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Most religious mainstream doctrines are instructions about how we should behave within that religion.
At a very basic level it's all about belief and faith. The stronger your personal faith the less likelihood of straying.

It would seem that whatever criteria you use, it's almost impossible to say how happy you can be in one religion without living another.

I think the mainstream religions are under the microscope daily and they have stood the initial tests of time......

I don't have a religion, and I think that's the best religion. As for finding out your religion is false, I think that's complete crap. Who is to tell you your religion is false? I'm technically Jewish, and NO ONE can tell me it's "false" unless God himself/itself/whatever comes down and tells me so.


Otherwise you finding out your religion is false is YOUR own decision, opinion, and choice. No one can convince you that your religion is anything but YOU.

Hell..scratch that..if God came down and told me Jewdism is nothing but a joke, I STILL wouldn't listen.

V- are you saying that if you had an experience (angel showed itself/Goddess appeared/life changing bowel movement) you would poke your finger and say no way?

technically Jewish ?

you mean non practicing?

The last time G-d came down or sent someone down...well you saw the mess we made.

If my brain, body, and spirit was still in place and I could think 100%, then yes. That probably wouldn't be the case though, as I would be completely in awe and taken over in every way.

And yes, "technically" as in I don't practice it. I know it's in my blood though, and I know who I am. So I will still defend my religion even though I don't go through with it.

I think the religion one finds and seeks is best for that person. I do not push religion on those for this is a subject that meets with battle. I am sure the religion I choose is good for me.

So you are taking the position of "I don't practice but defend others to" or is it "I don't practice but will act as a proselyte"?

First, It is not for me to say what is right for anyone, let alone everyone.
My parents raised me Greek Orthodox, so on paper I am a Greek Orthodox Christian. I am a spiritualist. I'm not interested in organized religion. It is plagued with hypocracy. Recently an event in my life involving the church drove that point home. I haven't let go of the idea of a Higher Power...yet.

As for part two of your question: Are you asking if I for example believed in Allah and came to find out that JC is the only true god would I convert? Or if I was an athiest and found there to be a god would I change?

Here's what I think. The majority of the population has some sort of religion (last thing I read said 96%) Is it all the same God interpretted differently by each culture? Is one "God" better than another? So, If one is visited by God and they knew it was God isn't it a mute point?

The reality is in my opinion that most people would not abondon their faith no matter what they are shown. You can prove JC is the son of G_d as much as you can prove that Vampires don't exist.

To hold an idea as true despite all evidence to the contrary is an abdication of reason.

As everyone should know, this should not be a thread about "you are wrong and I am right" it is more about the process of finding the one that is right for you. And as an added bonus it is about finding that you have changed and no longer see your faith as the 'only way'. Times changed, people change, customs change. Without change things do not tend to grow, but become dogmatic.

Neither.


I simply know what I've been raised on and how I came about. I respect my roots and the life style by which I was put on my feet by.


Will I die for my religion? No..but no one will ever convince me that what I believe in in terms of my religion is anything but true and right.


Is Jewdism "right" for everyone? Noway..and I strongly doubt any religion is.


Every person has their paths..and those who go the other way and dare to think it is anyone's but their own decision and choice is a fool.

well I'm pretty much the same...but to say proselyte........

It's a bit like me saying, "you need to be Jewish to understand what I mean"

i prefer to remain non-religious, and not make an effort to find the one religion that will be correct...
frankly i think none of them are correct.

blood- but if I was not Jewish (and I am not) I would not have a clue what you were talking about if I was say Hindu or Wiccan. I understand that many people have been exposed to the mainstream religions at one point and time, but the specifics of those faiths are a mystery to most. Hell, I venture a guess that most of the people involved do not know that their faith professes.

Standard religions are dogma for sheep. Only a fool (or sheep) would follow them.

LAZ -


Sheep hold the world together. Without Sheep, there would be no barn, and no bread..and no big, warm bellies. Don't underestimate the foundation of this planet.

thats a good point vamp...

Pwyll -- you are probably right appertaining to the 'masses'. Even at higher levels it's only ever about interpretation

It's all about how much you believe in the religion. I do have a religion but I do not really follow it and well if your beliefs are strong then I guess that no one can convince you that it is not the right religion but it your beliefs in that particular religion is weak then anyone can convince you that it is the wrong one. If someone tells me that my religion is false I don't think that I would believe them because I would have a different belief than that person.

Just to clarify what I meant by "what if you found out that the belief you now hold turns out to be false? Would you change or drop your current beliefs in favor of another second best choice?"

It is more like, say, if you were a Heavens gate, Jones town follower, Manson (not the singer) acolyte etc. I mean these folks really believe what they think they believe.

It would be like me saying "I am god, I cannot die" I get lots of followers to believe me and then someone puts a bullet in me to prove I lied.

I feel that me religion has all the answers I need and IF I found out that it was false and made up I don't think I would change my beliefs b/c I feel that they have helped me survive this long. . ..

that is something that up to each individual i beleive we are all differnt and tend have different religions

Pwyll -


I don't think anyone can prove any mainstream religion wrong by the example you've brought forth.


I would, however, change my religion. Not because I don't believe in it anymore or believe in anther religion more, but just out of my own curiosity or lets say..for a loved one? I would still know that I'm Jewish at heart and always will be, but I have no problem with trying out something new..just for shits and giggles.


I would call it more of a new "practice" rather then a new "religion" though, and since I don't practice anything now anyway..it wouldn't hurt to go into a new a new practice anyway.

Like Vampirika i was raise Jewish, I still wear my star of David daily. My mother on the other hand was Catholic and I did go to all girl schools growing up. The Catholic religion told me I was going to hell for what I believed I really didn’t care. In my mind I have my own thoughts on what god/goddess/whatever wants me to believe, its my free thinking thoughts on what he/she gave me. So I believe in that rather its right or wrong that’s for me to say so no one else. There is no right or wrong its what you feel in you heart is right for you.

I wear my David's cross too. Not because it's "religious", but because it just gives me good luck. It gives me spirit and mind. Just for the simple fact that I've been raised wearing it. Do I believe in what it is and stands for? Nah...but the cross IS me, just because I grew up with it.

PoisonBelle~

hunni, you say mum was catholic, if that's the case then you are not Jewish unless it was by conversion!

I wear mine to show support for my family and ancestors who've died. plus my daddy bought it for me and its really pretty.

So BLOODLIFE what would happen if one of your parents is one religion and the other parent is another? What religion would you be?

I think if you believe in the words of someone who professes that they are immortal and then you see them get gunned down ... you just move on, as it's obvious that nothing has changed in the all important scheme of things

BLOODLIFE -


PoisonBelle said that she doesn't practice what she believes in, she just believes in it. That means she can believe in any God she believes in, despite what her family, friends, dogs, and cats believe in.

I know that i'm not stupid. my mom converted when they were married she was raised catholic though so yeah i'm Jewish and damn proud of it.

EmoDemon~

it wouldn't matter what religion your father is ... if your mother is Jewish, then so are you....

the fact that the marriage is mixed would mean the child is growing up in a non-religious enviroment and would probably need to find their own path once they can understand life.

Oh okay thanks Bloodlife, that clears things up.

Vampirika~

thats true, but with the Jewish faith...outside of a conversion it is pretty much exclusive and does rely on maternal heritage

and i did say she converted at marriage. please dont tell me what my family or myself is or isnt its very insulting.

Easy now people..these Threads can be get heated way too easily and shut down for drama. Just relax.


PoisonBelle mentioned that she doesn't practice any religion, she just believes in one. In my opinion, that gives her the right to believe in anything or anyone she wants. Conversion or not...

you said it after I posted, it's just a mis-understanding hun. It's good to be proud of your religion

sorry i get upset when people try and tell me about my family. if you would like me to explain message me and i'll tell you about it i got no problems with that.

Thanks Vampirika

I can't disagree more with you Bloodlife.

My Dad's Greek Orthodox and my Mom was Mormon.

I'm not Mormon, not one bit. I could have been had my parents chosen that for me, but they chose G.O.

Religion is aquired, not organic.

So much for this thread staying on topic.

TegoSanguisitim~

staying on topic was never going to happen .... I was just saying to a friend that since the rules seem to be relaxed on religious imput -- G-d help the Doms and admin...

But what is it that you dont agree with?

yeah its hard when we all go to reply at the same time. but its all good, i havent slept in the past 24 hours so yeah sorry.

and threads never stay on topic...although discussing your religion is on topic isnt it.

PoisonBelle~

I'm in total agreement with you there.

Well I am going to try to stay on topic here lol. I am an atheist and don't believe in any religion. I just believe in the natural wonders found in nature. It makes things simpler for me this way. Would that be considered a religion? lol

I think I overlooked part of the thread, because looking back at it I have no idea what I was trying to say.

I spoke with someone on this site who has been here for a long time. She said most of the people here hold a basic Judeo-Christian foundation for the most part. I forget if she mentioned any kind of numbers. I posted a poll not too long ago to this effect and it was skewed, so I am not sure what the deal was there. Any thoughts on this, since we seem to be sliding off topic?

I don't believe in one particular religion but have some things taken from many. In different times in my life I can turn more into a different religion. I don't know...I just follow what feels best for me.
I don't believe that my choice what to believe is for everyone, I don't push it to people who think otherwise. It is their free will to believe in what they want to. It's their life anyway. Of course until it doesn't violate my rights.
If I found what I believed in was false, I would think it over again and then would accept something different. I wouldn't stand just blinded just for the sake of being stubborn.

There are very many good and valid point raised here. Religion is very personal to the believer and all need to just practice exceptance of out differences.

Back to the original question - I was part of a religion for many years, and I believed with all my heart it was the "One." Over time, I came to see many instances of inconsistencies and hypocrasies. I began to feel that it was not, after all the "One." My response was after wrestling with the issues for about 10 years - I left this religion. Had my name removed from their records. I couldn't be a hypocrite and remain a member if I didn't believe what they taught. It would have been totally incongruent.

Given the type of site this is, I would have thought there would be more Pagan, Wiccan type religions on here instead of mainstream Judo/Christian.

I have discovered that there seem to be more 'church going' people in office on VR, be it admin or the dominars etc.

HOnestly, ive seen crap loads of religios people(including myself) all talking about guardina angels and everything. Which is sweet. But religion is supposed to make you happy. Make you feel better about yourslef (unless you catholic then they make you afraid to sin...no offense). But i though religion is supposed to give you a way out of being a complete shitbag and going to hell.

I'm an athiest filled with wonder at the cosmos. I'm comfortable in my nondirectional view. I distrust fundamentalists of any ilk, and would never foist my philosophy on anyone.

That said, I have noticed that almost all deep discussions of life and its subsets --- prison reform, politics, the mortgage crisis, feminism --- eventually reach a divide with belief and nonbelief coloration.

Would you change or drop your current beliefs in favor of another second best choice?

I cast around a bit but organized religion was not for me. That includes Wicca and others which don't consider themselves necessarily organized. Once you have a brand, you're not for me.

Second best is not a phrase I would use.

Rejecting one's parent's beliefs vis-a-vis religion is a good idea, I think.

I don't align myself with any religion, so I can't comment on the "one" but in regards to the other question, it would be impossible to prove that any religion is false or wrong. It certainly would simplify things if it could be proven though. Think about all of the people throughout history that have died in battle over religion. If there was any way to prove which was "the one" then all of that could stop.

Speaking as one without faith in a religion, I don't think that it is something that fits everyone or works for everyone. Many people need faith in a better afterlife in order to continue in a harsh and unforgiving world during this physical life.

In answer to your second question, yes, if someone could prove to me their religion's validity, I would perhaps accept it's tenets as well. However, proving the existence of a paranormal global oversite and proving your specific religious pantheon to me are two different things.

I don't believe my 'beliefs' are right for everyone, as everyone has a belief system thats works best for them.

And my current belief won't change, no matter what. Stubborness goes a long way.

Most religions use fear to keep people in line and control them. I do not let anything control me. I believe there are many forces out there, not just THE ONE... So no. This is just how I feel. I don't think it is right for everyone, and I don't try to push my views on anyone. To each his own.

Without trying to be subtle, I truly think that NO religion would be the best for the world.
Some might be upset realising that their lives don't mean anything, and that there is no true purpose to human existence.

But without religion, there would be one less thing to wage wars over. And the lack of religion would remove ridiculous moral reasons to improve upon human life, such as stem cell and cloning research.

With the human species aimed at a goal, without unrealistic notions hindering them, the goal could be achieved easily.

As for changing my view... well, there is little chance of that happening because the existence of god is impossible to prove scientifically.

Sorry, that was supposed to be:

"And the lack of religion would remove ridiculous moral reasons keeping us from improving upon human life..."

A beief system where you are told what you believe doesn't allow you to think for yourself. That's why those people get frightened at other belief systems. Instead of simply being told what to do, they now have to come up with their own answers. Any time we are exposed to new ideas, we may work them in to our beliefs. We have to learn and grow while we live. If something from a different religion hits a chord within us, we feel the rightness of it and there is nothing wrong with going with that. Life is learning and continually changing. Each persons beliefs are really as unique as that person.

I completely agree with XipeToltec. I think everyone's beliefs are really as unique in their own ways as everyone's DNA.

well, I was raised catholic, went around and studied other religions even to the point of joining some. did the new age thing for abit, then lukummi, eastern religions, wicca and other forms of paganism. what I discovered about myself is that I'm a spiritual person but not religious. I am a shaman and call myself an eclectic pagan.

Religion is a set of traditions to help people worship. Many belief systems have traditions and rituals.

Many of the belief systems have similar traits, such as belief in supreme beings, belief in the other side (heaven, astral plane, etc...) It is a personnal choice on which traditions suite you best.

I dont push my religious beliefs on anyone as well as they dont push them on me.

If i found out the beliefs i had were false I would seriously have to reconsider them

I do not follow a religion at the moment, as I find happiness in my independence from certain rules that I believe should never have been made.

It is within the power of an individual to make the decision whether or not a certain course of action is 'right' on his or her own terms. Religion, to a certain extent, makes decisions for you.

Does anyone not feel that most of the religions try to give out the same message?

Blood-No, I don't feel that they give out the same message. It would be nice to say yes, but I cannot in light of the interpretation most spin for their version of belief.

If you take Muslims for instance, since they are in the news weekly in a negative way, most moderate Muslims would say privately that suicide/homicide bombings are a bad thing. In public they are silent though. Why? Wrong is wrong.

Pagans/Wicca/anything not mainstream is considered evil and shunned. Even worse is the judgment that comes from it, loss of employment/friends/family/status are all real possibilities for those who profess these faiths in places like the bible belt in America.

If you are in places like Saudi Arabia you cannot have a bible or practice anything other than Islam, or you are beaten. If you continue you are killed or deported after a solid beating.

Bard~

I think you refer to the extreme elements in our society and shouldn't genralise until you read their holy books.
All religious societies will have their extremists and interpret their bible, sidda, koran literally...and miss the message so obviously.

I still don't think all religions try to give out the same message. They may all technically use the same "techniques", so to speak..but the messages aren't or shouldn't be the same.

I was raised as a baptist child..but as my parents never truly in any relgion we never went to church...

I belive that each relgion have good qualities about them..

I work with a person who lives his life on what god tells him to do....and frankly I just want to smack him

And recently all of these bible toting people have been coming to my door and basically giving me the look of i'm going to hell cause I have a child out of wedlock but I don't care I slam the door in their face and get on with my day...

Thank you for the info... it is very helpful...

I would have to completely agree with Cadrewolf.. As it is with anything in life.. just becuase its right for you doesnt mean it right for others. That is why we are all on our own journeys in life. To find what it is that best represents us no matter what it is..

I think that my choices are not exactly the best for every each individual, beacuse they(individuals) are all are different characters, and they desire different things in order to reflect their individuality in those.

I think the 'ONE' is exactly the right one, and I am very happy with that.

And, yes sure, in order to adapt further, I would make the best second choice if that is necesserry, wich is actually the first choice and another at the same time.

BLOODLIFE- I have read the Qur'an, it was not required for the work I did in the military, but is was very informative in the areas we visited. Additionally, I have formal training in a number of what the military labeled areas of concern and the cultures associated with those concerns. It is a cute way of saying formal briefings on what to expect from the badguys. Most of the finer points I am sure I have missed, but please unless you are well versed in the Qur'an do not assume that it is a religion of peace and misunderstood.

My concern is not, however, with Islam specifically. It is more geared for any religion or belief that you have taken hold of. If it is found to be wrong in some fashion (i.e. David Koresh, Heaven Gate etc) would you change your religion, or as some have said reevaluate it. Some might not, there are still Branch Davidians around and there are a number of 'dooms day' cults out there, just waiting to commit mass suicide to catch a ride on some celesial body.

If someone can truly disprove what I believe in, then yes, I will gladly believe in something else. That is highly unlikely though.

I know I am on the right path and would never change my beliefs, that is one good things we still do have freedom of choice in the lovely country that we live in.

V- let's suppose you believed in the Heavens Gate folks way of thinking. I mean they actually checked out of this life to catch a ride on a comet. Let's way that you were sick that day or did not manage to catch the right bus to get there and they 'left' without you. Would you continue to follow that path?

Or even the scenario I said earlier of a guy saying he was 'god' or the returned 'christ' or whatever and he was immortal (read the Highlander type of scence) you stab him in the chest at his request and he dies. If you really believed in him before that, would you continue down that path?

No I wouldn't, but then again, as I've mentioned before, most of today's mainstream religions wouldn't have those scenarios.


If I believed in something like that and it was proven wrong like you've said, then yes, I would stop believing in that without a doubt.

it is my belief that what ever someone belives is righ tfor them not my place to make anyone belive mine.. mine are right for me if ppl happen to belive the same thing then it's cool but notr alot of ppl that I've met over the yrs does

All- here is basic human psychology. If someone tells you are wrong in your religion you will cling to it even more so because you feel threatened. It is human nature. You might say 'No not me I let logic rule my thinking'...and you'd be wrong. Religion is not about logic, it is about emotion. It makes you feel good. I started doing tai chi and it makes me feel good. In fact it makes me feel as good as church did, so I quit church. There was no point in going if I got the same thing out of something I could do everyday at my leisure as I did at something I 'had' to attend on a set schedule every week. It just did to make any sense.

So back to it, if I was to drop hints and you were not threatened you might convert of your own accord. Especially if you saw I was happy, fulfilled and complete. This is the way to convert people BTW for anyone wanting to go down that path. You never win anyone over by smacking them around with your theology, you live it and drop hints and be there for them, IMO. My question remains though: If you had a hardcore belief, do you suppose this would be doable for you to change religions even if you thought it was the 'one'?

I think that my beliefs are right for me but they are not really right for everyone. Each person has the right to believe what they want.

If i found out it was false It would

I dont have any strong belifes but i am alot happyer now that i am no longer a part of my old religion.

I just live my life the way i want without someone saying no you cant do that coz this really old book says so ^^

Pwyll~

I'm under no misconception to the contents of the these books, but like I have already said, it is all about interprtation.
Given that you have army blood in you and you are probably use to following orders (or giving them) it must be a little tough to get your head around a concept of belief that allows frivolity. lol

My religion you are born into. So whether you like it or not thats what you are...even if you denounce it.....thats where the psychology kicks in.
Also it's not just religious beliefs that we cling tighter to when challenged.

I have my own sets of ideas . I don't have any strong belifes about religion but I have my own good Idea

I have my own sets of ideas . I don't have any strong belifes about religion but I have my own good Idea

I believe that right now my beliefs are working for me, they may not be correct but it still gives me hope. Which is exactly what religion is supposed to do. I was never forced to go to church on a regular basis so that leaves open many different possibilities. As of now I just believe in a higher being, whatever that maybe be. A star, a constellation, a god, etc. Anything to make me feel that something created us and we aren't alone. I've always had issues excepting the Bible, considering the possibility of it being changed before anyone but priests could read it. Like I said it gives me hope, it probably wouldn't work for everyone, just like no religion does and probably never will.

As an answer to the second question, I would only change my beliefs if they made me happy, if I found enlightenment in the correct religion, otherwise why change to something that in the end isn't what you believe?

my beliefs are that religon is biased
i am a relaist i believe in what i see happen and what is taught in daily life not prying to somthing in the sky that one cannot prove exists or is true

Personally,I have gone on my gut feeling and what I have found when looking into religions.Quite frankly,what I believe doesnt seem to fit into any religion or creed.Doesnt matter to me,whether its wrong or right.Only that I feel good in believing it,and that alone gives me faith.

I do not believe anyone has gotten religion right yet. And no one ever will. Religion is man made, and so the religion one finds suitable to oneself is essentially "made" for them. That is why there are so many, because people are so different from one another. Should a messenger come to me to tell me my religion is wrong, well, too bad, I don't believe in them/or that particular religion to begin with so the message would be moot.

If I were approached by God, I wouldn't care, because I have no feelings for God, if he would/could make the world perfect then he should if hes so almighty and powerful. I dont want to offend anyone with this statement, its just how I believe, God and I have our issues.

Religion: A daughter of Hope and Fear, explaining to Ignorance the nature of the Unknowable.

Ambrose Bierce in the Devil’s Dictionary

Just a thought......

In a weekend dinner conversation it was said in passing that it's not the religions that aren't perfect but the people.....

I, for one, may not be perfect, but atleast I have opposable thumbs, like other primates.

*Disclaimer: The following is my own experience and view, not to trample on anyone else or to be trampled upon by another.

I was a very dedicated and committed Christian for 1/2 of my life. I was hurt time and time again by people who told me to love everyone, but didn't. Told me to pray and read, but didn't. Told me to walk upright and steadfast, but didn't. Etc.

I got hurt so bad that I felt everything I was led to believe was a lie. The principles were good, but people felt that they could exchange one command for another when it suited them. And I ended up leaving the church and wandering aimlessly for awhile.

Then as I began to awaken to the vampric side of my life I discovered the Wiccian Rede and Law of Three. These make complete sense to me and those I have met who are Wiccian are not hypocrites and truly believe the Wiccian truths. I have since adapted these as my own and have become a pagan minister to the community in the shadows.

I have no clue what the "One" really is, but I know I am happy with my fellow Wiccians and am glad to have found home.

Rev. Ravyn

I am biased as far as Christianity goes. I am more to the nature of science and witchcraft. Religion is a way in which control is asserted by the fear of going to Hell. I can not prove or disprove Heavan or Hell. But if "God" dropped by and proved his powers, I would still have to question what I was seeing. Would his power be that of the one true God or just the advanced technology or abilities of a species that is more advanced?
I do feel that religion is a choice and what works for the individual may not work for the masses.

well i was raised druid, my family has been druid for ever, as far as my religion, i have studied many other religions just to see what i was up against, and i wouldn't trade it for anything.

as far as your path it must be the one that fits you that is we will always find somthing wrong with organized religion somthing will not agree with us for me i learn from all and prefect what workes for me that is how i see it

one religion i dont think so

I believe there is only one religion. However, there are so many denominations of said religion that the idea of it is so fucked.

So much for the fear of G-d.....

society and bureaucracy have set the bounds on what's right or wrong, and religion has become very much a tool -- but hasn't it always been like that?!!

This thread has been automatically closed for length.