For as yet scientifically unknown reasons, times occur when an unsuspecting person can just burst into flames and be incinerated.
The flames begin within the victim's own body and are horribly complete in their work, reducing their human fuel to a pile of ashes in minutes -- sometimes seconds. The whole event is so quick and selective that objects near the victim show only minor heat damage, if any at all; sometimes, even the victim's clothes are left untouched.
These inner flames have been occurring for as long as mankind has existed; but most coroners, pathologists, scientists, and fire officials ignore such evidence, blithely choosing much neater and less controversial explanations for these unexplained deaths.
http://www.anomalyinfo.com/articles/ga00003.php?page=SHC
Ok my question.. is this an actual occurance or do you beleive there is a reaonable or scientific explantion for this?
Haha, this such a puzzling subject. I'll always remember a picture were a womens foot is just not burnt, while the rest of her body rests in ash >.<
yep i saw that pic.. thought it was a little too gross to post it
"blithely choosing much neater and less controversial explanations for these unexplained deaths"
Occam's razor: a philosophy going back to the 14th century. All things being equal, the simplest solution tends to be the right one. We also base much of what we accept and know on empirical evidence. If you cannot recreate it, then it can't really be taken as credible. There are only so many assumptions you can make in any given situation before the theory falls apart.
While I like the idea of spontaneous human combustion (for a very long time I planned on doing it for my 35th birthday because I thought that was far too old... now however I'm getting close to there so I'm not so sure!) I believe a lot of SHC stories have been debunked. There are usually perfectly normal reasons why the bodies burnt. Have a look here for some examples.
the trouble with occams razor is it is based on a fallacy.
there has been a lot of research though, and it has been proven that under certain conditions, a human can burst into flames, and burn from the inside. people who are elderly, obese, or non too hygenic can in effect turn their bodies into what is best described as a living candle. remember that we have a great deal of potential energy stored within our bodies, with a protective layer of skin. that protection can work both ways.
I think there could be a scientific explaination but since this happens so rarily and the victim is taken care of... it'll be hard to pin point the real reasons as to why this sort of thing goes on....
It's the perfect "murder"
I wonder, if its possible, that with spontaneous human combustion, that those who spontaneously combust are arsonists.
Now, when I say arsonist I don't mean somebody who just sets things on fire, but somebody who has the ability to master the element of flame.
If the person who controls fire doesn't really have a handle on their abilities, the part that can make things burst into flame maybe goes out of control and sets them on fire.
I don't know, just a thought.
I think anything is possible.. as long as you beleive it is..
Of course now there are some things that even I feel are a bit far fetched, but hey, each to his own opinon.
Some people just don't beleive things even if there is scientific evidence though, so maybe you shouldn't base what you beleive is true and the 'facts' of something on that?
My guess is that it is something internal, but I am by no means a medical expert. I have seen several programs on tv discussing this subject and as it stands it all appears to just be theories.
The human body can burn, that is a fact - just go to the crematorium and watch.
The body contains enough fat to generate terrific heat enough to reduce bones to ash but, if I have understood it right, only if it burns from inside out
If a body burns normally ie from heat applied to the outside it never gets hot enough to reduce the bones to ash - crematorium use grinders for that last bit
The main problem seems to be what could the cause of the internal ignition be ? I know the body works on electricity so I guess that could go wrong and do something.
This link is a study of cases reported over the world. It also discusses a theory that is supposedly backed by scientific testing.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/158853.stm
another interesting fact is that although the body burns, nothing else dose. There was a picture of a womans burnt remains on her bed -- but the bed linen was barely singed.
I think there is an explanation for everything, maybe not scientific, but there is an answer as to why it happens, and how.
I think it's scientific...as the right combination of chemicals or the right acid and it can make you burn and/or burst into flames from the inside out
A lot of people think that the reason for S.U.C is because of alcohol in the body, and when a body starts to burn once the fire reaches the fat on a persons body the flames just get more intence and that is a good idea of why S.U.C happens, i mean they all could not be for that reason but i think that a few may be for that reason...
I've heard that people who spontaneously combust usually are left with only their feet or half of their legs. Very weird but a fascinating subject!
Maybe it's some kind of static or chemical reaction or something that happens inside a person.
i would also think there is a scientific explanation for this. but there is no real way of telling what ignites a person from the inside out. and if this does in fact happen, then without the person or people that it happens to being alive afterwards, theres no one to question.
I Beleive its possible for it to happen .. dont know how though
Interesting . I have heard stories but never witnessed this .
Theories about Spontaneous Human Combustion
- Alchoholism - many Spontaneous Human Combustion vicitms have been alcoholics. But experiments in the 19th century demonstrated that flesh impregnated with alcohol will not burn with the intense heat associated with Spontaneous Human Combustion.
- Deposits of flammable body fat - Many victims have been overweight - yet others have been skinny.
- Devine Intervention - Centuries ago people felt that the explosion was a sign from God of devine punishment.
- Build-up of static electricity - no known form of electrostatic discharge could cause a human to burst into flames.
- An explosive combination of chemicals can form in the digestive system - due to poor diet.
- Electrical fields that exist within the human body might be capable of 'short circuiting' somehow, that some sort of atomic chain reaction could generate tremendous internal heat.
No satisfactory explanation of Spontaneous Human Combustion has ever been given. It is still an unsolved mystery.
http://www.crystalinks.com/shc.html
other information ive found on the subject.....
What Remains After a Spontaneous Human Combustion Event
- The body is normally more severely burned than one that has been caught in a normal fire.
- The burns are not distributed evenly over the body; the extremities are usually untouched by fire, whereas the torso usually suffers severe burning.
- In some cases the torso is completely destroyed, the bones being reduced completely to ash.
- Small portions of the body (an arm, a foot, maybe the head) remain unburned.
- Only objects immediately associated with the body have burned; the fire never spread away from the body. SHC victims have burnt up in bed without the sheets catching fire, clothing worn is often barely singed, and flammable materials only inches away remain untouched.
- A greasy soot deposit covers the ceiling and walls, usually stopping three to four feet above the floor.
- Objects above this three to four foot line show signs of heat damage (melted candles, cracked mirrors, etc.)
- Although temperatures of about 3,000 degrees Fahrenheit are normally required to char a body so thoroughly (crematoria, which usually operate in the neighborhood of 2,000 degrees, leave bone fragments which must be ground up by hand), frequently little or nothing around the victim is damaged, except perhaps the exact spot where the deceased ignited.
http://www.crystalinks.com/shc.html
I think there must be a reasonable scientific explantion for what happens. In order for the body to react in such a way there must be some sort of cause.
ok this is a pic i found that wasnt totally gross
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h280/juliecar143/kRusso6L.jpg
heres another site it reports there were
1950's - 11 cases
1960's - 7 cases
1970's - 13 cases
1980's - 22 cases
of SHC
thereare also additional pics on this site
http://theshadowlands.net/spon.htm
There is enough evidence to show it does happen. The mystery is merely how.
They'll figure it out someday as our knowledge of the universe grows.
a possible scientific explantion
'The scientific explanation -- the 'wick effect' -- proposes that in certain rare circumstances the human being can burn like a candle.'
The explanation advanced by the film makers was that a clothed human body is like an inside-out candle where the fat, or fuel source, is inside and the wick is outside. Once burning begins, the melted fat seeps into the clothing and burns like a wick, slowly over a period of many hours.
http://www.alternativescience.com/spontaneous-human-combustion-burning-issue.htm
sure there is an answer just will time time why it happens
I think there has to be scientific explanation for this. The answer will eventually come out one day.
I've seen the "evidence" and I believe it happens..
But I've tried and tried to figure it out with basically no luck.
I would "guess" it would have to do with some malfunction of digestion. Like eating a bunch of dry crackers "lots" and the acids of the stomach reacting with the salt crystals, but that doesn't "sound" good enough for me..
I've also though about extremely high natural magnetic hot spots, but hat doesn't seem right either after much thought.
????
But I do believe it can happen.
=====
The thing I've heard the most was someone would drop a cigarette of something on themselved and their clothes would catch on fire a dn the natural fat of the person would "fuel" the fire..
But come one, like the most sound sleep wouldn't wake up if they're burning??
It's weird!!:D
see I agree with you UneByte you would think that if someone was onfire from a cigarette , even if they had took sleeping pills , being on fire would def wake them up.. so has to be another explanation
This is a very interesting subject. I have not studied the topic extensively. I wonder if somehow a combination of a lot of stored up energy with some wierd chemical reaction could cause this.
As for the not waking part....I read about this Woman who experienced Spontaneous human combustion....apparently she never knew that she caught fire...Her daughter had to point it out to her......Besides if a human body is capable of igniting itself then i suppose even the same query will have a possible answer....
i watched something like that on tv and how it could happen, to me it wasnt explained enough but wow maybe it could really happen..
That's sick...I believe it is possible although I wouldn't know how....
I think that it may be a matter of both fat and chemical reactions, or some external ignition source.
Fat probably serves two purposes, fuel to sustain the fire, and insulation to help hold in the heat so that extreme temperatures are reached that can destroy bone. Unless the fire is somehow contained the heat would radiate away without reaching extreme temperatures.
Also interesting is that these fires always seem to consume the torso rather than the limbs. There are all kinds of chemical reactions going on in the gut that produce flammable and even explosive gasses.
Whether these gasses spontaneously combust or whether there is some external source of ignition such as a dropped cigarette is a real mystery.
A human body needs two things in order to combust: intensely high heat and a flammable substance. Although mathematically it can be shown that the human body contains enough energy stored in the form of fat and other tissues to consume it completely, in normal circumstances, bodies will not sustain a flame on their own.
Still, in the month of December of the year 1966, the body of 92-year-old Dr. J. Irving Bentley was discovered in his Pennsylvania home by a meter reader. Actually, only part of Dr. Bentley's leg and slippered foot were found. The rest of his body had been burned to ashes. A hole in the bathroom floor was the only evidence of the fire that had killed him; the rest of the house remained perfectly intact.
It was impossible to explain how a human body could have caught fire and eventually burn almost completely, without any source of flame or heat, but most of all, without ingniting any of the objects around it? Dr. Bentley's case was not the only one, hundreds of similar phenomena being recorded and then labeled as "spontaneous human combustion" (SHC). Although he and other victims of the phenomenon burned almost completely, their surroundings, and even sometimes their clothes, remained virtually untouched.
Is it possible for people to burst into flames, spontaneously and without any apparent cause? many people around the world people think spontaneous human combustion is a real fact, while most scientists remain skeptical about it.
The one thing that really makes this phenomenon strange is the fact that the human remains in the photos of human combustion have often intact extremities. Mostly the head and torso are burnt beyond recognition, while the hands, feet, and part of the legs may remain untouched.
Methane (a flammable gas produced when plants decompose), that gradually builds up in the intestines and is ignited by enzymes (proteins in the body that act as catalysts to induce and speed up chemical reactions), is considered to be one of the most plausible explanations. But somehow, most victims of spontaneous human combustion present a really great damage to the outside of their body, while their internal organs appear almost intact at the autopsy, which seems to go against this theory.
there are also other theories that have been proposed, speculating that the fire begins as a result of a buildup of static electricity inside the body or from an external geomagnetic force exerted on the body. A self-proclaimed expert on spontaneous human combustion, Larry Arnold, has suggested that the phenomenon is the work of a new subatomic particle called a pyroton, which he says interacts with cells to create a mini-explosion. But no scientific evidence proves the existence of this particle.
Supposing this spontaneous human combustion phenomenon isn't real, then what could explain what happened in the many pictures that exist of the charred bodies?
A possible explanation is the wick effect, which proposes that the body, when lit by a cigarette, smoldering ember or other heat source, acts much like an inside-out candle. As the fat melts from the heat, it soaks into the clothing and acts as a wax-like substance to keep the wick burning slowly. Scientists say this is why victims' bodies are destroyed yet their surroundings are barely burned.
This could be true for more "bulky" victims, but what about the skinny ones?
Although most scientists say that there are more likely explanations for the charred remains (a lit cigarette, cigar or pipe, alcohol or criminal cover-up), no one has ever conclusively proven or disproven the truth of spontaneous human combustion.
http://news.softpedia.com/news/How-Spontaneous-Human-Combustion-Works-51101.shtml
ok now im really confused..lol some of the explations seem very logical.. yet not all questions are answered.. so now I dont know what to think..
maybe its just what chemicals are in the body and how much of each is need to react. Unless someone followed a person around and seen what they had been eating and what kind of pills and such were taken nobody would know for sure.
biologicaly our bodies do have the componets to do so but as far as i know the environment has never before reach the conditions nessassrey for it to happen
There two most common explanations for SHC are
1)The wick effect hypothesis
2)Static flash fire hypothesis
The wick fire hypothesis-The wick effect is the name given to the partial destruction of a human body by fire, when the clothing of the victim soaks up melted human fat and acts like the wick of a candle.
The wick effect is a real phenomenon that has been shown to occur under certain conditions. Since both wick effect and SHC would necessarily involve the incineration of bodies, and therefore the melting and combustion of body fat, there are many similarities between the known phenomenon (wick effect) and the alleged phenomenon (SHC).
The static flash hypothesis-This is a condition in which static electricity apparently builds up to such dangerous levels in the human body that a sparking discharge can ignite clothing. In static flash fire cases, the voltage that builds up is much higher, producing bright flashes capable of illuminating dark surroundings, or shimmering flame-like effects, depending on circumstances.
The phenomenon of massive static charges on human bodies was first noted by the late professor Robin Beach, of Brooklyn, New York, founder of the scientific detective agency 'Robin Beach Engineers Associated'. One of his very first clients was an Ohio factory-owner whose plant was suddenly plagued with as many as eight small fires a day. Professor Beach's solution was to persuade each of the factory's employees in turn to step on to a metal plate while holding an electrode; at the same time he took reading from an electrostatic voltmeter. One of the workers was a young woman recently employed; when she stepped on to the metal plate, the meter showed a tremendous jump. She registered 30,000 volts of electrostatic electricity and a resistance of 500,000 ohms. Professor Beach recommended that she be transferred to some other part of the factory where she would not come into contact with combustible materials. Apparently, the fires immediately went down in frequency.[5]
The professor explained that under certain conditions (walking on carpets during dry winter weather, for example) almost anyone can build up an electrostatic charge of as much as 20,000 volts.[6] Hence the shock we sometimes feel when touching a car door or other metal surface. Usually, the electricity is harmlessly discharged through the tips of the hair; however, the professor claimed, there are some people (he guessed around one in 100,000) whose abnormally dry skin permits them to generate as much as 30,000 volts at a time. In certain circumstances, he said, such people may be highly dangerous. They may, for example, have been the detonators that touched off explosions in hospital operating theaters whose atmosphere contained an admixture of anesthetic vapor and air. In addition, the professor was convinced that workers in ordnance factories and petroleum refineries should be tested to discover whether they have the type of skin which retains electric charges more persistently than others. He quoted an instance in which a man proved to be a hazard to himself:
"In one case I investigated, a driver decided to see if the battery of his car needed filling with water. It was a cold, dry fall day and the man walked a short distance on a concrete driveway, raised the hood of his car, and unscrewed the caps of the battery. There was an immediate explosion as he touched off the hydrogen gas escaping from the battery of the recently parked car. He was severely injured."
Here is the link
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spontaneous_human_combustion
it is my thinking here that, simlpy these are people who have the ability of pyrokanesis, and unknowingly turn it on them selves... society says it is wrong or a sin to manifest such a thing so thesesheep block it and in an instant without realizing it poof/gone...333
Probable and I'll tell you why. The body is an electrical battery. Cross the wires = fire.
I do beleive, but higlhy doubt will ever get an explanation about it that would suit all the bureaucrates that thinks with logic, I think with logic, but I can also think with my self, so ti is even seeing logic, a logic possibility
That would be one heck of a short in the system, but yse we are essentially batteries.... I have a few humans I would mind having ignite...
maybe electrical currents in your body mix with methane from your ass and bang your so gone
unless you set it up for yourself to kill yourself in such a way like shallowing gasonline and lighting yourself on fire I dont think it could happen ever in a natural way and this is another myth that some one peoblay made up due to boredem.
I'm not sure..... I'm think that one day it will be explained.
I dont think thre will ever be an explanation.. so many diffrent theories out there.. and each one trying to outprove the other
I dont think thre will ever be an explanation.. so many diffrent theories out there.. and each one trying to outprove the other
never really thought about it .giving it some thought i would say that the energy we are made of , both physical and spiritual or meta physical could possibly ignight and consume us . say for instance you were trying to channel that energy (or not trying for that matter)and it got out of hand it could burn in a controlled enviroment of its own making . your bodies own energy could keep that energy in as the atmosphere keeps our air in
Mystic this is an excellent posting with some very informative comments about a puzzling subject thank you for posting it!
This has been studied and documented rather extensively. It does happen although it is very rare.
I think this is something science has been trying to debunk for years with out any substancial success. There are mysteries in life that aren't meant to be solved and this is one of them.
The human body is an amazing thing and will continue to astound and amaze science for generations to come. We haven't discovered everything or know everything about the human body. There are just things about our bodies science will never understand. And its time to live with it in my books.
So spontaneous human combustion is something real and has no explaination, it just happens and is a mystery.
I remember a tv program years ago explained SHC it said the part of the brain that operates the body pores shuts down triggering a chain reaction,the pores on the body close which meant the body couldn't sweat and cool down.The body heat reflected inwards reaching intense/extreme temperatures and then internally smoldering with body fat & chemicals/gases in the body then keeps smoldering from the inside out
I believe it is possible..very rare but possible.I think thou the explanation would be maybe if they had something on their body ..like maybe a chemical or something..then maybe the sun could cause them to heat enough to combust.Or also where they are at could do it too..
Edinburgh University scientist Dougal Drysdale suggested what he termed a candle-wick theory, noting that the body, which contains a considerable amount of fat, could burn like a candle with great local intensity. This theory is favored by the major spokespersons of the skeptical community, especially Joe Nickell and John F. Fischer, as a part of their crusade to remove any paranormal explanations from anomalous phenomena. While this theory accounts for the consumption of body fats and the body's high water content, its flaw remains in the extremely high temperatures needed even to begin to consume bone material.
http://www.answers.com/topic/spontaneous-human-combustion
This topic can be argued on for a long time, but I might be able to add to what is taken from it.
The body, as stated earlier, has an enormous amount of potential energy. Most of the energy is in the form of fat, which can readily burn. The powerhouses of the human body are the mitochondria in each and every cell, including bone cells. If some misfiring of a particular nerve in the brain should send out the proper signal throughout the body, it could tell each nucleus to in turn force each mitochondria to release all of its stored energy in one instance, which, due to the Law of Conservation of Energy, would produce enough heat to ignite each and every one of the cells in the human body. This would account for the immolation of even the hardest to burn materials in the body.
Kage nice theory and sounds very possible thankyou for your input
I always thought that perhaps those who has combusted were in fact some how in a gas pocket in which maybe ball lightning or something equivalent might have been about to ignite the flames of the person. ball lightning hmm that would be interesting it gives off the same effect as burning but also electrifies the person or thing it touches due to its unstable condition
the strangest thing about all this is that the surrounding areas such as chairs and beds ect. are left untouched by the fire
i always believe that it was that was the results of someone not beable to control their on power within their own body and it grow to large for them and it destroys them
i believe it is possible for some one to just go on fire.
I saw a program about this on tv a few years back. They set a pig on fire (seeing that pig body fat content is similar to humans) and left it to burn, and the resulting pattern was similar to SHC victims. But it took hours.
http://skepdic.com/shc.html
I believe it's an actual occurrence, whether or not there's anything scientific behind it, I don't know.
We all seek answers to things that can never truly be explained. It is our nature.
there is some truth in seekin out answers but nothing scientic has been able to prove that any of this is possable to happen in the first place so unless that can proven to be true by scinece methods then this is just another wises tale for me.
I have read about this before...sceince has proven it can happen
SHC as far as I have researched and read is a myth. It can't be completely dis proven nor proven and stories are continuously popping up about individuals bursting into flame.
Personally I believe SHC is hogwash.
Many have told me that is was A strike from a demon (a bounty hunter) a fire ball of some sort that leaves the body in ashes. I honestly havn't a clue of what could cause it so i ust take different oppinons based on what ppl have faith in and truely believe, then i make my own believs based on what i have heard and seen!
I think that it woul be a scary thing to witness...however pretty much anything is possible.
Freaky.
has anyone actually witnessed this happening?
are there any eye witness accounts available
a part of me would love to see someone combust
although Id feel bad for them I bet it would look cool
Thanks for posting this thread.. It's very interesting I have heard of it. & listen to the stories
I really enjoyed that big bang theory with the gas! It made me laugh...
I find this very interesting. I've heard it explained before and it sounds like there is a scientific explanation for it. It's still really weird though...
i cant say that I have ever with all the scientific and or some form of acknowledgment of this subject you'd think that there would be more incidents and at least one of us in this thread would have first hand witnessed it
Science is trying to find a way to explain it. I dont think that they are going to be able to do. I think that it is possible for it to happen both ways, as in a scientific reason for it as well as a supernatural way for it...
posible? I dont know, cientifily still is not demostrated a way allow me to explane
the ris a force that kep the molecules together in everything " coecion force" is coused for the sem thigh that keep the temperature in everything the same molecules movment, if the molecules start to move faster the temperature rises and if they slow down in get cold (thet is whi is easier to break some thing at blew zero temperatures, so is it cientificly posible for your molecules to start moving faster just like that and bust you into flames whithin minutes or seconds? still not a way cience know, will it be in the future? who know, is it posible to cause? definitly
soulvoid, please redo your post and add a spell checker... I cannot follow your post
there have been experiments to reproduce the effects of SHC. however, the incineration always takes many hours or even days to completely consume the body. some cases of SHC have been known to destroy the body in minutes whilst still leaving nearby highly inflammable furniture unharmed. science has still to find the answer in my opinion.
It does happen but as to the reasons it does I don't know.
I have heard of them using a pig in experiments.. but still doesnt convince me that this is what occurs
maybe they are on the right track, but there has to be something else.
I believe that the scientific community,or the public for that matter, will ever be satisfied until this is replicated under test conditions. I have heard of the wick theory before and it was always the one I gave the most credibility. Some of the other theories do make for some interesting food for thought though.
We will probably never know the real reason behind SHC. there is no way of knowing when it would happen, so a controlled environment can be eliminated. Even if it could be in a controlled environment, who would volunteer?
body is mostly water, its puzzling and impossible to imagine spontaneous combustion as a possibility in this reality.