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I was thinking the other day about how science cannot possibly give solid evidence of the existence or non-existence of 'God' or what have you. But can it give evidence of the soul? Can it prove or disprove that souls exist in any way, shape, or form? If anyone has any external links on this topic, it would be much appreciated as well.

They have proven that the body gets lighter by x grams after it dies.

This can be explained in a few ways, such as the vector force of circulation, but some people like to attribute it to the soul or spirit leaving the body.

With the technology that we have now there is no definitive way to prove or disprove scientifically the existence of a soul

The soul is metaphysical and not scientific. So I dont believe there will be any solid factual evidence anytime soon.

I do not feel that it can be proved one way or another, it is more a belief or faith to me that you just feel it is what it is..

i personally dont think so eithor.. the scientest with there guessing games ..

fascinating that in this day and age.. we can't prove anything about this topic

Science as far as science has any basis for fact is realizing that creation is just too perfect to be a fluke or creation has happened by chance. That a surperior being must of created all that we perceive. This is a good foundation for accepting the concept of God or to call the creator whatever you are comfortable with.
You think, therefore you are. Your thoughts, your actions are of you basically so you are of being. Now the core of your being: your thoughts, feelings, these are expressed as soul. As we evolve we understand and remember our past lives through reincarnation. Now your soul is becoming complete or realized in order to advance onto the next stage of being. Some now say this soul has entered heaven. But Heaven is not the end of your evoluation not until you become pure thought as God is and as a child of God your soul has become a God.

Sri Sri Mata Radika

That is exactly how I feel in relation to the soul. That it can not be proved not dissproved. Just accepted and with our multiple reincarnations we evolve and become one with all of Creation.

id say that if they cant prove god they cant prove a soul!!!

That's the usual common misunderstanding about science.
Scientific proof of existence for something that is not defined or definable in scientific terms is a waste of time and resources. And a fools errand.
Before even thinking about something like that it would be necessary to define "soul" in scientific terms. Then proof of existence or non-existence is rather easy

I honestly don't think that they can prove the soul...

I don't think science has proven that G-d does not exsist but it does conflict directly with the bible.
Since the soul is very much a religious aspect, this too is questioned on its exsistence.

as advanced as science has and will become, I don't think there will ever be proof that a soul does or doesn't exist

Radika I am curious. Maybe I misunderstood but are you saying in your post that science has conceded that intelligent design is true?

You pose the questing in an interesting way. You ask if scientists have been able to prove the existance of a soul.

Obviously, they have not.

But on the flip side, no one else has been able to prove the existance of a soul either. The concept of a soul, is still to this day, relies strictly on the faith of belivers that it exists.

So, scientists have failed to prove it, but so has everyone else.

I always thought a soul was something you believe in or don't. I don't think it can be scientifically proven.

I ve seem someone die like just pass away right in front of me.. You can actually see a light leave their bosy and float away, or at least i see this every time someone dies.. Also their bosy is just completly different you can just watch the life drain from them and the soul leave.. It is very freaky..

PS i worked in a nursing home night shift

A little off course..but I'd like to mention something.


I was thinking the other day about how science cannot possibly give solid evidence of the existence or non-existence of 'God' or what have you.


Science does disprove God. How so? Because they can't prove it. So if something is not proven...it means it's not there, until they prove it at least.

There are photos out there of "orb" above freshly dead or dying bodies. I didn't know about the body getting lighter by x grams though. will post some links in the morning

It is my firm belife that both science and faith can and should compliment each other. The so called "struggle" between them simply should not exist.

Human consciousness or the soul has been found to not fully reside with in the body. It seems however to be made up of several parts all coming together at the physcial level.

Energy from "God" communicatingwith your cells, which have been found to have "self-receptors" which allows your cells to recieve information form an unknown source.

Bosons, which are quantum particles. These can reflect the changes of the zero-point field which can be translated into bio-chemical responses of your neurons.

Memories, our experiances determine what we perceive and how we view the world.

Science cannot explain God nor the sould but it by no means can disprove either and there is enough evidnce to say that both exist to a point.

With the technology available today we should be able to measure the amount of energy given off by the human soul

Xavier has said it best as far as Im concerened.Kudos.

hmm no clue but i wanna know though

Your science has indeed proven the soul. It is called Philosophy. You can see this soul existence in many things around you.

Well that is an interesting way of putting it.Good call.

@bigz4500: How? and what?

we can measure brain activity. We can measure "death" so to speak. But there is up to today no serious scientific evidence that anything measurable leaves the body when said body turns into a corpse.

And it has been tried since this is obviously something almost any scientist would be interested in.

Results: None, Nada, Zero. Zilch.

So what technology would you suggest we use? How to set up a reliable scientific experiment? Preferable without becoming murderers ...

SarraS:

I actually agree with you on this, however let me bring up this idea.

Our bodies run off electricity and once we die that energy is dispersed. I would imagin that as the neurons stop and the neurotransmitters begin to break down that flow of elcetrons is broken and a current cannot continue to pass nor keep things steady. Would it not be possible that the abundance of now "free" electrons could simply exist the body? Thus causesing a very small loss of mass.

Of course this isnt what we call the "soul" but I think it may answer part of the "lost weight" theory.

You are not running off of energy but producing it as a by-product. The weight loss is that of your breathe. Nothing more. But then again, it is the breathe that connects your soul with your body. People have a tendency and think of their physical body first and then their true self as a second thought. You only limit yourselves by doing this type of reasoning.

Your right we due produce energy and while we are alive we maintain an amount of energy. Once we die that part of the body breaks down and we loose the energy.

The physical body and the mind/soul/consciousness.. are connected. A solar flare on a star a billion light years away can have a direct physical effect on my body here. Observation changes the observed, thought creates reality there is no seperation of the physical and the soul.

It is when we understand this and use science and belief together that we can truly understand both. We only limit ourselves if we continue to think the 2 are seperate.

Etrigan - if we're not "running off" of energy, but only creating energy as a by-product, what is the main product our bodies are producing?

I would argue that we are indeed "running off" of energy and waste, things we can no longer manage to turn into energy, is the by-product. The point of an organism is to remain alive which cannot be accomplished if it doesn't produce energy. On top of that, in order to create an organism - energy is also required.

If you were indeed running off of energy then you could in theory create that Frankenstein monster, could you not? But you can't. You are not physical beings to begin with. It is the soul through spirit that gives you what you believe is you. Everything else is only secondary in nature.

According to St Augustine - no!
He argued that since G_d breathed life into man and not woman (woman came from Adam's rib) man was given a soul and not woman. The church of course never accepted this theory but it is a sound one.

Then what are we running off? What gives us the ability to move? And while we cannot make the monster we can use directed pulses of electricity to allow people to walk, move and live (hello AED's)

Discribe how we are not physical?

Etrigan - you're right. In THEORY you could create the Frankenstein monster - but that would be if we ran off of electricity - a form of energy. There are several other types of energy of which we are subject to.

Etrigan~I personally don't think that is a sound theory. I am no different than any male. Wait! I take that back..I can have kids..that is the only difference..reproductive organs. I cry and love same as any male.

If the reason Eve was devoid of a soul was because she was created from Adam's rib, what does that mean of Adam? He was born from dirt.

Regardless of if Eve had a soul or not once they mated Adams "soul" would have transfered and all those born after male of female would now have a soul.

But I think we're getting off topic we should be focusing on science not archaic theologies.

Oh good grief and this is the part the gets me the most....all of this all of these facts that we have gotten are from the writtings of someone...this is ridiculous and pointless because you cannot sway what someone believes and you cannot prove any of it...not from just some words that someone human ....has written down...since you cannot prove that we have a soul or that there is anything other than what we have at this time ...existing...what is the point....yes I do hope there is more cause if this is it...well that would just suck...but I am not going to just believe something that others want me to believe...just because someone wrote it down...I have no problem with people having something to believe in...most need that to exist....

well a spirit can be called a soul.
and the chiristians call god the holy spirit.
if you think science can not prove or disprove god then it can also not prove or disprove a soul.

their is no evidense in any way for the soul or if god excist

HFS, while there is no direct evidence for God once you look at the nature of the universe it becomes apparent that there must be some sort of highest power "God".

Where did the universe come from? How were humans made? The static universe theory has been disproven beyond debate. And even the most ardent evolutionists say that there must have been some type of over-ridding intellegence for humans to have been created.

All Diminsions are connected and build higher and higher plans none can exist without the others. The way they are aligned points to the highest plane of existance being this "god force".

Some of the more complicated science is covered in my journal under both Ab Actus and Personal entries.

i do agre with you on your point you made for the fact that i am a satanic preist
wich that means i do beleave that both excist but their is no factual evidense that they both excist either

not tryin to start a war i am a firm beleaver in freedome of religion just haveing a conversation not intended to offend any

I am still focused on energy fields around living human beings auras or Bio feed back could be fine tuned to explore this topic...I would like to read that report.

anything is possible but i do not think science will ever make it that far but some crazy rich guy could say that he is god and i am sure that people would believe him so i guess it is just a matter of opinion

It does not matter what science says; there is a difference in the feel. A live person feels different. A dead person is “heavier” to move or to carry and not by “x grams” there is something to the term dead weight.

A physician once placed dying patients upon a scale in order to measure the weight of the human soul.

The experiment is now considered a waste of time - just bad science.

I think of the soul is the language of the brain, in which activities of different parts of the brain have somehow to be interlocked and made to to match so that we devise a grand overall way of life. Like how a painter is taking the world to pieces and putting it together on the same canvas. And every painting is different. Except with a painter you can watch him thinking while he is doing it, and with the soul the process of thought always hides.

For example, Georges Seurat putting one colored dot beside another of a different color to get the total effect in "Young woman with a powder puff:"

i found this, does it help?


Science of the soul

Science can't prove or disprove theology.

No,and neither can faith.
Not on their own anyway.

So,as always it all comes to an enpasse.The beauty of science shows us that energies at work are simply staples in our universe,and are a major part of what we are.And it gives us some thing to go on,gives credibility to magicks and it allows us to communicate to others forces that are at work.Now whether we can figure it all out,remains to be seen.And depending on what one believes too.Everyone has been touched with the breath of life...man,woman ,child..but what that is? might never know.But it sure as hell is fun trying to figure it out!

the crazy rich guy thing it has happened and people did beleave it as well so its pretty crazy

I don't think they can. But they have found something in the dna that they can't tell what the do and that may be what the soul is.

I know they have.I had posted something about that some time ago.

And actually,they can tell what they do.

im sorry but my opion is that i cant figure out how it is huemanly or godly possible for one individual two know what billions of people do every second of their life it just dont make sense

Oceanne you are very much correct, we have indeed found things within DNA which may shead light on the soul.

It has taken us 10,000years to get to where we are now. It would be foolish to say that our knowledge is any sort of benchmark or judge or what can or cannot be. As time goes on and our collective wisdom increases, one day, we shall know much more and some of these questions will be answerd.

Let me touch on one thing. God(big G) is all powerful right? We humans are a few flecks in a universe of trillions of starts and planets. So why can't God know everything about us? We tend to think in linear fashion, thinking what we can or cant understand is or is not. This can only provide problems. We thought the earth was the center of all, we thought that illness happened due to ill vapors but today we can operate inside a persons brian without so much as a scalple and we use computers to manage thousands of troops in battle.

Only time drivin by wisdom shall tell.

"From wonder into wonder existence opens." Lao tzu

Read that when I was about sixteen, and is echoed in Etrigan's statement about seeing the soul's existence around you.

I don't believe in a perfect God or a purposeful plan to existence. I believe in soul, in a mind/body connection, and in the further symmetry and connectiveness of humans with the universe.

The science is lovely and intriguing, and for me does not dispel the wonder --- only encourages further questioning.

I don't think human soul can be quantified.

You know Xavier,that brings up another tasty little tibit for us to chew on...The almighty computer.Think about that for a sec.
If we can watch a persons every single move above ground ,and even into the earth,as primitive as we still are,whats to say that God wouldnt have the same type of thing,only bionic ,using the energies we see before us today.Hmm Id say he might be able to see quite a bit.

Bloodmother,I completely agree with your statement about science enhancing the wonder of it all. It very much does .
I have said it before,I'll say it again.
And GOD said "E+Mc2"

And then,there was light.

E=MC2 oops

Science is the ex-wife of faith.... if they could stop arguing for just a minute they'd see they're both wrong....

yes it is starting to make some sense now but the technologie we do have what happens when its all deaystroted do you think we will prevail

omg uzziel,isnt that the truth?

Will who or what prevail? I dont get your question HFS.

I think everything has a soul..people trees, animals everything as to the whole god thing I dont know

Uzziel, maybe science is the second wife and has learned not to accept everything on faith.

I believe we all have a soul. Science is a funny thing they try to prove or disprove everything and if they cannot disprove it then it doesnt exsist.

eh,not so much anymore .There are alot of things that cannot be proven yet,and maybe never...doesnt mean it doesnt exsist.
It would have to be one stupid scientist to believe otherwise.
Perhaps the proof is already out there,and we just havent recognized it yet for what it is.

All living things give off energy but where does the original spark come from to activate that energy? The question alone should also be the answer.

The breath of life..sound waves perhaps?

Occeane I have been enjoying your posts! and have found the others enlightening.

It seems tis thread hes created a bit of controversy here!

Is good to see differing opinions!

Ah thank you Gwen.The controversy of this is what makes it so exciting.Hell,if we knew everything about everything,things might get just a little boring I would think.It is great not knowing.

I just want to throw something out there that might start this discussion in a new direction. Out of body experiences when a person dies on an operating table and comes back to life. Or just out of body experiences in general. What is that if not your soul looking back at life?

Who can really sayif it is the soul looking back or not? It is a good suggestion though.I think the one thing that really eludes us is hard eveidence of a soul.Or,maybe be already have that,but just do not realize it yet.

I have heard that they cannot prove or disprove the fact we have a soul. They know the body looses weight when we die but cannot work out why. I feel it is one of those things no matter what they do they will not know the truth.

ie. medical cannot find a cure for the common cold yet can do open heart surgy etc etc it just something out of our reach.