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i hope your correct, and i would like to add that primal instincts though barbaric are useful. now its traditions that are holding the whole of humanity back, how can we use our frontal lobes if we keep running away from new ways of thinking and new oppourtunities. yaddi-yaddi0yadda.

great post, cannot wait to see some more responses!

lol, as long as folks survive the raging typos...

A scary thought...I would like to think that we humans could rise above being so 'cut-throat' but I have a feeling that it will forever be in our genetic makeup. Like, I or someone else will kill you for that last scrap of bread, you know?

Even though they were unsupervised children, the Lord of the Flies came to mind...and we know how bad human adults can be.

Idealism provoking wars and conflict, I would like to see that fade away.. if we are too pacified though we may fail to met those that act in irrational manners. Sport fights, and Matches have in the distant past regulated tribes, and even kingdoms, I would like to see a conflict resolved by a collective of champions from each side.

We are creatures of habit. We must never forget, no matter how lofty, we are only an animal with an opposoble thumb. As being animal's it comes down to darwin' rule of survival of the fitest. Sure the world would be better off with more Ghandi's, MLK's & Mother Teresa's, but the Hitler's, Napoleon's & Manson's will roll right over them with out a second thought each and every time.


Sweet Dreams everyone.

Mans nature to Dominate, and those that seek a stable , Harmonious existence. When any one is treated inhumanly for the gain of others.. We must react, and we can expect reaction, especially when an idealism is involved in the establish opponent.

If thre situation got bad,I think it would be far worse than it ever has been.

We cannot create peace by blood shed. We can Null a threat with force though and that may allow a peaceful existence, yet you have the over throw powers minion still symathatic to the lose. When a stand-off occurs between two powers, one self serving, and the other protecting establish human civil environments, that is not peace.

When we rubber neck, some do so to seek the severity of the accident. "Was it worth holding up my schedule?" some are interested in the gore, perhaps that ties with the shock culture that permeates or society. Is it still out of respect that we cover the body of accident victims? We have an aversion to violence (senseless violence) could we be fine tuning the definition of irrational violence?

Define "atrocity." Of course we would say that murder, rape etc. are atrocities and is something we as a society stand against. However, that is not the case. All cultures and all individuals must form their own "ideals". I am a reluctant relativist but there are few things which can give us solid direction.

Barbarism is ,at it's core, nothing more than self-preservation. We say niceties to gain friends for support, we let a gentler nature show through to find a mate and we steal or even kill to keep ourselves alive, even when the "cause" is unjust.

Our primal self has kept us alive for a million years and it gives us instinct to know danger or good will.

As you mentioned Humanism is still in it's infancy and perhaps one day we will have more developed frontal lobes than today ;) I only hope that we don't loose that which gave us the gut knowledge of right and wrong...what we might now call "barbarous nature."

Provocation plays a role in response. Fanatics have fringe motives for provoking responses. Some wish to condemn those that are not of their faith/Political position.

It seems to me that the essence of human nature is self serving. If you are around small children it is me first. They have to be taught to share, not to knock down another child to get a toy, etc. In other words humans have to be "taught" socialization. I think underlying all this is a current of pent up inate emotions. It dwells within as the nature of survival of the fittist. When push comes to shove most will save themselves. There are always exceptions but I think those are minor in nature.

You have seen this when people become stranded in an isolated harsh environment and they revert to cannibalism to survive. Scientists know that man descended from cannibals so that is in our very nature but very deeply ensconced in the unconscious. If our families are threatened and we are threatened in some way many will kill before even thinking about it.

Primal instinct has kept us around for quite some time now I fear that without it or too much of a leaning on the more pacifist side would be our end. It is necessary.

Living with our primal drives, including a healthy level of self-interest, is what keeps us potent. If we are to accept everything and "go with the flow", we enter a passive state in which evolution stops. It is this drive, this motivation, that allows power. It will never be quelched to the point of disappearance, so no anarchy will work. Naturally, we are made to compete and seize that which improves our own conditions and the conditions within our societies. Perhaps it is social darwinism, but some people are more equal than others. Without allowing our true desires to somehow manifest, human beings are weakened. When one is weakened, there is always a stronger force to replace the person. It is the responsibilty of the individual to fight this.

well I agree that our primal instincts have kept us around for this long, yet then there also is the other side where the ones who just follow ask no questions that have kept that kind around also for this long. Yet I feel if you take the timid ones and put them in a die or survive situation they will survive because of the inner barbarian that lurks within all of us.

We just hide it better now in this "civilized state" that we live in, even tho' there are a few hom are still very barbaric in their lifestyle. yet, the majority do Veil it as the thread is titled.

We're really not as civilized as we pretend to be. Posses used to ride horses 150 years ago, now they drive cars. All it would take is one big enough distaster and we would behave like barbarics.

mm being barbarian is when you tend to be ruthless at times take no crap from no one.

why dose every one use barbarianisum as a bad thing

it seams that the civelized people are the ones who are more selfsevring and evil

The strip mining of resources proves the previous post very well.

Humanity has just created a nice little veiled place to live. We are all still animals and have just refined our ways of convincing ourselves that we aren't.

In my job I deal with the parts of society that everyone wants to forget and we are told theat we have to talk to these people to make them understand. I have had 2 psychairtists tell me that these types of people will just stare at you blankly when you are talking to them and will only respect a physical confrontation. But social owrkers out there keep telling us that we have to talk to these people.

Personally I believe the psychaitrists because I have to deal with these indiviuals all day long and there are a number of them that have been told time and time again that what they are doing is wrong BUT they continue doing it anyway. Now if they were given a good thump the first time the may think twice about doing it again.

This may sound mean or just like bullying but please don't make a judgement until wyou hve worked in my job for at least a year. I am not some punk that just wants to hurt people. But most people will never learn from just a talking to.

Barbaric and Atrocity are words that tend to get thrown around way too easily by those who have too high a veiw of themselves from Ivory Towers.

After all the Egyptians concidered themselves above Barbarism. The Romans, The Greeks, The Chinese, The Japanese, The English, Ect ect ect ect ect ect ect ect ....

All had thier own Barbaric and Atroctious behavior. Society feel the need to evolve and better Society for the sake of seeking a purpose above itself. But at what cost?

Technology and advancemnt equal what? The destruction of the enviroment that keeps us alive.

Society and Morals are the luxury of those who fail to see the need for anything else. They fail to realize the need for the primal survival instinct because society had created this luxury of life where the strength and need to be primal. To understand the struggle and survival of the fitess. It has been the luxury of society and tenchnological advancement that tells us this is wrong.

I think it is what is the norm for each country. We do not breed terroist, but in other countries at a very young age it is ok for children to learn to use guns and self-defense against others.

Maybe being civilized is just the hegemony that is best for a nation's particular economy, and thus enforced by those who benefit from that economy.

I believe so. Look at the case Uruguayan Air Force Flight 571, on which the movie Alive was based. The passengers gradually gave way to cannibalism for their own basic needs. The only restraints were that the food was already deceased and that it was a last resort.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uruguayan_Air_Force_Flight_571

We will always have those primal instincts. We will always be capapble of "barbaric" behavior. Survival instincts do not recognize "Civilities". Like I said. Higher thought puts limits on everything natural because they are afraid of it. But those limits will never kill that natural part of ourselves no matter how "Civilized" we try to become. Civilization is a luxury.

In some people, it's not so veiled.

I think that we are capable of doing pretty much anything. Capable physically of these things, but because of our more evolved state, we mostly refrain from tearing each other up. ha.....

But put us in a situation where it's us or them, or kill or be killed and our primal instincts kick in. You hear and read about them time after time. War is hell. People trying to hurt us is hell.

Now some would rather take the spiritual approach and simply refuse to fight to protect themselves or loved ones. You sorta have to weigh it out I guess.

Yes I believe we could go there as a human race, it become that destitute, look at the terrorism and such that we've already witnessed in our lifetime. The world and human race as a whole could all go to hell in handbasket in no time. Could it result in barbarianism, well sure, terrorists are barbarians in my oppinion and so barbarians already are amongst us it's apparent.

We are all born with the animal instinct to survive and no matter how civilized we think we have become we are still animals fighting for survival.

If things got bad we would resort to those primal instincts of survival.

I think given the right circumstances and a person's strength of character any person could commit an atrocity.

It has always been down to survial of the fitest. Humans have the means and the ability to take anything on and wipe it off the face of the earth. Yet if we tackle say a lion on our own we would become none exsistant in no time. When in large numbers we are bruital and unforgiving.

Nice clomn, its ahsame humans have to lay everything to waste.....................

We cannot help ourselves we as a race have to be the dominate partner and anything that stands in our way gets wiped out.

Anyone can snap under the right pressure!

well now that i know the true meaning of barbarian,
mmm i think its just away of servival at times.
its how life isat times sigh i wish there was other ways to servive tho i hate conflicts.

Oh we can mess this planet up as much as we want.. the aliens are coming to regulate peace and renew or environment.