we are living in the Buffy the vampire slayer series.

Anyway if someone drinks human blood,why it has to drink animal blood as well?

That doesn't mean he is going to kill the human and cooking it after he sucked from it!

Sheesh!*shakes head*

this is for T.D. if they feed off of lifeforce they don't need blood therefore they can just eat veg. and the deff. of Sanguine / sanguin / sang vamp(ire):
These are shortened forms of the term "sanguinarian". See "sanguinarian".
Sanguivore:
A term that I am seeing more frequently, used to define sanguinarians, but which I feel is inaccurate, as sanguinarians do consume more than just blood. I would strongly recommend using the term to refer to those who consume only blood, and nothing else, as their main source of sustenance. I have not encountered any tangible proof that such individuals do exist, and I feel that this is highly unlikely.

in my opinion... vegetarianism is a choice thing. if somebody chooses to eat fish... that's fine. if a vegetarian thinks they can drink blood... that is fine.

it's a personal thing. so stop arguing about it all and respect peoples opinions.

I feel educated. Thanks dad.

Dethnitegirl- As usual, I agree with you.

ToiletDuc- I drink human blood, and I do that with consent. Thats makes me happy. I do not however kill animals or eat them. I dont like it. You have your belief and I have mine. Both make us happy.

Mslefaye- If you learnt how to read a post, you would notice that I never said that I feed off plants.

Lordvampirio is right.... the reason the common person would think its strang is because they dont assume you mean a physic or elemental or sex ect. vampire.....and if someone does drink human blood...they arent a true vegitarian..... humans are animals vegitarians arent suppossed to eat animals in any way.... how ever you personally drink milk from cows thats somthing FROM an animal....is blood like milk????

mm veggy vamps...lol... its funny but.. hey vamps had to live on animals like rats when they didnt find humans:P

I don't really see a problem of a vegeterian vampire. I guess is hard to believe that is possible for some people. I mean even sharks eat plants. I mean that what a friend of mine said anyway, that there are some vegeterian sharks. But fish is not meat though is it? I heard is not but I thought that maybe is a different type of meat.

haha, vampires aren't vegetarians just because that makes a simile. haha, that is the stupidist thing I have ever heard in my whole life. Your joking aren't you. ROFL

You say that it's the stupidest thing you heard in your entire life just for the simple reason that you Don't have a life!

im a vegitarian

lol, feed off plants

Ok, I posted in Waza's thread, I will post in here...
Echo, dear, There is nothing wrong with being a vegiterian vampire. I know that you know this and I know you wouldn't let anybody else alter your morals. I applaud you for that. I have done the vegiterian thing... I did it for 7 years. I am also a sanguine vampire. There is nothing wrong with having strong morals and sticking by them. Consent is consent, and if you don't have or can't obtain that consent, why do it? If that's what you believe that is. If not, why let it bother you? Why try to push your beliefs on another person? Nobody likes that... which I see all over. If you want to know anything else, go look at my post in Waza's thread... xo :)

hee hee, I kinda made it look like Echo is pushing her beliefs on every one else... I didn't mean it like that. Sorry! There's just too many people getting upset about this. Remember... Respect!

i agree, everyone is entitled to thier opinion and/or beliefs-they should be respected if you believe them or not.

You sure did make it sound like she is though she isn't...And this is all about respect

Like always....your tongue needs a spanking party dear....

helloooooo

Honestly I don't see why people are getting upset. Is it peranoia or what? 'Cause that seems to be common among human life as well as ingnorance. Not like I'm saying anything bad about anyone here I'm just saying is pretty common that's all.

mm...hi?

Forgive me for being a little simple minded.

I like moonlit's post.

Yeah, my post really sounded like I was agreeing with Echo at first then bashing her. My mind was just going too fast... I couldn't keep up and it just flowed all together and I didn't separate my paragraphs. lol... bad me. Sorry about that every one!

XxVampre- Let me explain this to you.
My version of vegetarianism is that I don’t like eating animals, and I don’t drink their blood. I also like drinking the blood of humans, and the people I dirnk from like it too!

Therefore, I am a vegetarian because I have moral standards, but when people, with the voicable autonomy, say that they don’t mind it, then that’s fine.

Im keeping MY moral standards, and personally don’t really mind what your view of a vegetarian is, I kow that I am happy with my beliefs.

Blacksoulvampire- We have totally different definitions of vampires.

Merton- This is my belief. I dirnk blood, but I don’t drink animal blood. I don’t eat meat either. Personally, I was hoping for a more intelligent answer than calling me stupid, but it sounds like you aren’t capable of much more… Non Mortus Est is always a good judge of character!

MoonlitBlood- I know you weren’t saying I was pushing my beliefs, and I am not… but when people talk about a message I sent someone, I like to be able to express my reasons.

HalfBreed- Well, I’m not getting upset :-) this is just a discussion!

Like I said in the other post, blood is blood, regardless of the species (be it human or animals). A vegetarian vampire cannot, or will not, consume living beings, and to have a vegetarian vampire drinking blood from a human being is highly hypocritical.

We are animals; We just have a mind capable of thought and ideas. That is the only difference.

So, unless you are a psychic vampire, there is no way in hell you can be a vegetarian vampire as long as you drink BLOOD.

I have said this THREE times now.

I do NOT like eating animals. I dont like their degrading treatment for our own gastronomic delectation.

However, I have no problem with drinking human blood, the one species on the planet who gets CONSENT fully as to what happens to them.

So, are you sayingt hat all vmapires have to drink the blood of animals for you to repsect them?

*shrug* The literal meaning of vegetarianism is a person who refrains from eating or drinking ANY living being's meat and/or blood. Regardless of consent.

What can I say, I take things literally.

Addendum: I am not trying to upset you or anything. It is just my opinion, and I am entitled to it.

Everybody has their own opinions. Your opinion is what you see is best for you, so really, no one can argue with that. They can only tell of their own opinion.

I hope this doesn't bring forth any problems between you and I.

Well, my opinion is that I "dont hve a chance in Hell" of being what I am.

It is a matter of perspective.

if it's a matter of perspective... why are you telling people exactly what a vegetarian is?

surely if it's a matter of perspective then people should just do what the hell they like

Actually, the definitation of vegetarianism was an different matter, as it stands true and is a fact.

My perspective comment is based on the fact that not everyone agrees with a solid definitation, even if it is true and logical.

I stick with the literal facts and meaning of words. For others, it's a matter of perspective. I was merely "agreeing" with her based on that.

taking things literally only leads to trouble... as there is always more to it.

i just think this entire thing is silly.

to each their own and nobody should challenge that.

Really I agree with Gorey.

You're right...

*shutsup before her mouth gets her in more trouble than it already has*

My personal view on all that has been said, is that we are dealing with an oxymoron. So from taking just the statement "vegetarian vampire" most of us get confused and then make our own thoughts based on our own beliefs...

Personally I do find it funny ~ but only because we live in such an era that we define something as such... do I think there are veggie vamps- you bet. But the phrase is still, well silly in my view. *giggles*

To be a vegetarian means, at least to me, to not eat animals. It's all about the animals and to have respect for them. It has got nothing to do with humans! There's a difference between drinking human and animal blood, animals can't give their consent as humans can.

Is this really so hard to accept and understand? I can't see why there should be a problem with being a vegetarian vampire at all.

Both sides have made good points on this subject so maybe everyone should agree to disagree

I agree with you, Echo. Actually, I agree with you on every part of what you have been saying. There is NOTHING wrong with choosing to not eat or drink animal meat or blood rather or not there is a consent issue, and still drink human blood. It's still your choice to eat what you want and drink what you want. Why every one is arguing with you and each other about it, is quite goofy, in my opinion. Rather or not most people like it, that's how some people are... "vegan vampires." Nobody can make anybody eat any kind of animal just cause they disagree with them. On the flip side, no one has the right to say that you are not a vampire just cause you won't eat animals. Like I said, I did it too. And yes, private message or not, you have the right to voice your opinions. :)

As long as you don't comsume meat it makes no difference.

i think that it is odd but not impossible.
i do not see any reason that a vampyre could not be a vegetarian.

echo, you pose an interesting quandry...

but, there was a thread about being a "true vampire", they are reanimated dead, that need "human" blood or energy to exist. so they would have no need for food of any kind, meat or vegetable. I guess that would make them "hemotarians".

so I guess a vampire could be a vegaterian...

As I said in the other vegetarian vampire thread, a vampire can definitely be a vegetarian because a vegetarian does not consume meat. While blood does come from living specimens, you don't have to kill them in order to get it, and meat and blood are two different things all together. All they share is a common bond.

I agree to disagree :D

looking at both threads... why can't people just understand personal choice.

i understand that this will get closed probably very soon. Echo is in bed, so I'm going to TRY and post for her, this isn't her speaking and it isn't what she would say, this is what I think she would say. but i can't be exact as we aren't the same person.

Basically, Echo doesn't eat meat because she thinks it's cruel to animals. she's felt this way for about 5-6 years i think and sticks to it brilliantly and i completely admire her for it because i don't think it's a moral decision i would've made.

I'm pretty sure that's her only reason. Now what if all the chickens or cows we ate could talk. what would they say?
"no don't kill me"
"i've got years to live"
"take my eggs not my flesh"
"take my milk not my eggs"

you see the cruelty and everyone understands that. it doesn't HAVE to be cruel but in most cases... it is.

But if the cows and chickens could talk, and said to Debbie "it's fine if you want to eat me" it wouldn't be considered cruel. as it would be a wish for the cow to be eaten.

ok... sounds a little farfetched but i'm trying to put the point across about consent. If both parties agree to it, it can't be cruel to extract the blood from a person. as there is consent. and therefore a feeder would not feel the same about this process as they would eating meat.

If this thread is still alive when Echo gets up... I'm sure she'll either tell me off. add to this or something. But if not I hope this does the job and makes people see exactly what she means.

because right now it looks like people are taking the piss out of her beliefs and i think it's pathetic AND wrong.

if that is what u r then so be it i think

i think that there is nothing wrong with this you can be a vampire and be a vegetarian at the same time you are eating meat when you drink blood, blood is not meat there for you aren't breaking any rules that would not qualify you as being a vegetarian.

You couldn't be a blood drinker and a vegan though.

Bloodrose said it well...

Ok, I've spent the majority of my college and uni career studying biology, animal science, and nutrition... so let's look at this schientifically:

1. Blood intrinsically contains protien.
2. Blood cannot be obtained from a non-animal source; therefore the protien could be classified as animal protien by nature.
3. Cannibals are not considered vegetarian.
4. Blood can be obtained without killing the donor - similar to eggs and milk.
5. If egg protien and milk protien are considered vegetarian acceptable protien sources, it stands to reason that blood protiens would be as well.
6. Eggs eaten are NOT fertilized and therefore do not contain LIFE. Milk of course is not a living thing (disregard any bacteria - microbial protien is vegetarian friendly).
7. Blood was once a part of a living animal... I'm not sure if this classifies it differently than the eggs and milk which while possibly containing living things are not in and of themselves living.

Vegetarianism (not veganism) is characterized by the ability to eat animal by-products (milk, egss) without consuming animal flesh. There doesn't neccesarily have to be any killing of the animal to feed on it's blood. So, with care, no flesh need be consumed.

Therefore I would hazard that blood drinking, and vampirism, can be a vegetarian process IF no actual flesh (skin, muscle) is consumed BUT can never be classified as vegan.


I wonder how you'd have to prepare a victim to make blood kosher!!!!!!

*looks up and winks* great post. Very informative.
Echo, I think that the person that told you that just read too much Anne Rice. If you feed of energy, what does that have to do with you beeing a vegetarian?! And if you are a vegetarian because of (and I aplaude that) the theory you stand for, then, like it was already refered here, it has to do with consent, that animals, unlike humans, can't give.
What about vampires that feed of the energy of elements? Fire, water, ect. I heard it's a common practice in witchcraft. So, feeding of plants, trees, and other living organisms that produce vital energy doesen't seem so foolish to me. In fact, I think that we all 'feed' from the environment around us. Some notice it, some don't.
Let's not allow the stereotypes to leed us to put others down, shall we? Just because it's common folklore that the traditional vampire feeds of the blood and tears it's victim to peaces, is the first thing that comes to our minds (and I include my self in that group, because to be honest, it is the first thing that comes to my mind), let's not forget that no one knows everything, but we can always read and learn to know more.

"Vegetarianism is a dietary practice characterised by the consumption of only vegetables, fruit, nuts, grains and pulses, and excluding the consumption of all body parts of any animal and products derived from animal carcasses (such as lard, tallow, gelatin, cochineal), from one's diet. The most common definition of vegetarianism however accepts the inclusion of animal-based products such as honey, milk and other dairy products as well as eggs. ..."

Sanquinarians need blood. Hence....no vegetarian.

Formal definitions of vegetarianism and veganism are all well and good, but I think it's also worth considering the spirit of the practices. People often choose them for moral reasons, so the ethics of the situations must be taken into account. I would argue that to take blood (or other body fluids) from a willing donor is different from taking it from an animal because of the ability to give consent. The basic tenant of vegan philosophy is the prevention of animal cruelty, and it doesn't seem that the willing donation of blood violates the spirit of the philosophy. I'm not a vegan. This is just my cursory analysis of their philosophy. I'm going to write them and ask.

My problem is that blood, like milk, honey and eggs, does NOT have to be taken from a carcass. It can be taken from a live donor.

Also, eggs contain traces of animal blood anyway.
And many vegetarians have no problems eating jello or lollipops, both of which contain gelatin.

I guess it really depends how strongly you keep your diet.

Oh I agree. I'm not saying the philosophy isn't flawed. They made it up though, so they're entitled to stipulate their own beliefs.

Are you a vegetarian vampire?? If so...worry not what others think....

Ok reading through the posts, I have to now say... no I don't think you can be a veggie Vampire.
Everyone made such good points and can't see them being wrong.

*bump* I love to read about Veggie Vampires :) The only one I have heard of so far is Count Duckula *grins*

Retro Emmy I love it :)

in don't being on myslef

Well, my insignificant thought is that Veggie Vamps can and do exist...As pretty much prooven by tclcttb. But, a moral is a moral...You either believe it/are able to agree...or don't believe it and would die standing for it...

But just one last thing....

Gorey...(I think you wrote this...i might be wrong)
"take my milk not my eggs"
??? How do you tie this in???

What concerns me with this thread is that Echo stated a view alright, much to be respected really, but having the expectance to convince anybody who has a different view makes this a pointless trial. I for one would never judge a person because he/she decided to follow a course I don't neccesarily agree with, but I'd expect to see that this thread is open to all sort of views about the issue, of course as long as these are not degrading or insulting. Having said this though putting in some humour doesn't mean one disrespect who you chose to do..it actually helps keeping the discussion lite. If you really believe in this, I encourage you to persue your course what ever it is as long it doesn't harm you or anyone else.

hehe btw Emmy... I do remember that toon LOL that was awesome..Duckula

YENDOR-

I am NOT trying to make anyone who disagrees with me change their minds... I am just putting my point accross in return. Its a discussion, and I value all the points that people have taken their time to give me... just because I prefer to discuss the point doesn't mean that I don't respect anyone elses opinions.

most vampires would scoff because of the fact to most here it would be a saying like milatary intellgence

SAHAHRIA- I agree with you. The term in itself does sound very amusing, until you think about it... but I suppose that is why its making such interesting discussion... the way different people interpret it.

BLOODROSE- Thats what I think :-)

DANZIG1330- I think thats true. I did agree to disagree months ago when I first made this thread... but its been brought back for some odd reason, but if people still want to tlak about it, then thats fine by me!

MOONLITBLOOD- I always like the way that you think about things, in a very open manner. I try to do the same, but things degrade into arguments in a lot of thread between a lot of people, as with all things on the internet... i think sometimes people think that diagreeing means trying to change others opinions. I don't try to change the opinions of others, but I liek to talk about them.

VAMPYRIC666- Thats my philosophy on the matter, but I like to hear what people on the 'flip-side' think too...

MINDWALKER- You bring up a very interesting point yourself, in the idea of definition. I personally consider HLV's rather than the actual traditional description. But as there are many different opinions on all things, then of course the definitions of vampires are very different. I think I may agree with you on that point of rference. On a side note, what do you believe to be the iriginal type of vampire in existence? How does that change your opinion?

To consider it, in the traditional description, a human could be a vegetarian, be turned into a vampire, and only live off the blood, and although they don't eat, they could still in a sence hold those values... but that would be a totally different thread :-P

JADEDMIDNIGHT- Very good way to put it. There are some tribes that do eat animals bit by bit while still alive for efficiency (or so I read once) but apart from that, we kill to eat, not to drink blood, which is a nice support. However, some vegetarians would Im sure disagree with me, and many non vegetarians too, as its all on the spirit of the matter...

GOTHICMANWHORE- I understand your point, but at the same time I don't agree with your definition of vegetarianism. I wouldn't kill a rat to drink its blood, and say that thats OK, but its different opinions for different people. Its consent and not believing that I have a "right to kil" which I was trying to explain, but still an interesting point to read. Have you ever been a veggie at all?

TCLCTTB- Fantastic post,a pleasure to read. Scientificaly I agree with you... sentimentally, I don't.

If a person is a vegan because they think its cruel to take the chickens eggs and the cows milk from them, and isn't happy with the process of taking a calf from its mother and utilising the milk, or taking the egs from the chickens, then it owuld be a different matter. To base consent as a basis for such actions, and getting consent from a feeder (personally, the one I feed off really enjoys it!) then two parties are happy, without any need to consider scientific classification. However, when considering it in that sence, then i would be considered as out of bounds of the vegetarian classification, which is why I wanted to bring it up into discussion in the first place, and I appreciate you bringing that informaiton into this.

TEARSOFARAKIEL- This is why I always enjoy reading your posts so much. I really like the way that you consider things, mixed with your own wide knowledge of what you discuss.

JASON- I exclude all of those things, icluding rennet and hydrolised proteins (unless they are specified.)

Once again, its a certain opinion, and I do appreciate your views on it, and perhaps in a different set of circumstances I would be inclined to agree with you, as its a very sound point, with more factual basis than my own . The dictionary is an accurate and informative guide to meanings, but not motivation. I have explained my motivation for my personal choice, and that is why I strongly believe that drinking blood from one donor who is very happy to do so, and actualy enjoys it, is not counted as the consumption of a meat product.

SOMNOLENTSIMACRULUM- I totally agree with you... it is, as I said to Jason along with you, the "spirit" of the motivation for doing so.

TCLCTTB- I don't eat white meat, red meat, fish, hydrolised proteins (unless specified) rennet, gelatine, lard, cochenieal. I didn't know that about eggs, which puts a spin on things... I do this out of respect for animas and wishing no harm to them, or for them to be used for one sole purpose, regardless of their happinness.

FALLENDREAMS- I don't, I just thought it would make interesting conversation :-) I don't want others to think that I am not willing to accept the opinions of others or that I am insecure about my choices, just that Im open to discussion on personal belief.

VAMPYRIC666- I don't personally think there is a right answer, its all a matter of opinion, and thats why I thought it would make a good thread.

MISTRESSDARE- I think Gorey was referring to vegetarianism in the sence of a cow wishing for their milk to be consumed rather than their lives... but I don't know how cows think, so I couldn't tell you.

LadyAmanda- A humerous comparisn, but i would prefer to hear your personal opinion.

i think because most vampires love blood and blood comes from meat..... and if your a veggiterian then you either feel sorry for animals there for find their blood nasty or you don't like the taste of meat which i think that all vampires like ( meat and blood)

I see your point, but I don't like meat. I just like the blood from a human, not from an animal, and that human gives consent to me, and wants me to do that... as i said before, thats where I stand on the matter, but I still like to hear all of your opinions. I'm sure that a lot, or maybe even the majority or "vampires" like meat, or maybe even take blood drom animals, but once again that is personal choice of what tpe of person you are and what paths you choose, and Im not going to slate that.

i hadn't heard of a veggie vamp till now. guess i have now. i don't know if i believe it or not. not really in the mood to open my mind right now. i guess i do because there are a lot of different things out there that i don't understand but i still know they are there.

..ok..

But but.... what about Count Duckula???

You've shatterd my dreams as a child I hope your awear of this :'(

Nice one Echo ;)