.
VR
Your Pets and seeing Spirits
General Discussion
•  General Discussion Home  •   Forums Home  •



LadyDarkRayne
LadyDarkRayne
Noble Sire (167)
Posts: 2,211
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
02:16:57 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,823 times

Years ago when I lived along the Niagara Parkway in upper Niagara Falls, NY, we lived in a house where a murder had ocurred. We wer not aware of this until some tim after we moved in. I know check into these things, has sort of become a hobby.

Well at the time, not one of my pets, dog or cats would go up satirs to the top floor, even tried to carry the up the stairs, the would growl and hiss s soon asi would get 4 steps up the stairs. The upstairshad been redone from an oldr attic into a 2 bedroms conected by a walk in closet.

Well at the time we already had 3 bedrooms down stairs so i just use th upstairs as storage


After 2 months of watching the cats stare at the stairs and hissing I decided to do some checking into the history of the house.

Shivers, I found out that there had been a domestic issue and man had killed his gf and then killed himself and he was not a very nice man.

We hd alsorts of bizar things happe while we lived in that house, the lighht bulbs constantly blew upstairs on a weekly basis, no matter how warm it was it was always freezing in the upper back bedroo by the window
my doh would constantly lay at the bottom of th e steps and star up and just growl.


I came across this article of a fellow New York Paranormal Investigator, Stephen Wagner,
and his article on, Animals and Ghosts.

EVEN PEOPLE WHO believe in an afterlife and the possibility of ghosts are often skeptical when it comes to the idea of spirit animals. They don't have souls or spirits, goes the argument, and therefore cannot have a life in the next world. But cats, dogs, birds and other animals are made up of the same energy that humans are, and it may be as possible that this energy can survive death, just as it can for people. Anyone who is close to their pets will testify to the psychic connection they share. Psychic energy and spiritual energy may all be a part of the same phenomenon, and so animals might have as much of a connection to the unseen world as we do.Maybe more. Animals not only may appear as ghostly forms, they may also be more sensitive to the proximity of spirits.

link: http://paranormal.about.com/cs/trueghoststories/a/aa111703.htm

I know there are many paranormal investigators here on VR, so tis should be a great thread.

I would like to hear your experiences .

So I was wondering if any one else has had this experience with their own animals ?





•  REPLY  •


TheFireWithin
TheFireWithin
Premiere Sire (124)
Posts: 2,110
Honor: 56
[ Give / Take ]
House Eternal is a member of an Alliance

Member of House Eternal
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
02:46:43 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,812 times

I had a horse that would always play with me.. Well, one day, I saw him jumping and running around like he was playing with someone else but I couldn't see anybody. His brushes would always be out of place. I figured he just dragged them out to the middle of the pasture himself. So I started locking them up but they still got out there. His blanket was hung over a fallen log one day. I'd be the first one home from school and his halter would be on him with the reigns up over his back... It was creepy. I did the same thing you did.. I checked into it. Turns out, a little girl had died in a storm out in the pasture when she was trying to round up her horses. They spooked and trampled her to death.



•  REPLY  •


ohhdangBISHH
ohhdangBISHH
Phantom (28)
Posts: 22
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
02:55:51 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,808 times

my boyfriends friends dog sees stuff. when we go to stay at his house, rosco(dog) stays in the spare room with us sometimes and will randomly growl at the walls. or something in the air. and somebody hung theirselves at the house.



•  REPLY  •


LadyDarkRayne
LadyDarkRayne
Noble Sire (167)
Posts: 2,211
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
02:56:09 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,807 times

Ya wow Girl we share a love of horses too !

I forgotten about that there are trails here were my mare will not go down, there is a set of trails that cut down to the lake by my parents house, alot of the area there is old indian burial ground, as per why it has never been developed. But none of my horses will go thru the pass, I have been thrown many times with trying to urge them thru and no amount of whispring will get them to go thru there.



•  REPLY  •


TheFireWithin
TheFireWithin
Premiere Sire (124)
Posts: 2,110
Honor: 56
[ Give / Take ]
House Eternal is a member of an Alliance

Member of House Eternal
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
02:59:26 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,804 times

I know... People think that horses are the dumbest creatures when they're actually the smartest if not the most stubborn. I bet you could get a dog through there with enough coaxing but most horses will absolutely refuse to go where someone is buried..... I've known a few that will but not many... maybe a handful



•  REPLY  •


QuenOfRoses
QuenOfRoses

No Longer Registered
03:13:51 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,802 times

am not paranormal or anything but i do have some experience about it.

a years ago,i buy a beach house.the reason i did. because its far away from anybody and near with the forest. that why my friend said.

anyway,my fist night,was on January 2nd. am planing to stay for some fresh desire. the pets are bring too. so,everything was going good in that lovely evening, am reading, my pets playing around.and my snakes on my lap. untill,night came down,i feel so weird by the wind behind my back,its like whispered somthing that i don't heard clearly.and my dogs, won't keep quite, they barking on my badroom door,like somebody stand there,and then,suddenly,by next minute.they just shut,but with curious face.

i can't moved,my body are calm still,but my eye in my dogs and the door every second,i was like wait for something happend,but nothing.

and i sleep outsite my badroom with the pets.but i had such dream. i saw a women,young one.so beautiful,but look empty and fall in love in the same time. i was noticed,because her face so close to me. then she said, "nabora farte culisha petoramarus." and i just nod,even i don't understand what the words meant. after saying that,she leaving,leave me alone with smile on my face. so weird.

next morning,i just found out,it is s grave in my next garden.and to old.i buying the house by friend,so i don't even looks in to it.

but now, i like stay there.its make me comfort and save. i don't know why.may be because i felt am not alone.



•  REPLY  •


BloodThirstyLips817
BloodThirstyLips817

No Longer Registered
03:24:10 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,799 times

My kitten will sit in the middle of the floor staring at what I think is nothing. But, he will cock his head back & forth as if someone is talking to him. Shortly after that he will come over & love on me. So, I'm not sure what's up with that.



•  REPLY  •


Juggalita
Juggalita

No Longer Registered
04:48:30 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,790 times

I have not, but I do think that animals can see stuff that we cannot.

If you ever notice, ur pet just stares off into space or whatever, like they are really lookin at something, and when you look, there is nothing there...they could be seeing stuff!!

It's just weird to think about ha.

-Juggalette givin MMFWCL



•  REPLY  •


vampiricdragon83
vampiricdragon83
Vampling (25)
Posts: 20
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
09:38:42 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,775 times

my dogs certainly see things which i can't but weither they are seeing spirits or something else i have no idea



•  REPLY  •


mysticwinds
mysticwinds

No Longer Registered
18:42:02 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,750 times

My dog for three days bark behind a glass coffee table I have with my gems and staues on it. She would start and just continue to bark, stop and bark again. I checked to see if one of her toys or bones was lodged behind the table nothing. At times she will go up the stairs by herself at other's she will stay at the landing of the stairs and just stare up at nothing....that I cannot see. When I ascend the stairs the only way she will go up is if I carry her up .



•  REPLY  •


TheFireWithin
TheFireWithin
Premiere Sire (124)
Posts: 2,110
Honor: 56
[ Give / Take ]
House Eternal is a member of an Alliance

Member of House Eternal
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
19:13:49 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,747 times

Wow.. that is a weird one. Anyone ever have their animals hide from things you can't see? A couple of my dogs used to run in and hide under my bed for no apparent reason. lol



•  REPLY  •


Angitia41
Angitia41
Evildoer (42)
Posts: 0
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
20:27:26 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,744 times

Children and pets see things we don't because they are innocent. My cats tend to stare at the ceiling and hiss .And even growl one had hair standing on the back of her neck.



•  REPLY  •


birra
birra
Venerable Sire (131)
Posts: 463
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 20 years.
20:31:43 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,742 times

I've done work in a lot of older houses and buildings in Upstate New York and have heard similar stories from the occupants.

Dogs barking down the basement stairs for no reason.

Dogs and cats seeming to either be attracted to or avoiding a certain place or object.

Odds are there is more to the story and if investigated with an open mind, the actual cause would be discovered...

...but people tend to believe what they want to, regardless of the evidence.



•  REPLY  •


sheepsheadwanderer
sheepsheadwanderer
Baronial Sire (177)
Posts: 810
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of Art (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 20 years.
20:56:53 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,737 times

My cats often stare at things that I cannot see. Doesn't matter if it's night or day. There is one wall in my house that they stare at. Often times they look up and stare too. Unnerving when I am alone. But I do know cats and all animals sense things we cannot.



•  REPLY  •


20:59:17 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,735 times

whats werid is my cat echo can sense it when I get sick and when that happens he never leaves my side till I get well again



•  REPLY  •


Beastt17
Beastt17
Pain Giver (55)
Posts: 903
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
21:14:50 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,730 times

I find it interesting that people look at animals as being comparatively intellectually feeble when it serves one's purposes (like when they're hungry). Yet when it comes to proclaiming "the paranormal", suddenly animals are seen as being more enlightened than humans.

Has anyone ever had an animal proclaim why it appears frightened? Perhaps there is a bad smell the animal doesn't like. Perhaps the blood seeped into the flooring and it's something like the dead hide of a cow stretched across a road which discourages cattle from attempting to cross; not because of "evil spirits", but because they realize something caused one of them to die there (even though it was probably killed elsewhere).

Cold rooms are usually the result of poor insulation, a shaded roof or wall, or even a draft coming through a poorly sealed room.

I had a dog who was terrified of thunder. There was no sign that he was sensing Zeus or the anger of Zeus. It was the noise that frightened him and he didn't understand the source so he acted out of ignorance and instinct. I've seen cats take an instant dislike to stuffed animals. And the more you try to force them, the more they tend to suspect the object. If you let them investigate on their own, some will overcome their fear, others won't.

There is zero credible evidence to support the idea of the paranormal, after-life, souls, etc. Yet the blanket assertions remain popular as unevidenced conclusions for anything some might not wish to pursue further. They just claim it was a ghost, a spirit, a soul or whatever suggestion they've been indoctrinated to and end the search for rational explanations.

The intellectually honest thing to do is to proclaim that they don't have a reasonable conclusion. Instead it seems common to apply ready-made conclusions even when those conclusions are as devoid of understanding as the original unknown.

Sometimes I hear things I can't immediately pin-point. Sometimes it's days later when I discover that something fell from a precarious position in a closet. I could immediately conclude that the noise was a spirit trying to communicate with me, but that's very much like the old child's table about the chicken immediately concluding that the sky is falling after being struck on the head by an acorn.

Ghosts, spirits, souls and other fabled assertions of the paranormal fully qualify as superstitions -- beliefs devoid of credible supporting evidence. And yet people flock to such explanations because it's fun, it provides a one-stop explanation for anything not immediately explained via natural means, and lets people think they're somehow special or gifted because they can claim to have experienced that most have not experienced, and is unsupportable via rational methods (unless, of course, one actually looks for rational explanations).



•  REPLY  •


BornfromDeath
BornfromDeath
Sire (105)
Posts: 116
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
22:24:09 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,725 times

our cats will not go into my daughters room.... they will go anywhere else but there...they stop and look up and back away



•  REPLY  •


CryingDutchess
CryingDutchess
Hellhound (70)
Posts: 355
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
22:40:00 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,722 times

Well, Nicholas, my cat, has a tendency to get up from his bed and run like a wild man for no apparent reason. Then, he will face a corner and start his singing (he's an alto!)... then WHOOSH! He runs back and forth throughout the townhouse until he tires himself out. There is no notable history here. I know the prior tenants had domestic issues, but no murder and mayhem.



•  REPLY  •


InADarkPlace
InADarkPlace
Sire (109)
Posts: 0
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 20 years.
22:55:18 Oct 21 2008
Read 1,718 times

never had any experience with my pets but do know that my sister's dog had refused to go near this tree where she had lived at one time and whimpered if she had tried to walk near it.
her ex-husband had hung himself from one of the branches.



•  REPLY  •


DeadlyXDesire
DeadlyXDesire
Daywalker (94)
Posts: 32
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of The Coven of Purgatory
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
00:42:16 Oct 22 2008
Read 1,711 times

I personally have never had experiences where my animals have sensed anything out of the ordinary as far as paranormal activity goes.

I do believe that animals can sense things that we cannot. There is a case of a cat that lives at a nursing home that will not go to anyone but a person who is getting ready to pass away. So they do sense things that we cannot and I don't know if it will ever be scientifically proven either.



•  REPLY  •


TheFireWithin
TheFireWithin
Premiere Sire (124)
Posts: 2,110
Honor: 56
[ Give / Take ]
House Eternal is a member of an Alliance

Member of House Eternal
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
01:48:44 Oct 22 2008
Read 1,706 times

Beast17, of course people are going to flock to the subject. People have believed in spirits and the paranormal since the very first humans and there notions of gods hiding in every corner. But nowadays, it is just fun. So let people have their fun. I know animals, I used to be a vet. So I know all the little smells, and quirks, and habits that they exhibit from time to time and why they might do it. But there are even some things that I don't get about what they do. I'd like to THINK it's spirits and the like though I know it's highly improbable.... but again, let us have our fun. No need to tear it down with some long lecture. Jeez... lol



•  REPLY  •


LadyDarkRayne
LadyDarkRayne
Noble Sire (167)
Posts: 2,211
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
02:44:58 Oct 22 2008
Read 1,698 times

Beast17, well being you see nothing in agreement on amjority of the posts, why bother, this site is The Darknetwork, Um hello, is this not the point? Everyone has their own opinions. Enough said.



•  REPLY  •


FireSerpent
FireSerpent
Sire (105)
Posts: 94
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
02:53:56 Oct 22 2008
Read 1,697 times

Since everything is energy..
some animals do in fact see more of the light spectrum, such as infrared.. just as no star "dies" it just infinitely changes spectrum.. im taking a wild guess that everything else follows this..
so of course some pets can see more of the "light" around them.cats eyes use a re reflection of light to help see much more then the humans eye can...



•  REPLY  •


birra
birra
Venerable Sire (131)
Posts: 463
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 20 years.
04:47:46 Oct 22 2008
Read 1,688 times

So when your cat flips out, he might just be reacting to the TV remote...

...good to keep in mind.



•  REPLY  •


TheVampyreLogan
TheVampyreLogan

No Longer Registered
06:54:26 Oct 22 2008
Read 1,684 times

Hello everyone, this is my 1st. post. My lady love's cat routinely tracks "something" moving in our home. Most of the time he'll just lgaze at the air tracking some invisible movement. What is it? Who knows....whether it is energy from a tv remote or energy from a manifestation of consciousness, it's all energy to me.



•  REPLY  •


erin88
erin88
Hellion (73)
Posts: 8
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of Legion (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
09:45:48 Oct 22 2008
Read 1,679 times

I used to have a cat (passed away about 5 months ago, age 17)
Who, late at night when I would be reading in bed, would look around the room like she was watching someone walk around or sometimes into the corners of the roof and walls.
After she passed away, we got another cat about 3 months after (age 3) Who now does EXACTLY the same thing.
Coincidence? i think not!

lol



•  REPLY  •


TemptingDeath
TemptingDeath
Bête Noire (44)
Posts: 64
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of The Coven of Purgatory
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
10:07:58 Oct 22 2008
Read 1,675 times

I have my cat, Shayd with me whenever I go on a ghost hunt because as an animal her senses are more attuned to the supernatural because she has not been conditioned to ignore her feelings. I have found several spectors that I would have otherwise missed had it not been for her reacting in some way to the spectors presence.



•  REPLY  •


BlazeXValnarn
BlazeXValnarn
Curmudgeon (11)
Posts: 0
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
13:09:49 Oct 22 2008
Read 1,670 times

I myself have found that i can sense a faint presence where ever i go, my cats only confirm my theory that there are at least 2 spirits in my house. A young boy and a young female adult. They are both kind, but seem troubled. I have had times when i would wake up with the female having her face only inches from mine. The young boy would always run around the house as the cats chased him, just playing, running around, carefree.



•  REPLY  •


Jynx
Jynx
Primogenitor (99)
Posts: 614
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Coven of Elizabeth Batory is a member of an Alliance

Member of Coven of Elizabeth Batory
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
14:21:34 Oct 22 2008
Read 1,665 times

yes they are capable of...

one night while sleeping on bed around 2 am i was in active mind open eyes. i gave thought to check if some one there on street. i went to sub conscious state and as i was in subconscious, the sound of wach and breathe went up 10-20 time loudly and immediately street dogs started barking and cats started crying. fearing that I stopped my this try.



•  REPLY  •


LikeLovingTheDead
LikeLovingTheDead
Nightmare (97)
Posts: 33
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
House Eternal is a member of an Alliance

Member of House Eternal
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
15:40:46 Oct 22 2008
Read 1,656 times

I remember my brother living in a house where a man had killed himself, and his dog would always stare at the walls. One morning he woke up and couldn't move, something was restraining him from getting up or even looking at his alarm clock. Also doors would open and close by themselves...



•  REPLY  •


VanillaBear
VanillaBear
Bloodsucker (50)
Posts: 23
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of Legion (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
16:18:36 Oct 22 2008
Read 1,647 times

When I was living with my grandparents I knew the house was haunted, but when I got my dog there were certain places she wouldn't go and she would try to stop me from going into by standing infront of me or using her mouth to grab pieces of my clothes and pull back on them. Other spots she would fix in on and either growl or wimper. If I wasn't home she didn't want to be inside. She was a cuddly dog in the room I first slept in and when I moved to another room she didn't sleep next to me she watch from the other side of the room. It wasn't just her other dogs I had when I visit would do the same things or similar.



•  REPLY  •


GatsunoKisu
GatsunoKisu
Basilisk (92)
Posts: 629
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of Legion (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
17:15:06 Oct 22 2008
Read 1,635 times

And just so you know, the only reason this country is able to survive is because people hold on to their religions and their beliefs. People use their faith as a means to keep their own morale high. Who are you to say they're wrong? Who are you to tell them that everything they've ever believed in is a lie? That's why holy wars are started. Not because of the differences in religion but because one says the other is a lie and tries to convert them. Looks like you need to do a little more homework.

And don't try to "finish" someone's statement for them. She said all that she wanted to say. For you to take it and twist it around into something you want it to be just for the sake of "showing" people how wrong they are is just sick and perverse. But then again, you do have your own opinions. We just wish you would post it in a more appropriate thread. Maybe you can create one for all those like you to post in. Then you can tell each other how wrong you are and that everything you think and belief is a lie.



•  REPLY  •


SYNDERELLA
SYNDERELLA
Irritater (16)
Posts: 0
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
22:17:30 Oct 22 2008
Read 1,629 times

i have a cat. her name is sasha. sasha and i spend alot of time together in our new apartment. this day i was running around the place trying to get stuff together,when i hear sasha meowing in the hallway-at first i thought nothing of it... it was her just being herself.until that night i went to go take a shower and i closed the door. sasha started that noise again, and again i ignored her. i open the bathroom door and there was sasha on her hind legs in the corner playing with something. then something scared the shit out of her and she bolted down the hall to my bed room. she hid under my bed for three days. we still live there. but whatever scared her never did it again. so, yes, animals can definately see what we can not. lol- spooky ain't it??



•  REPLY  •


DeadlyXDesire
DeadlyXDesire
Daywalker (94)
Posts: 32
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of The Coven of Purgatory
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
23:18:36 Oct 22 2008
Read 1,616 times

Beastt17...Here is a question for you and really for those whose opinions differ. Do you not think that superstitions is necessary to open our minds to possibilites that would not have existed otherwise? How can we learn about the unknown and explore it and determine it scientifically if no one explored them. I think you have to have both in this world or discovery would not be possible.



•  REPLY  •


Beastt17
Beastt17
Pain Giver (55)
Posts: 903
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
09:18:44 Oct 23 2008
Read 1,604 times

DeadlyXDesire,

Re: "Here is a question for you and really for those whose opinions differ. Do you not think that superstitions is necessary to open our minds to possibilites that would not have existed otherwise? How can we learn about the unknown and explore it and determine it scientifically if no one explored them. I think you have to have both in this world or discovery would not be possible."

Thank you.

I think that's an excellent question (the kind that leads to productive discussion). But in that it's a little off-topic (the thread topic, rather than the apparent popular topic), I'll try to keep my response very short.

If we look to the history of discovery we can quickly find the answer you seek. I've asked many times in many different threads for even a single example of when subjective beliefs have existed without objective corroboration and turned out to be correct. I've never seen anyone even attempt an answer. The reason is clear; it just doesn't happen that way. We make new discoveries by recognizing objective evidence and never by adhering to subjective opinion. Never has objective evidence suggested in contrary to subjective assertion, and the subjective assertion turned out to be correct.

Superstition leads to suffering, bigotry, hatred, death, war and loss. Adhering to methodologically sound analysis of objective evidence leads to discovery. If you know of even a single example to the contrary, I'd be very interested in hearing it.

Again, thank you. :)



•  REPLY  •


Oblivion
Oblivion

No Longer Registered
10:12:40 Oct 23 2008
Read 1,600 times

My grandmother's dog likes to randomly start barking at whatever she hears or seems to see. Nobody actually died in this house because my grandma is the first owner of the house. This spirit may be one of two people, though. Either my grandfather who died when my mom was only 4, or my grandma's second husband who died 8 years ago from a degenerative disease brought on by age.



•  REPLY  •


Seshat
Seshat
Chimera (90)
Posts: 135
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Chateau Orleans (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Chateau Orleans (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
15:09:21 Oct 23 2008
Read 1,594 times

One time in the woods my german shepherd and me wer taking a walk. I thought he might have seen a deer or something cause he took off running and barking after something. I followed and he came to this house that was abandoned. The dog was barking like crazy and I thought it was weird. All the windows were busted out and no one was in there, so I went in and got this really crazy feeling I was being watched. The dog still barked and I had to drag him off.



•  REPLY  •


BarefootMisfit
BarefootMisfit
High Sire (155)
Posts: 5,287
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
15:27:02 Oct 23 2008
Read 1,588 times

I have 3 black cats and before we moved in to our new place we lived in a apartment and in a corner in our bedroom our male cat used to side on the night stand facing the corner and meow all the time he would also stand up and paw at some unseen thing. Well one day I was in the kitchen and out of the corner of my eye I saw a small gray kitten just walk across the floor from the bathroom towards the front door i turned to make sure what I was seeing and it just stopped and disappeared. But I always knew when it was playing with the cats.



•  REPLY  •


SweetlyDecadent
SweetlyDecadent

No Longer Registered
15:40:12 Oct 23 2008
Read 1,581 times

My late pet dog used to spirits in my home

*which was haunted*

there where times when she use to sit up and growl then the room would go cold and out of the corner of my eye I would see something standing where she was growling, this happend more then once.







•  REPLY  •


Cheetahcry
Cheetahcry
Diabolist (91)
Posts: 420
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
23:13:56 Oct 24 2008
Read 1,569 times

I feel that our pets and children can see the things that we can not see. I am sure that some of you have seen this with your pets and possibly your children as well. They can tell you faster if what you are looking at is a friend or a foe.



•  REPLY  •


DeadlyXDesire
DeadlyXDesire
Daywalker (94)
Posts: 32
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of The Coven of Purgatory
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
23:56:12 Oct 24 2008
Read 1,564 times

Cheetahcry I do have to agree with you that children & pets sensory perceptions is much keener than ours. My youngest son can tell alot about people just by viewing them and watching their behaviors that most adults would not see. I know it has nothing to do with the paranormal but do believe that they are more in tuned to what we don't see.



•  REPLY  •


juanaldamuy
juanaldamuy

No Longer Registered
05:31:08 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,557 times

Well I had a dog that I would walk everyday past a cemetary
and my dog would either bark, growl, whimper or refuse to go near it. It really started to get on my nerves. Then one day another person was walking their dog and their dog did the same thing. So I asked the man why his dog would do that and he said that animals have a keen sense for things that we can't see but they can.



•  REPLY  •


Beastt17
Beastt17
Pain Giver (55)
Posts: 903
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
09:44:33 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,547 times

If children have better instincts than adults why is it that adults must always caution children about strangers and not the other way around?



•  REPLY  •


NartinaLeMaliki
NartinaLeMaliki
Archfiend (57)
Posts: 192
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of CryptKeeper (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
09:55:25 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,545 times

I think that the answer to your question is more so because strangers can pressure children into going with them, whether by force or something else. Despite the fact that a child does have better instincts, they don't run as fast as strangers, and are easily persuaded when they are bribed with something they like.

Children are more sensitive to their instincts and more susceptible to paranormal activity simply because they haven't learned to cover their instincts like adults have. Over the years, circumstances and what not dull our instincts so that we, as adults, hardly pay attention to them anymore. If we're talking to someone we do not know, we generally go with what is polite, even if our instincts are telling us to push them away and run, simply for the fact that society has told us that it is rude to do so. Children, however, are less likely to do that. If they don't like someone, they'll tend to be brutally honest and even what we consider rude, even if they are only acting out of self preservation.

Have you ever been punished for being mean to someone you thought was bad, when you were a child? It's this reason why we ignore our instincts. Growing children and adults tend to fear the risk of getting in trouble so much that they would rather ignore their "flight or fight" feelings, and just "be nice." It's societies fault.



•  REPLY  •


LadyStrange
LadyStrange
Incendiary (86)
Posts: 201
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of Legion (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
10:03:12 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,544 times

I believe that animals do sense more than most other living beings, my cats used to go mental in our old appartment, even becoming quite hostile, but since we have moved into a new build, they have mellowed out completly, even starting to be nice. we never had a good feeling in our old home, even before we got the kittens. I dont know if there were any spirits in there, or wether or not it was down to the damp and mold in there. (which the landlords denied)



•  REPLY  •


hottie
hottie
Fiend (35)
Posts: 0
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 20 years.
10:10:05 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,542 times

i think pets definately do have kind of a sixth sense, i think they can feel the presence of spirits or anything unhuman, they also have better hearing and smelling senses than us : )



•  REPLY  •


hvampiress1313
hvampiress1313
Evil One (74)
Posts: 12
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of Wolves of Odin (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
14:05:45 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,536 times

my cat always hisses when the basement door opens. she would just look down the stairs, never actually went down. One time she went down and we couldn't find her and so then i made a kissy sound which she knows means to come and she ran up the stairs at lightening speed and ran up to the 2nd floor under my bed!



•  REPLY  •


DeadlyXDesire
DeadlyXDesire
Daywalker (94)
Posts: 32
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of The Coven of Purgatory
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
14:50:33 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,532 times

Beastt17...we must warn our children against strangers to show them what they must do to flee a situation and to get away safely. It isn't because they are so trusting of these people, it is because the adult can easily overpower the child. It is very true with adults as well.



•  REPLY  •


SelfDestruct
SelfDestruct

No Longer Registered
15:04:16 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,528 times

I have a few pugs that stare at the wall and stuff. And they bark and random things, I don't know if it's ghost though.



•  REPLY  •


CuRsEdToDaRkNeSs
CuRsEdToDaRkNeSs
High Sire (158)
Posts: 1,286
Honor: 1,392
[ Give / Take ]
Member of The House of La Bella Oscuridad
Vampire Rave member for 20 years.
15:05:06 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,526 times

Hello all, lets everyone remember that we all are entitled to our opinions. and that every post made is an opinion. That said there is no right or wrong answer. However, lets refrain from commenting in a way that is offensive to others or that claims anothers opinion to be incorrect. Thank you.



Now back to the topic on hand.

I am a paranormal investigator here in the southern tri-state area, and Ive seen MANY things..... As to if an animal can sense paranormal activity first hand I do not know as I am not a pet, but I do know that it seems that have the capability to. Perhaps its not even that they see something but as is the case of most animals their hearing is more developed, perhaps it is that they hear activity on a much better scale then we do. Just another thought to throw out to everyone.



•  REPLY  •


Jynx
Jynx
Primogenitor (99)
Posts: 614
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Coven of Elizabeth Batory is a member of an Alliance

Member of Coven of Elizabeth Batory
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
16:29:09 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,522 times

well animal do have high subconscious and do catch others conscious than human and when the spirits walk throguh the path or line within the range and if no othe sound they hear and they sense it is spirit walkin through they do act on that eaither searching them or barking them or fearing them.

its the matter of conscious.

when human is astral or astral dream, its conscious is somewhere along with its spirit and when his conscious come back into body, its astral visit break coz spirit too come in the body alongwith the conscious. thats why we do feel free fall or zoom in to body from obe in the astral dreams while we are sleeping.



•  REPLY  •


DeadlyXDesire
DeadlyXDesire
Daywalker (94)
Posts: 32
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of The Coven of Purgatory
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
16:39:18 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,518 times

Cursed..thank you for posting that piece about everyone is entitled to an opinion and that there are no right or wrong answers...Thank you!



•  REPLY  •


Jynx
Jynx
Primogenitor (99)
Posts: 614
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Coven of Elizabeth Batory is a member of an Alliance

Member of Coven of Elizabeth Batory
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
16:51:59 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,514 times

well when human vision grow in subconscious state or in meditation to see the spirits, then why do not we believe that pets do see the spirits...?

animal do have high senses than normal human and subconscious too


so why the dogs are used in investigations to trace teh things.



•  REPLY  •


Beastt17
Beastt17
Pain Giver (55)
Posts: 903
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
18:10:45 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,510 times

Re: "...easily persuaded when they are bribed with something they like."

Actually, that comment is pretty much the definition of poor instincts.

Let's stop to examine this for a moment rather than simply jumping to the first conclusion which supports a desired outcome.

- Children must be cautioned about strangers because they're far more trusting than adults.

- Children must be cautioned about roadways and vehicles because they lack the instincts to know of the danger.

- Children must be cautioned about getting close to edges with long drop-offs.

- Children must be cautioned about getting too close to animals with which they're not familiar.

- Children must be cautioned about what they put in their mouths.

- Children must be cautioned about sharp objects and hot surfaces.


And the reason children must be cautioned about all of these things (and many more), is because they don't possess the instincts necessary to know of the dangers around them. Children are innately trusting and demonstrate a dangerous lack of reliable instincts. Ever see a child reach out to touch the spinning spokes of a wheel or the blade of a fan? That's a demonstration of poor instincts and curiosity mixing together.

I know people here want to believe in spirits and it's readily apparent that children are quick to believe in such things. But it has nothing to do with having a greater awareness or better instincts. It has everything to do with being extremely gullible. Children continually demonstrate poor instincts and in almost every other aspect of life, adults are quick to recognize this. Only when one wishes to conclude that they're correct about a concept which appears undetectable, do they ignore the obvious and begin to conclude that the child is superior simply because the child is gullible. (The same applies to pets, with the exception that non-human animals often do possess more acute senses of sight, smell and hearing.)

Give this a bit of genuine sincere thought; how many adults, if lost with a child, would choose to let the child pick the direction they travel? How many adults take a child's hand at an intersection and let the child guide them safely across? How many adults would let their child decide how closely they should stand to the railroad tracks or to the edge of a sharp drop? How many let their child pick their friends for them?

I'm not trying to ruin anyone's fun here but I think there should be some room left for reason and rationality. And "reason" doesn't mean grabbing for the first suggestion that supports a desired belief. It means looking to all of the evidence and finding with the supported conclusion, despite one's personal desires.

What children demonstrate is a vastly greater gullibility than adults. And that's why children are more likely to believe in ghosts, spirits and souls.

With all due respect to everyone here, there is more to the world than just opinions. It's not an opinion that the Earth orbits the sun, it's a demonstrable fact. It's not an opinion that atoms exist, it's a demonstrable fact. It's not an opinion that spirits have never credibly been confirmed to exist. It's a truth whether one likes that truth or dislikes it.

Let's not be too quick to classify something as an opinion when it's easily demonstrated to be completely true. And one of the things we can demonstrate to be true is that children are gullible. Children readily believe in trolls, fairies, mermaids, cartoon characters, monsters in the closet, imaginary friends and many other things which simply do not exist. They're not demonstrating acute perception. They're demonstrating gullibility. And just because that gullibility might be the only hope one has of holding onto beliefs which are soundly refuted in nature, doesn't make it other than gullibility.

There are terrifically small particles which shoot through and around you all day and all night long. They're called "neutrinos" and they've existed for as long as there have been stars in the universe. Children didn't detect these things, adults did. Adults detected the atom, molecules, gases in the atmosphere and gamma rays. We detected these things because they exist, and because some adults were willing to accept the reality, no matter what they might have wished that reality to be.

And something like a neutrino would be vastly more difficult to detect than a spirit. Think about a particle so small that it could virtually become lost within the mass of an atom, travels at nearly the speed of light, can go right through a planet the size of Earth without touching anything and changes properties as it travels. Compare that to an existence which is said to be visible, able to interact with the physical and exists and known points at known times (such as leaving the body at death). Which would be most difficult to detect?

People are ready and willing to suggest that children can detect such entities, but not because any child (or anyone else), has ever verified their existence; simply because children are gullible enough to believe in such things and to become caught up in the beliefs of the adults around them. Seeking peer agreement to the point that one is willing to proclaim that children have better instincts than adults shows an intense desire to find anyone who agrees, but it shows a demonstrable lack of credibility to the claims.

I was raised believing in such things. I believed in them until my mid-30s. I'm not closed off to the idea but I eventually recognized that there isn't a single credible shred of evidence to support such an idea and this idea has been around for at least tens of thousands of years. It took 26-years to confirm the existence of the neutrino after it was first suggested (based on real evidence), to exist. It took only another 20-years to be able to accurately count them using a mechanical detector. And yet no one has ever verified the existence of spirits for one very simple reason. It's not the answer people here might want, but reality isn't concerned with your wants. Spirits do not exist.

For those willing to read this and consider it, I thank you for your time. For those unwilling, I can offer only this; dismissing anything which doesn't agree with one's desired beliefs simply because one has a desire to believe, serves no function but to isolate one from the truth. Reality will not bend to meet your desires.


•  REPLY  •


RavenEyes
RavenEyes
Hellion (73)
Posts: 535
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of Wolves of Odin (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 20 years.
19:51:20 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,501 times

I don't know the history of my house, but sometimes I wonder if my dog is seeing ghosts. Often she will stare at one spot for a long period of time, sometimes growling or barking.



•  REPLY  •


XxSkyexX
XxSkyexX

No Longer Registered
19:58:08 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,498 times

well I believe that animals are more intune with the spirits of things and sense them more than we do. I had this german shepard who would bark at this tree for hours and after a few months we found out that the neighbor had been stabbed to death at that very tree, once we did a blessing Smokey(dog) stopped barking. I think he just wanted to be released from this earth who knows . Yet I do believe they can see or hear things we do not whether it be spirit or living, that have a higher sense of things then humans,



•  REPLY  •


meanmelissa
meanmelissa
Charmer (84)
Posts: 0
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of Wolves of Odin (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
20:00:48 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,496 times

I believe that pets and children can see spirits, because they are pure and more open to it. They have not been influenced any way or the another towards the subject.



•  REPLY  •


DeadlyXDesire
DeadlyXDesire
Daywalker (94)
Posts: 32
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of The Coven of Purgatory
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
22:21:23 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,490 times

Beastt17...I do not believe anyone has claimed that children have better instincts than adults but rather their sensory perceptions are a bit keener, much like animals.

Just because we may not see something or can prove it's existence does not make it false...maybe questionable...but not false.



•  REPLY  •


Beastt17
Beastt17
Pain Giver (55)
Posts: 903
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
22:51:53 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,487 times

Re: "Beastt17...I do not believe anyone has claimed that children have better instincts than adults"

And yet here are their very words, taken directly from the posts in this thread;

- "children and pets have not lost their instincts as adults have"

- "Children are more sensitive to their instincts"

- "they [children] haven't learned to cover their instincts like adults have"

And yet I've clearly demonstrated that children do not have better or "keener" instincts than adults and indeed have far less acute perceptions based on instinct.
---

Re: "...but rather their sensory perceptions are a bit keener, much like animals"

And indeed non-human animals tend to possess greater acuity of the senses, particularly when speaking of scent and hearing and to a degree, sight.

But we can test the senses of a child and they test no better than adults in most respects. True, most children can sense a slightly greater audible range but only to a very small degree. And if better hearing were the key to detecting spirits, then highly sensitive test equipment would easily out-perform the ability of any child.

The bottom line continues to be this; people proclaim that children and animals are more perceptive, not based on the reality of the differences but only on the desire to find some supporting evidence for their unsupported beliefs.

It's easy to laugh at a dog who cowers from the rumble of thunder. But it would not be unexpected to find believers in Thor proclaiming that the animal can "sense" Thor's anger. That's what seems to be happening here. People take the gullibility and imagination of children and attempt to twist it into support for their own failed beliefs. Being devoid of credible evidence doesn't leave anyone in a position to make strong assertions. So an effort is made to twist anything, no matter how demonstrably contrary to the claim, into some kind of supposed evidence.

Yet if we remain solidly seated in reality, it takes only a moderate level of observation to recognize that children are far less acute in their perception, not more acute. Adults are used to listening for threatening sounds, suspicious odors and odd movements and those who believe in spirits may even make deliberate attempts to detect them. A child can no more detect a spirit than he can ride on the back of an imaginary friend. If an adult believed in invisible, undetectable people, how many of them would insist that a child's imaginary friend is real and the child's ability to detect them is, in reality, an acute perception lost to adults?

The objective evidence for spirits continues to be zilch. Trying to twist a child's natural gullibility into one more form of subjective evidence is going to be a failed attempt at every turn.


•  REPLY  •


DeadlyXDesire
DeadlyXDesire
Daywalker (94)
Posts: 32
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of The Coven of Purgatory
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
23:11:23 Oct 25 2008
Read 1,479 times

Beastt17...forgive me for incorrectly stating that no one said instincts as you have clearly shown me I was incorrect on that.

However, how are we to discover what is unexplainable if all believed that these things do not exist? There are so many things out there that are unexplained and have been for centuries but some things such as new plants and animals have been discovered...did they not exist before discovery?



•  REPLY  •


Beastt17
Beastt17
Pain Giver (55)
Posts: 903
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
01:19:57 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,472 times

DeadlyXDesire,

Thank you for asking. I consider that to be a truly great question and unfortunately, the answer isn't quite as straight-forward as I would like.

I'm not sure I know exactly what you mean by "unexplained" but in the context of the thread, I'm left to assume that you mean things like animals appearing to see, hear or sense something that we neither hear, see nor sense. If that assumption is correct, then I think the answer is to be found in the greater sensitivity some animals possess for the natural senses. That's not always limited to the five human senses. Some kinds of fish, such as sharks and eels can detect minute electrical changes on the scale of that produced by muscle activity. Bats and dolphins can employ echo-location. Some snakes can detect minute changes in thermal energy.

So sometimes we observe animals behaving as though they have detected something we don't sense in any real form of the word. And that should be explored from exactly that conclusion -- they appear to be sensing something. And if we follow from that position, we are likely to find answers. If we instead jump to conclusions in an attempt to fuel our desired beliefs, the odds of finding truth are extremely limited.

The animal may be hearing something we don't hear, such as a mouse chewing on something in the wall. It might be reacting to an odor such as another dog/cat walking by outside. It might even be reacting to something it detects (via natural senses), that it doesn't understand, just as a dog who cowers from thunder doesn't understand what it is that it's sensing. I've seen cats who act quite strange for a day or two after their first encounter with an angry snake. They sniff about cautiously and go tearing off in six directions at once if anything near them slips out of position, makes an unexpected sound or touches them when they're not looking. They were simply left overly-cautious and fearful by their encounter with the snake.

As for discovering new things we should look to the system which is responsible for more discovery than all other systems combined -- science. That doesn't mean we have to stock up on test tubes, microscopes, oscilloscopes, pipettes and petri dishes. It simply means adhering to a standard of objectivity and conclusions based on evidence, not emotion.

Suppose I had a strong belief in Leprechauns. Now I see a dog or cat reacting in a manner which you would attribute to spirits. Am I not just as incorrect to assume that the animal is reacting to the presence of Leprechauns? Were I to jump to such a conclusion, I'd be doing nothing different than what people are doing when they conclude that it must be spirits. In fact, utilizing the same jump to a preconceived conclusion, one could claim that the animal's behavior was indicative of evil, ground-boring bats or anything else one cares to make up.

Spirits are a popular idea but one must remember that from a standpoint of evidence (that whole objectivity thing again), they are just as made-up and imagined as underground-dwelling zebras. In fact, zebras living underground is a less far-fetched imaginary entity because it's based on known (demonstrable) beings. We know zebras exist and we know that animals exist which dwell underground. But speaking from a stance of true knowledge, there is no demonstration which shows that anything non-physical (such as ghosts or spirits), actually exists. That makes it an extraordinary claim at the very least. And extraordinary claims do require extraordinary evidence if they are to hold any credibility. Instead we are offered subjective assessment (like the dog sniffing at a Leprechaun), and zero objective evidence and that's the way it has remained throughout man's entire history. Never has anyone moved even a tiny fraction of a step closer to offering any objective evidence of spirits.

Adhering to objective methods doesn't prevent us from making new discoveries. The neutrinos I mentioned in a post earlier were suggested to exist based on objective observations and then confirmed via objective observations -- all based on objective evidence.

We discover new plant and animal species every year. And to answer your question; of course they existed before we discovered them. But when a particular type of entity is asserted to exist for tens of thousands of years and yet there is still zero credible evidence to back the assertion, we almost always call that a "false-hood".

Remember that this is the means by which we rule out any actual existence of mermaids, Leprechauns, fairies, gremlins, zombies, feathered snails and many other imaginary creatures.

The only difference is that people have a very strong interest in believing they will somehow continue to live past the death of their physical bodies. So in admitting that there is no credible evidence or cause to believe in spirits, they're defeating one of their greatest desires. But reality isn't concerned with human desire and has never bent to the will of human emotion. So believing in contradiction to reality is simply to dwell in denial. And denial is not a path to truth.

Does that help to answer your question?



•  REPLY  •


Cheetahcry
Cheetahcry
Diabolist (91)
Posts: 420
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
01:29:19 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,467 times

Cursed thank you for posting about the view points of others. When you are speaking of the hearing of the dogs for example, I was wondering if that is because of the frequency that they hear? Since dogs and other animals hear higher pitches of sound then we do, do you think that this could be why they react the way that they do?



•  REPLY  •


Beastt17
Beastt17
Pain Giver (55)
Posts: 903
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
01:35:50 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,465 times

I'd be very interested to hear of any objective evidence supporting any of the assertions made thus far. Does anyone have even a single case where an animal has appeared to detect something and it was then demonstrated to have been a spirit?

Perhaps it needs to be said again that not all posts are simply an opinion. If I point out that spirits are backed by no more objective evidence than are Leprechauns, mermaids or fairies, that's not just an opinion. That's a statement of fact.

So let's not attempt to devalue statements of fact by calling them "opinions". Opinions are fine and should be welcome in any discussion. But statements of fact and/or demonstrability should be recognized as holding far greater merit, even... EVEN if they don't support your desired stance on the topic.



•  REPLY  •


Oceanne
Oceanne
Noble Sire (160)
Posts: 4,490
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
07:25:13 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,455 times

Ive followed this womans work for a long time.I have also worked with animals as a vet and in many other capacities.Very sucessfully,and I dont mean the money .And in my opinion as an animal professional for far longer than I care to reveal,
I believe this woman can help you understand a little something when it comes to animals seeing things etc..
Because she is dead on.
And yes Cheetah,animals do responds to frequencies that we cannot detect.Bigtime.So there are many factors that play into this besides what I have presented with Grandins research.
Fact.Horse dont like the smell of decay.It is a survival response.Of course they dont want to go thru a burial ground where they could detect those smells even though you or I cant.
Fact.They also dont like unstable ground.Old burials are full of holes and soft spots.And there is a ton more.But its late and Im tired.Im not discounting what anyone else chooses to believe,but yes,it would be a good thing to do a bit of study before coming to a conclusion that it is always spirits.


http://www.enotalone.com/article/5550.html

That feedlot consultation was the kind of thing that started to give me a reputation for having practically a magical connection to animals. Meanwhile I was always mystified by these situations, because to me the answers seemed so obvious. Why couldn't other people see what the matter was?

It took me fifteen years to figure out that other people actually couldn't see what the problem was, at least not without a lot of training and practice. They couldn't see it because they weren't visually oriented the way animals and autistic people are.

I always find it kind of funny that normal people are always saying autistic children "live in their own little world." When you work with animals for a while you start to realize you can say the same thing about normal people. There's a great big, beautiful world out there that a lot of normal folks are just barely taking in. It's like dogs hearing a whole register of sound we can't. Autistic people and animals are seeing a whole register of the visual world normal people can't, or don't.

I don't just mean this metaphorically, either. Normal people literally don't see a lot of things. There's a famous experiment by a psychologist named Daniel Simons, head of the Visual Cognition Lab at the University of Illinois, called Gorillas in Our Midst, that shows you how bad people's visual awareness is. In the experiment they show people a videotape of a basketball game and ask them to count how many passes one team makes. Then, a little while into the tape, while everyone is sitting there counting passes, a woman wearing a gorilla suit walks onto the screen, stops, turns, faces the camera, and beats her fists on her chest.

Fifty percent of all people who watch this video don't see the gorilla!

Even when experimenters ask them directly, "Did you notice the gorilla?" they say, "The what?" It's not that they don't remember the lady in the gorilla suit. Anyone who's forgotten something he saw will remember it when you give him a prompt. These folks actually didn't see the lady gorilla in the first place. She didn't register.

The experimenters tested out their theory with another video in which an actor suddenly changes into a whole different person, wearing a completely different set of clothes. Seventy percent of normal people don't notice that, either. They also don't notice it in real life. In one study a blond-haired man wearing a yellow shirt handed students a form to fill out, then took the completed form behind a bookcase to file. When he came back out he was a dark-haired man wearing a blue shirt. He wasn't the same guy in disguise; he was a whole different person. It didn't matter. Seventy-five percent of the students had no idea they'd just interacted with two different people.

The scariest study, though, was the one NASA did with commercial airplane pilots. The researchers put them in a flight simulator and asked them to do a bunch of routine landings. But on some of the landing approaches the experimenters added the image of a large commercial airplane parked on the runway, something a pilot would never see in real life (at least, let's hope not). One quarter of the pilots landed right on top of the airplane. They never saw it.

I've seen photographs from the study, and what's interesting is that if you're not a pilot, the parked plane is obvious. You can't miss it, and you don't have to be autistic to see it, either. I'd bet the ranch that the only people who could possibly miss that plane would have to be commercial pilots. If you're a professional, expecting to see what a professional normally would see, there's a 25 percent chance you'll miss a huge commercial aircraft parked crossways blocking the landing strip in a flight simulator.

That's because normal people's perceptual systems are built to see what they're used to seeing. If they're used to seeing gorillas in the middle of basketball games, they see gorillas. If they're not used to seeing gorillas in the middle of basketball games, they don't. They have inattentional blindness.

I have no idea how a visual thinker would do on these experiments, but my guess is visual thinkers would see the gorilla a lot more often than verbal thinkers. I'm almost positive there's no prey animal on earth who would miss that gorilla, that's for sure, though I think predators would see the gorilla, too. A predator, by the way, is an animal like a dog or a cat who hunts and kills other animals for food; a prey animal is the animal the predator hunts. There's also another category of animals you don't hear about as much, which is the scavenger animals (like vultures) who do eat meat but don't kill the animals they eat. All animals, including human beings, fall into at least one of these categories, and quite a few — including a lot of primates — belong to more than one. Humans are more predators than prey, but we share qualities with both. In terms of the size of our teeth, we're defenseless, but as soon as we developed tools we became predators.

It's so hard for normal people to see what scares cattle that I finally developed a checklist of mostly visual details for plant managers to look out for. Things like pieces of metal that wiggle, reflections on water, bright spots, contrasts of color, and air hissing or blowing in their faces. I tell the owners, if you have three "bad" details you have to correct all three. Then your animal will walk up the chute without any trouble and you can throw away your electric prod.

Visual thinkers of any species, animal or human, are detail-oriented. They see everything and they react to everything. We don't know why this is true, we just know from experience that it is. I've had interior designers tell me, "I see everything." The worst thing that can happen to an interior designer is to work with a sloppy contractor. The designer will see every little flaw in the contractor's work. Tiny mistakes no one else even notices, like grout that's slightly uneven, will jump out at visual people. They go crazy. Visual people feel horrible when little details in their visual environments are wrong, the same way animals do.

I think this is probably the hardest part of an animal's existence for normal people to relate to. Verbal people can't just turn themselves into visual people because they want to, and vice versa.

* * *

I hope this book will help regular people be a little less verbal and a little more visual. I've spent thirty years as an animal scientist, and I've spent my whole life as an autistic person. I hope what I've learned will help people start over again with animals (and maybe with autistic people, too), and begin to think about them in a different way.

I hope what I've learned will help people see.




•  REPLY  •


Oceanne
Oceanne
Noble Sire (160)
Posts: 4,490
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
13:47:17 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,434 times

A little more for your reading pleasure..



Domestic dogs and cats, like their wild, hunting relatives, rely heavily on their sense of smell and hearing to locate prey and danger, and to communicate. Cats and dogs are able to hear a wider range of sounds, and softer sounds than humans. The pitch of a sound is measured in Hertz (Hz) and the comparative hearing ranges of dogs, cats and humans are the following:

Humans: 20Hz – 23 KHz
Dogs: 60Hz – 45 KHz
Cats: 45 Hz – 64KHz
To give you a practical example of this: 64Hz (roughly the lowest note a dog can hear) is the pitch of the lowest key on a piano. For every doubling in Hz, the pitch goes up an octave. Cats, with the top range of 64KHz vs 23 in humans, can thus hear sounds at least two and a half octaves higher than humans can! This is why dogs and cats respond to dog whistles. The sound is too high for us to hear, but still within their hearing range.

As a matter of interest, the animals said to hear the lowest sounds are elephants and ferrets (12 Hz) and the animal capable of hearing the highest sound is the Beluga whale (120KHz!)

Cats and dogs also respond to a much lower intensity of sound than humans. Sound intensity is measured in decibels (dB). Dogs can hear five times more acutely than humans, and cats about twice as acutely as dogs. Like Hz, dB also increase exponentially, so 30dB is ten times as loud as 20dB, and 40dB is 100 times as loud. A practical example is that a whisper weighs in at about 30dB, and a dog can hear that from almost three times as far away as a human. Cats are even more sensitive than dogs to these soft sounds. This also explains why dogs and cats are so scared by the sound of fireworks which, to us, do not seem so loud. They are in fact at least 5 times louder to our pets!

The sense of smell is related to the number of olfactory cells adapted to receive smell molecules, and to the area in the brain dedicated to processing these signals into recognisable smells. Humans have about 5 million olfactory epithelial cells, cats 100 million and dogs up to 220 million cells! The acuity of smell is proportional to these cells, so cats can smell roughly 20 times better than humans and dogs up to 50 times better! A scent dog can detect one drop of human blood in a bucket of water! The number of olfactory cells is partly dependant on the size of the animal’s nose. Small terriers have space for only about 120 million olfactory cells and brachycephalic (flat-nosed) dogs like bull-dogs even fewer. This explains, why German Shepherds, not Bull dogs, do tracking work!

Cats and dogs, however, use their sense of small far more specifically than to smell blood. Both species have a vomero-nasal organ, capable of detecting pheromone molecules. These are too large for normal olfactory epithelial cells to detect, so humans cannot smell them, but they transmit incredibly detailed information to the animals. Pheromones can transmit what mood an animal is in, whether it is on heat or pregnant and even if it is ill. Pheromones are like fingerprints for every animal. Placed against the relatively bland ability of humans to detect “something that smells like an apple”, it is not surprising that some people say dogs can smell a million times better than humans! As with hearing, they not only smell the same things we do, better, but they also smell things that we simply cannot.

http://www.nspca.co.za/page.aspx?Id=116&CateId=17&Category=Public%20Relations&SubCateId=98&SubCategory=Fireworks



•  REPLY  •


Oceanne
Oceanne
Noble Sire (160)
Posts: 4,490
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
14:40:26 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,426 times

I wanted to thank you for starting this thread LDR,as it is a subject that I have not only been interested in,but have studied for years.
And I cannot help to think ..again,while fun,absoloutely,maybe its time to perhaps reevaluate just what the paranormal is.



•  REPLY  •


Beastt17
Beastt17
Pain Giver (55)
Posts: 903
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
15:28:07 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,422 times

A wealth of great information, Oceanne. Clearly, animals do react to things we don't detect just as a Geiger Counter is able to detect things we don't. But this is simply due to greater acuity as well as expanded capability (echo-location, heat-sensing, IR & UV detection, etc.). To jump from that to proclamations of the paranormal is no more appropriate or accurate than to claim that bats are guided through dark caves by spirits.

As for the idea that children are more sensitive to spirits just because they're more likely to believe in them discounts the fact that children are also more likely to believe in Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, the Easter Bunny and Spiderman.



•  REPLY  •


DeadlyXDesire
DeadlyXDesire
Daywalker (94)
Posts: 32
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of The Coven of Purgatory
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
15:36:34 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,419 times

I do see some of your points regarding the claim because an animal is sensing something that we do not does not mean it is of supernatural or paranormal origins. However this thread was about animals possibly sensing these things whereas we cannot.

No one is stating that this is a fact that they can prove rather than it is a possibility based on information they have and events surrounding the occurances.



•  REPLY  •


Jynx
Jynx
Primogenitor (99)
Posts: 614
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Coven of Elizabeth Batory is a member of an Alliance

Member of Coven of Elizabeth Batory
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
15:48:45 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,418 times

Well Honorable Cheetah,
Those who have high senses capacity they have high conscious too and if they sense he sound , tehy able to sense the spirits passing or exist any place too.

this is the darkness of the conscious that when it at high it senses beings and cores are alive to that conscious as per its level.

and if person is not practiced balance of mind practice, they can not balance the dark and light side both at the time of high conscious and they fall to depression. he balance of mind practice do remove the worry the wonder to strange things and fear to strange things.

but the animals are high senses from start and this might be the reason their cosncious strong and they do sense strange vey easily and stand away form it dogs.

this is my opinion only and my belief that pets such as dogs do aware when spirit is there in the sphere.



•  REPLY  •


Mobius
Mobius
Pain Giver (55)
Posts: 42
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
16:01:05 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,413 times

It just goes without saying that animals can hear and smell things far better than we can.

There may perhaps be something in a certain area of the room that sounds or smells unpleasant.

Sometimes though, I feel like my pets enjoy acting strange because they know it freaks me out..



•  REPLY  •


Oceanne
Oceanne
Noble Sire (160)
Posts: 4,490
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
16:07:08 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,411 times

"I do see some of your points regarding the claim because an animal is sensing something that we do not does not mean it is of supernatural or paranormal origins. However this thread was about animals possibly sensing these things whereas we cannot."


Thus my posts Deadly.They do.
Ive also investigated many instances ,(but Im no ghost hunter)where people felt something strange or paranormal was going on with their animals.,,much the same as the above posts..And while I do wish I could say otherwise,far more often than not,as Birra suggested,it was due to other,more mundane factors.
To touch on another point brought up ,is how peeps tend to lend human aspcts or animals,as far as how an animal thinks...I would just liike to give a small example here if I may.
There have been many times that I would get a call for a problematic horse.That horse would kick and bite and strike continuously.As I observed the way that person and others around them handled that horse,from the moment they entered the stall,to the time they handed me the lead I could see right away what the problem was.But they felt this horse hated them and was simply a rouge.However,there were times when the horse would not act this way with a few others.They felt the horse loved or liked them.These people had not taken into account that something as simple as their own body position and placement was causing all this.A little work,and it was brought under control.
So what Im saying in essence is that we really need to take into account things about animals from their biomechanics,physiology to thought processes before we simply assume it would be a sense of the paranormal.



•  REPLY  •


Oceanne
Oceanne
Noble Sire (160)
Posts: 4,490
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
16:15:12 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,408 times

This post will most likely get deleted,and rightly so but Beast,Im glad you found that info helpful.But in all honesty what I found intriguing was why cats where always associated with witches and witchcraft etc..And why peeps call others(myself included) whisperers and such.There is just so much more to it,and I feel it is not simply experience or learned technique..I do feel that some peeps are instinctive when it comes to animals..but not in a paranormal sense.



•  REPLY  •


Beastt17
Beastt17
Pain Giver (55)
Posts: 903
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
16:24:39 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,406 times

Re: "No one is stating that this is a fact that they can prove rather than it is a possibility based on information they have and events surrounding the occurances.

Were that the case I would fully accept your point. I refer you to the statements being made. It starts off as you have said but then quickly decays into blatant assertions based on conclusions devoid of reason, such as;

- "Animals senses are more keen to the paranormal and will pick up what we done see"

- "Children and pets see things we don't because they are innocent."

- "I have my cat, Shayd with me whenever I go on a ghost hunt because as an animal her senses are more attuned to the supernatural because she has not been conditioned to ignore her feelings."

- "my cats only confirm my theory that there are at least 2 spirits in my house"

- "knew the house was haunted"

- "This spirit may be one of two people, though."

- "My late pet dog used to spirits in my home *which was haunted* "

- "Children are more sensitive to their instincts and more susceptible to paranormal activity"

- "animal do have high subconscious and do catch others conscious than human and when the spirits walk throguh the path..."

It's fun and interesting to explore odd behaviors in animals and children and even to attempt to find explanations for them. But if that were all anyone were doing, why would they become offensive or angry when explanations are offered?

The problem is that such suggestions tend to snowball from evidence seeking an explanation to explanations devoid of reason. That's the same thing that happened in the late 1600s in Salem Village, Ipswich, Andover, and Salem Town, Massachusetts (The Salem Witch Trials). What began as two rather ill-behaved children was quickly escalated to claims that the children had been the victims of witchcraft. From there people began to be arrested and imprisoned. Eventually 20-people were killed and all without the slightest shred of objective evidence.

So I don't think it's inappropriate in any such discussion to attempt to maintain a level of reason to accompany the explanations people seek. There is a fairly large gap between "my dog appears to be reacting to something I can't sense" and "my dog senses spirits in my house".

I find it hard to suggest that there is anything wrong with attempting to maintain a level of reason and credibility to temper the explanations offered.


•  REPLY  •


Mobius
Mobius
Pain Giver (55)
Posts: 42
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
16:31:50 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,401 times

Without a doubt, it is not an absense of belief that makes a person say "Maybe it could have been something else."

In all honesty, we believe that animals and children may be able to sense spirits because that is what we have been told by paranormal investigators. What if it had never been mentioned as such? Would we assume that our animals acting strange means there are spirits near by?


My dogs were running from window to window, acting very aggressive which is extremely against their nature. When they would sit still, it would only be to stare into my eyes and growl low in their throats. I saw nothing and could not hear anything that would make them act this way.

Was it spirits affecting them?

No. Minutes later, I heard coyotes outside. My animals sensed them long before me and were reacting long before I knew there was something to react about.



•  REPLY  •


RK
RK
Nightmare (97)
Posts: 0
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
16:40:09 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,397 times

I've noticed my cats watching thin air... I do think they are sensitive to spirits



•  REPLY  •


Oceanne
Oceanne
Noble Sire (160)
Posts: 4,490
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
16:41:12 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,395 times

There isnt .I'll tell you something..when I was 7 and already breaking and training horses,people used to ooh and ahh and tell me all these things that ..well,made me feel special.Like I really did have some kind of supernatural gift with them.And it wasnt just horses.But as time went on,I really began to realize a little of what might really be going on,and years later,I begain to find solid evidence of things I had suspected years prior about their behavior and senses .And from those days forward,after I had realized these things ,my ability and inovation/improv in my own techniques grew in leaps and bounds.Im just saying, that sometimes we can get so much farther in what we do or seek when we take into account every single aspect that we can before accepting or discounting something before thoroughly explored.
Take an animals ability to feel barometric pressures..that for the longest time was considered a paranormal thing..no storms would be on the horizion..everything seemed calm.And it was felt that because the way they were behaving,something supernatural was going on.Come to find it wasnt.



•  REPLY  •


Oceanne
Oceanne
Noble Sire (160)
Posts: 4,490
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
16:48:53 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,392 times

Oops that last post was directed at the Beast...but RK,While I value your opinion,is there really anything other than sheer belief that would point your thinking towards this?
And if so,then that brings to question what spirits actually are.Now if we are going to say that animals can detect subtle energies ie..emf and such,then yes,I feel they do indeed.But are they truely spirits?



•  REPLY  •


Beastt17
Beastt17
Pain Giver (55)
Posts: 903
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
16:51:13 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,389 times

RK,

If you don't mind my asking; why do you think the cats are reacting to spirits rather than something supported by evidence?

Could they be watching sunlight glinting off of dust particles in the air? Could they be seeing something in a dark corner that just appears black to you? Isn't it more probable that they're simply attempting to see something they're hearing that you can't hear?

I guess what I'm asking is; why do you find spirits (an explanation unaccompanied by any credible evidence), to be a more acceptable explanation than explanations which are accompanied by confirmed findings based on evidence?



•  REPLY  •


Mobius
Mobius
Pain Giver (55)
Posts: 42
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
16:54:12 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,386 times

I had a mentally handicapped kitten who would stare at walls. I suppose I could have said he was looking into the underworld, but that was just one of his hobbies...

We also tend to take animal behavior and try to twist it into our own human behavior.

Take a monkey, no don't really, but take this for example:

They bare their teeth in a grin and some people go "awww he's smiling!"

When actually, it is a sign of feeling threatened.

We see animals acting strange and we brand it as something based on how WE react to things. You simply cannot do that and get an accurate answer.



•  REPLY  •


Jynx
Jynx
Primogenitor (99)
Posts: 614
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Coven of Elizabeth Batory is a member of an Alliance

Member of Coven of Elizabeth Batory
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
18:00:04 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,376 times

well i keep mum i dont know any thing

just i dont want to be part of geographic channel or discovery of any thing new.



•  REPLY  •


Mobius
Mobius
Pain Giver (55)
Posts: 42
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
18:13:41 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,375 times

This is great, I just took one of my dogs for a walk and we passed a lamp post. I could barely hear a high frequency hum coming from the post and my dog would not stop glaring at it. The fur rose on his neck and he was acting very skittish.


If it had been at night, I would have had more trouble figuring out what my dog was looking at, it could have been quite spooky.

Animals will have negative reactions to things as simple as sounds (think of the whistles we've used to train dogs)



•  REPLY  •


Oceanne
Oceanne
Noble Sire (160)
Posts: 4,490
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
19:06:45 Oct 26 2008
Read 1,371 times

Deamonlovesyou.I honestly hope you dont really mean that.Your post weighs hard on me.

I know a little about your beliefs in such things.I know that when it comes to those beliefs,you are wise...and knowlegable.I read every post you post and think about what you say.Very carefully ,I might add.Because ,,I do believe in spirit if truth must be told.Im just re adjusting my thinking,based on tthe things I am learning everyday as to a nature of what I might believe IT is, our natural world,and how it interacts ...Everyone here is.And it is essential that you voice you views.For me personally,they are invaluable, and we could never consider things properly if you didnt.And forums such as this would be forfeit.There is diversity here,what else can we ask for?



•  REPLY  •


AlexandriasAwakening
AlexandriasAwakening
Viper (75)
Posts: 75
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of Wolves of Odin (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
07:10:23 Oct 27 2008
Read 1,357 times

I do believe pets and animals in general can see or sense things that we may not always be able to. My old room at my parents house -one of our dogs won't go in there, the other dog will sometimes go in a and start growling and then he slowly will back out. Its the room I have had issues in...always a negative dark feeling for me when I lived there.



•  REPLY  •


Jynx
Jynx
Primogenitor (99)
Posts: 614
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Coven of Elizabeth Batory is a member of an Alliance

Member of Coven of Elizabeth Batory
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
16:15:45 Oct 27 2008
Read 1,344 times

Honorable Oceanne,

I do apologise bothering you in my post that i dont want to be part of investigator and this was very irrectively posted.

I did not mean that time to disrespect all you most respected Honroables and it was my mind was boggling to the things those moments and i wished to get my mind thoguhtless of thinking over such things more.

I wished that time to bring myself to ease position.

Indeed your knowledge is wide and mastered in this field and i do amaze on it and learn upon.

believe me that time i was tired of thinking the matters and tried to eject form it and not to disrespect the Souls

May my posts be fierce but that is not the state to hurting others but kicking myself to eject from the matters.

I do apologise for this caused inconvenience and was matter of offence to you.

please treat, really i am just like a learnign kid in the world of psychic darkeness to gain the knowledge, yes in hte age of mortality may i be lived long life, but i am kid in the psychi field of true knowledge.



•  REPLY  •


Cheetahcry
Cheetahcry
Diabolist (91)
Posts: 420
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
16:33:58 Oct 27 2008
Read 1,337 times

Oceanne and Deamonlovesyou, your posts make a lot of sense to me and present some good points. I have always looked at it as the sense's of the animals are different because of the make within their systems like you pointed out Oceanne.

I am not claiming that they animals hearing differently or being able to sense things that we do not is of the paranormal nature but its one thought that makes you wonder if it is.



•  REPLY  •


XSilverxMoonxNightX
XSilverxMoonxNightX
Dybbuk (76)
Posts: 332
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Member of Wolves of Odin (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
17:10:37 Oct 27 2008
Read 1,332 times

My kitten such and amazing little thing she is she had seen a spirit she was looking at a wall when she started hissing at it I thought she had gone mad but then something clicked as I studied my kittens reaction again and again it would go away and reapear and the cat would stay there waiting all day sort of a watch dog she was such a wonderful kitten it happend about 25 days after we moved in quite interesting actually b/c everythiing had accured arround 25 days after the previous tenants had moved in the land lord had told us about it after I started asking questions she told me that a murder had gone on in that apartment a husband and wife and child a bit of a ruccuss was made in the night no one found them untill about a week later the apartment had been closed off for about 6months untill time passed they rebuilt the two rooms and the kitchen and so on I looked it up at the public library and come to find out it was al true the man had went off and shot himself in the woods else where and the woman was found shot in her bedroom while the child drowned in the tube the child was only 2 it was such a sad story we moved out the next week I didn't want to know anymore I didn't want to see anything I was just to horrified by what that anything might be.



•  REPLY  •


Beastt17
Beastt17
Pain Giver (55)
Posts: 903
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
19:18:57 Oct 27 2008
Read 1,320 times

And of course, we all know that when a cat starts to wash without having done anything to become obviously soiled, they're attempting to wash invisible grape jelly from their fur.

Or... it's simply a cat behavior. We tend to wash our hands when we've done something to get them dirty. So if we see a cat wake from a nap and begin to wash, we can make anything we want of the behavior.

Likewise, we could see a mother cat give birth to a still-born kitten, note that she's not wailing or producing tears, and assume it's not emotionally distressing for her.

Assumptions are wonderful things because they allow us to shape anything we see into anything we want it to be. But as for accuracy; there is little to be found in assumptions. And to assume that a kitten's unexplained behavior automatically means she's sensing entities which have never (in tens of thousands of years), ever been connected with the slightest shred of objective evidence, is certainly no exception.

Personally, I think it's every bit as likely that Tom and Jerry are real creatures with all of the capabilities of a cartoon character and Jerry was just having a bit of fun with the kitten. From a stand-point of evidence, such an assertion is just as likely as a proclamation of spirits.



•  REPLY  •


Oceanne
Oceanne
Noble Sire (160)
Posts: 4,490
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
21:10:47 Oct 27 2008
Read 1,312 times

Thats what makes it so tough sometimes cheetahcry to keep what one would call a logical standpoint.But there are many behaviours we see in animals that can easily be attributed to a paranormal thing if one wants to.We dont know everything about them and everyone knows if they work with animals that no matter how much you knows...the more you know,the more you realize just how little you do know.It is much like the medical field..thoughts and techniques change constantly.
And no,there is no shred of evidence that points to spirits and their connection with animals.However,I will say that anilmals are highly affected by Electromagnetic fields ..Due to Migration mechanisms etc...
So if there are such a thing as spirits?And if these spirits where electromagnetic,then yes, I would say that animals would be sensitive and therefore possible early detectors.



•  REPLY  •


Oceanne
Oceanne
Noble Sire (160)
Posts: 4,490
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
21:24:58 Oct 27 2008
Read 1,308 times

I also wanted to post something more on a system I had brought up some time sgo in another thread.But it is these types of mechanisms that help us understand how animals are able to react in ways we might see as strange or paranormal.And this is only one,but I feel its a fairly good example.

LATERAL LINE SYSTEM

The lateral line system, found in many fishes and in some aquatic amphibians, is sensitive to differences in water pressure. These differences may be due to changes in depth or to the currentlike waves caused by approaching objects. The basic sensory unit of the lateral line system is the neuromast, which is a bundle of sensory and supporting cells whose projecting hairs are encased in a gelatinous cap. The nueromasts continuously send out trains of nerve impulses. When pressure waves cause the gelatinous caps of the neuromasts to move, bending the enclosed hairs, the frequency of the nerve impulses is either increased or decreased, depending on the direction of bending.

Neuromasts may occur singly, in small groups called pit organs, or in rows within grooves or canals, when they are referred to as the lateral line system. The lateral line system runs along the sides of the body onto the head, where it divides into three branches, two to the snout and one to the lower jaw.

A swimming fish sets up a pressure wave in the water that is detectable by the lateral line systems of other fishes. It also sets up a bow wave in front of itself, the pressure of which is higher than that of the wave flow along its sides. These near-field differences are registered by its own lateral line system. As the fish approaches an object, such as a rock or the glass wall of an aquarium, the pressure waves around its body are distorted, and these changes are quickly detected by the lateral line system, enabling the fish to swerve or to take other suitable action. Because sound waves are waves of pressure, the lateral line system is also able to detect very low-frequency sounds of 100 Hz or less.

An interesting adaptation of the pressure-sensitive systems is seen in the modified groups of neuromasts called the ampullae of Lorenzini, which are found in sharks and certain bony fishes. The ampullae of Lorenzini act as electroreceptors and are able to detect electrical charges, or fields, in the water. Most animals, including humans, emit a DC field when in seawater. This is presumably caused by electrical potential differences between body fluids and seawater and between different parts of the body. An AC field is also set up by muscular activity (contractions). A wound, even a scratch, can markedly alter these electrical fields. The cat shark, Scyliorhinus, is known to catch prey by using its ampullae of Lorenzini to detect the electrical field generated by flatfish (plaice) buried beneath the sand.
http://www.lookd.com/fish/laterallinesystem.html



•  REPLY  •


Cheetahcry
Cheetahcry
Diabolist (91)
Posts: 420
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 18 years.
21:33:43 Oct 28 2008
Read 1,295 times

OK Oceanne, I can understand more about what you are saying now after reading the last few posts. It would make more sense that with the Electromagnetic fields of animals being attracted to that field. You are right as well about no matter how much you know of the animal you are always learning more then you knew before.



•  REPLY  •


Jessyka
Jessyka

No Longer Registered
22:17:27 Oct 28 2008
Read 1,292 times

While it is possible I was wondering what would allow a cat to see spiits are they truelly powerfull like in the egytian culture?



•  REPLY  •


Oceanne
Oceanne
Noble Sire (160)
Posts: 4,490
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
23:20:26 Oct 28 2008
Read 1,285 times

Ok good,I am really glad it helps.I was also going to post an article if I can find one about how they behaved right before the earthquake in China.Im wanting to touch on the original post in regards to the location of the incident she experienced.



•  REPLY  •


ShadowSpell
ShadowSpell
Premiere Sire (122)
Posts: 1,770
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Chateau Orleans (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Chateau Orleans (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
23:22:14 Oct 28 2008
Read 1,284 times

I believe that animals and pets see spirits. I think that they have a stronger sixth sense than us humans. None of my pets have ever done anything weird like they were playing with spirits though. But I think they can see them.



•  REPLY  •


Oceanne
Oceanne
Noble Sire (160)
Posts: 4,490
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
23:22:45 Oct 28 2008
Read 1,284 times

I dont know about seeing spirits Jessyka,but we are all trying to explain some things that could lead to the belief of such things,and figure it out as well.So we are in the same boat.



•  REPLY  •


dabbler
dabbler
Venerable Sire (130)
Posts: 11,418
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
00:40:13 Oct 29 2008
Read 1,277 times

One would want to eliminate any other possible trigger for the animals behavior, build-up of Rat dropping in the walls? A disturbance from a neighboring house? The visibility provided by the location?(some animals particularly cats will avoid any location that blinds them to escape routes.)

Inotice people mentioning animals tracking ghost and all, but I have a question.. with the popularity of ghost filming shows, where are the animal companions?

I have a case at hand for consideration.. one that actually was studied
personally by a credible friend one who is skeptical but seeking things that appear to support belief, His dog, he owned it for 6 years, he has a younger step daughter from his wifes first marriage, his wife and step daughter where both abused verbally, and physically. Eventually he was sent to prison for another case all together. His wife attended the house as best she could the two meet and he moved in. The daughter still tramatized by the abuse sadly. At around a set time each day. The dog would Go into territorial guard mode. Not allowing anyone near his step daughter, they lost a few baby sitters over this activity.. the daught was told that her father was away for a long time. Yet some how she still subconsciously held to the time that her father would return home to torment her, the dog sensed the fear (thru hormonal relation detected with sense) the family started thearaphy and the daughter conceptialized that the Source of her anxiety was not coming back at all. Had the father been dead it would be a case for para normal pondering. Instead of seeking purely occult confirmations he googled animal behavior as well.



•  REPLY  •


dabbler
dabbler
Venerable Sire (130)
Posts: 11,418
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
00:42:31 Oct 29 2008
Read 1,275 times

When humans don't know Sh** they do eventually call in the dogs !

http://depts.washington.edu/conserv/dog%20bios.html



•  REPLY  •


Doomsday1984
Doomsday1984
Dastard (23)
Posts: 0
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Limbus Patrum (Coven) is a member of an Alliance

Member of Limbus Patrum (Coven)
Vampire Rave member for 17 years.
00:47:56 Oct 29 2008
Read 1,272 times

my friends cat used to freak out all the time but i think it was all the weed that made the cat that way.



•  REPLY  •


Oceanne
Oceanne
Noble Sire (160)
Posts: 4,490
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
00:51:43 Oct 29 2008
Read 1,267 times

Dabbler,your post brings to mind something i wanted to touch on as well.And thats the detector dogs...Or alert dogs.For those who dont know, these dogs are trained to alert the owner or another person when someone is about to have a seizure.And while it sure would appear that these animals are using a paranormal sense of somekind to do this..well you see my point?



•  REPLY  •


Oceanne
Oceanne
Noble Sire (160)
Posts: 4,490
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
01:02:07 Oct 29 2008
Read 1,265 times

I will say something else too.It is not hard to see how through the ages people thought,or think that animals are highly linked with the paranormal.And although google is great for learning things,it can still leave you in the dark.Its great for pulling up info if you know what youre looking for but to actually study something in full? No way.And one can be easily mislead,thinking that because its on there its automatically true.



•  REPLY  •


dabbler
dabbler
Venerable Sire (130)
Posts: 11,418
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
01:45:56 Oct 29 2008
Read 1,259 times

It does come down to selective interpretation of events. The history of the animals, what prior owner they had. What behaviors where learned, what behaviors did not develop in the animal. The demeaner of the person handling the animal at the time of the event.

Watch animals and learn how they interact, they interact with humans in a slightly varied manner.



•  REPLY  •


Oceanne
Oceanne
Noble Sire (160)
Posts: 4,490
Honor: 0
[ Give / Take ]
Vampire Rave member for 19 years.
03:12:12 Oct 29 2008
Read 1,254 times

This is something Ive had in my journal for a time.I think its a good time to share it.And if anything,this is what I would call a behaviour that is truely interesting boarding on spooky..But even so,this could be a learned behaviour,after all,she didnt raise the dog so no one knows but sure.Either way...enjoy.



•  REPLY  •


VR System
VR System

No Longer Registered
03:12:12 Oct 29 2008
Read 1,254 times

This thread has been automatically closed for length.



•  REPLY  •



• • • • THIS THREAD IS CLOSED • • • •
•  Closed by VR System on Oct 29 2008  •

•  General Discussion Home  •   Forums Home  •

COMPANY
REQUEST HELP
CONTACT US
SITEMAP
REPORT A BUG
UPDATES
LEGAL
TERMS OF SERVICE
PRIVACY POLICY
DMCA POLICY
REAL VAMPIRES LOVE VAMPIRE RAVE
© 2004 - 2026 Vampire Rave
All Rights Reserved.
Page generated in 0.9363 seconds.
X
Username:

Password:
I agree to Vampire Rave's Privacy Policy.
I agree to Vampire Rave's Terms of Service.
I agree to Vampire Rave's DMCA Policy.
I agree to Vampire Rave's use of Cookies.
•  SIGN UP •  GET PASSWORD •  GET USERNAME  •
X