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Alright... so I got to thinking while watching a horrible vampire movie... about time.

We have hours, minutes, seconds, nano seconds... and our time shifts with daylights savings time and all that fun stuff. However, these different periods of time are determined by the sun as well as man kind.

But now I ask you, have you ever been driving and gone into a daze, only to realize you're 10 miles up the road and don't remember getting there? A lapse of mind, or a lapse of time?

Is time something conventional that we abide by blindly, or is time truly a concept or an illusion?

On top of this... what is a true eternity? Any amount of time could be as much if it is merely an illusion.

Thoughts? I know this is out there, but... that is what we're all about.

Reasoning is amazing, one day i was in the passenger seat of my friends car listening to 'the doors'and i was watching the palm trees, how they look when we were going 65 miles/hour and that instant glimpse of reasoning happened to me too, i started thinking how we break through time and change every second in space, and i visualize my self running a bike, and walking the same direction the car was moving and i imagine how different i would've seen this palm trees in the bike and walking, three different situation and how time would affect the outcomes and the details i see through them in variance of space and shapes or things i admire through the passage, and i imagine how many experiences one would have along the wy in three different variables, all consequently changing in time and space, in the bike would be much slower than the car yet faster than walking and the ending would also be affected in terms of time, just imagine how the experience would change in anything we do every second of every day been done in a different way...aren't we breaking time when we run in contrast of walking? or what we meet in the way, consequence of actiions in time/space desisions? Arent we traveling faster and changing/traveling time everyday? Im sure those who goes to college in 3 buses in 1 hour in contrast of how that same guy gets to the samedestination in car say 20 minutes, shift of experience in time/space every day, and the outcomes are different, that been said we have pushed time in our daily basis to another rithm in our space, cars have modified our world, now we work fast, their is no time for anything else, things has to be done fast..In ancient time a jobs could take days, to go to wars would take days, to send troops you would have to plan ahead to get reinforcements in time, everything was more steady. Its refreshing if you could visualize it like i did.

Time is relative,clocks and watches are man made,to keep track of thing by seconds and hours.Yet everyone perceives time in different ways..though time can "get"away from you if you forget about it.

See... when time gets away from you, that is absolutely rotten.

Time is what makes us, I think. It's what we live by, it's how we age and mature. And while it relative, there are so many other things in life that are relative (like the existentialist in me).

Then again, I would be interested to see if anyone around here believes that time is not relative, nor lost, and is just a matter of existence that is sometimes wasted.

Time is reletive to the days and nights, we percieve the clock as mature individuals to be moving faster than that of our youth, in essence we have become more envolved in our later days that time seems to be lost or percieved moving twice as fast.

I have periods of driving home from a hard day and do not remember the times in between, do to fatigue or thoughts playing on my mind I have lost the time. yet by al records it still has happened.

I think time is perception, that time is always continuous, and time always goes on even when we are sleeping. When we are not consciuosly aware of time it seems to go quickly. We can't see time, so I think it's our perception of the world and the universe around us, that we use clocks as a measurement of time, because time is associated with motion of the heavenly bodies. Time is relative and time on your watch is not the same everywhere in the universe. Different planets rotate at different speeds, so the measurement of time would be different. The faster you move, the less time you experience, and we are all in different reference frames, so we experience time relative to one another. We live in a 3d world, and time is the 4th dimension, and our experience of time depends on our frame of reference.

Someone mentioned time being relative. It's relative to perception of religious, cultural and the particular era you were born into.

For example, in the 19th century, a well-educated "man" with an income (inherited wealth) could explore at his leisure a multitude of scientific and poetic endeavors w/o regard to "deadlines." He had candles aplenty, and someone to trim the wicks or turn down the gaslight. Ergo time was irrelevant.

In present day a lawyer bills on the 10th of an hour. Time is precious as it is tied in minutely with his financial well-being. He might not understand someone duck-taping over the minutes on the digital clock because the Led is too bright and annoying. A vampire would have a generous sense of time. Lavish. Maddening.

The congruence of space and time is fascinating. I leave it to more knowledgeable readers to break it into the bits and pieces so that we can all understand i.t.

I wasn't speaking of the time someone has to do something...which is man made time.

I mean time itself is relative.Forget clocks,watches etc.,Im talking about TIME.Before time was measured in seconds,minutes,hours etc.Man was aware TIME,by the position of the sun,moon and stars in the sky.Also they knew something fascinating happening...even if they sat still under a tree and did nothing,time went by them.Too people people rely on a watch or a schedule to get by in their day.My opinion is this...man kind needs to get back to being human and stop relying on doing something all the time.I understand we need to work to make money so we can buy food and pay bills.But more people are dying from the stress of getting everything done in a certain TIME frame.

I agree that people in earlier times had it fairly easy.They lived a leisurely lifestyle.They didn't have to worry about time constraints,they could lay around and be "poets",artists,etc.Now everyone wants everything done in seconds,but will stand in lines for hours for a new cell phone or game systems.

when people play games together it is so trivial but if vampires were to play games together then the games can go on for centuries and be very complex.

Seems to me that time is always measured. As you say, before clocks humans measured time by the rise and fall of the sun. Change of seasons was also important, and based on their observations and their connectedness to the earth for their survival, they developed elaborate stories and ritual to explain and placate.

Time as measured by our seasons and our sun is irrelevant outside of our tiny sphere, though.

time is to me seems to be the one thing that never stops and will always carry on even after we're all dead and gone

To the original poster...yes, unfortunately that happens to me a lot. I've been known to get home from work and have no memory whatsoever of the drive there.

And then, with all this, comes the wonder of what a person could do with an eternity. On top of that, WHY on Earth would someone want that much time?

When you are busy, it speeds up. When you are bored, it slows down to the point that it is just... unbearable.

Thinking about it, most would say they would travel the world and see everything, but one could do that without an eternity. To learn? We could do that as well. To come up with some phenomenal amount of wealth? Yet again... anyone could do that.

So when it comes down to it, why is time so valued and why are those eternal beings that myths speak of so envied for the infinite amount of time they are given?

Time stays the same speed...you just perceive it to slow down or speed up.The phrase "Time flies when you're having fun" is an example of what you said.In reality time is going the same speed as always but because you aren't actually paying attention while having the fun,it seems as though it flew by.

This might help out a bit. Time, as we generally perceive and measure it, can be basically defined as the measured distance between two points of action. In other words time is what's between the start and end of something, such as saying a word, moving from place to place, the time it takes a blood cell to move between heart beats etc.

Although that really isn't a real scientific explanation in the broad sense it does help understanding and keeps things simple.

There is really no existance of time, but it's just our perception, and we perceive time, because of motion of the heavenly bodies. According to Newton if the universe was empty we would have no perception of time, and it would still flow at the same speed, and we would not be aware of it. We can't see or are feel time, but we can sense it by our intuition, it's our consciuosness and perception of time. In the ancient times they used temple's and stonehenge to observe and measure time, by the motion of the sun, moon and the stars, so they know what time of the year it was for religious events, and for agriculture, when to sow the seeds for harvest, etc.

I beg to differ with you...TIME does exist and will exist even after every human is no more.As I stated before there is man made time,clocks,watches,sun dials etc.Then there is Time itself,or as many scientists and books say Space/Time.X is a scientist...and he explained it in laymens terms but some people don't get it.

I agree with you there, and you mean the true nature of time. Time has its own existence even before the solar system was formed, and before life ever evolved.

A good book for you to read is: What is Time? The classic account of the nature of time By G.J Whitrow.

We still percieve seasons of the earth and before the clock to say that has given us time, things were calculated by summers or winters, So time like darkwolfman was still present in the aspects of the cycles within the earth, sun and moon and the seasons.

Even if man would vanicsh from the planet the cycles would in fact remain and continue here as on other planets .

According to modern cosmology, time is part of the Space-time continuum, often considered the 4th dimension. The vast reaches of the universe are commonly measured in terms of the constant "c" - The speed of light; about 300,000 meters per second or 186,000 miles per second. See? Time is required for measuring such huge distances.

It's interesting to me me that time itself can be limitless in both the infinite and infinitesimal, rather like the 'physical' universe.

Think about it...

Our world, that we perceive as humans, can be seen in terms of measurements of distance. At our normal world view, a human is about 1.5 to 1.8 meters in height.

In the infinite universe, of stars, galaxies and larger, we talk about distances that are many orders of magnitude larger than a meter.

In the infinitesimal world of sub-atomic physics, we describe 'objects' that are many orders of magnitude smaller than a meter.

In both the infinite and infinitesimal, our perceptions become distorted by the extreme numbers of theses size and odd artifacts come into play - The 'red shift' of extreme distant objects we try to observe the light of, and the 'uncertainty principle' of the minute objects in the sub-atomic world - One can either predict the speed of an object or it's location, but not both.

Time, in the infinite and infinitesimal, it very much like the physical reality we use time to measure.

Eternity - the outward limits of "when" as time marches into the future or we look back into the past.

This 'instant' of perceived time. Think of the shortest measurable moment...a nanosecond? A femtosecond? It can always be sliced into an infinitely smaller segment of time, until you reach right "now" which is gone as soon as you perceive it.

For me, time is very real.

Time is real, too all things on this planet and I am sure on other systems. Days and Nights.

We asume that time is speeding up, but its the delisions of our mind is all for time keeps the same pace in which it has for many years.

As you acrue more and more experience, you take more and more for granted. That's the primary reason for the illusion that tie goes by faster as the years go by. Remember how long it was between birthdays or Holidays when we were new here? I swear I'm just finished paying off last holiday when the next one is already around the corner.

to address the question of when things get hazy and you can lose minutes at a time, I think it's our minds way of protecting itself, or really, or letting itself rest after a hard day, or long day of use.

Time is like the bumpers when your bowling just to keep you on track. Really there is no really time it is something someone made up a long time ago and it makes us worry about "time" slipping away. Its a reminder of what you have done and it nags you about what you havent and how much of it is left.

this reminds me of the saying "a watched pot never boils". if you stare intently at it, it seems to take forever and a day to boil, but if you turn away, occupy yourself with something, it seems to boil in no time at all. Time is something of a matter of perception in a practical sense.

Time is the word made up by humans, yet the earth keeps its own time in which we have some what formulated to make up our time. We are born, we live and yet we die, the spaces in our life of the seasons and day or night is what we have gave the meaning of time.

I believe we are born from life to life only to learn lessons and to reach the unlimate neutrality and perfection that the gods in my cast intended for us to reach... Live your life to the fullest every chance you get... Learn your lessons and carry them with you.... hence past lives and such.... Time is a mere number and does not truly define eveything... Time is a measurement of how long we believe our lives are.... when really we should all realize tha we have this life and many more before and after... there's no need to worry about how much time we have but what we do with that time....

I've had plenty of driving experiences like that! Seems to only occur on open highways.
read an article once that stated a daydreamer behind the wheel is actually less likely to have an accident. Accept I was never daydreaming at the time.
I wonder if it is in any relation to like having dreams, not the ones that you are like watching take course, but those really terrifying ones that make you bolt awake, like falling from high up, a accident about to happen, someone about to kill you. And they say if you don't wake up, you will die in your dream as you will in real life?
That's like "Matrix" stuff for real!

Well the loss of time during driving is easy.. The logical reason why you go into a daze while driving is most likey since you went to that place a number of times and you know how to get there backwards and forwards.. That is a example of self hypnosis... Your mind wanders and you lose track of time and before you know it your down the road a few miles.

well see this comes down to the concept of time itself.
before the first sun dial,
what was time? there was no time. the term time is a delusion of modernization there is no time. it is a faction used to control the people.

Its 8 o clock do you know where your kids are ?

its 1am what are you doing out so late?

or concepts of working. you will work 8 am to 9 pm its all relative to a controlling nature if you lived in the woods no clocks or anything youd have day and night. that would be it.

Time is relative, and the brain/mind is extremely powerful.

I rememebr as a really little kid, 2 hours felt like an eternity, but now, 2 hours can absolutely fly by!

Time holds value to almost evrything in our lifes. seasons, plant cycles, water tides, death in life. Yet humans value of time is prevalant over everything else.

as the doctor from doctor who says "people think time is a linear force from cause and effect but really its more like a big ball of wibbly wobbly timey wimey stuff."

People have 'made' time.. we needed something what we can count.. understand.. so we made watches to make it easier to us understand everything..
Time passes by sometimes quicker sometimes slower for our mind..
if we are into something we'll notice that 1 hour have passed so fast.. and sometime we ask ourselves: 'how could this be? I just got here five minutes ago.. '
that's just our mind 'playing' with us.. creating illusions..

yeah I have also noticed how time seems to change. sometimes its fast sometimes its slower. I cant even begin to figure out why this happens but you do raise an interesting thought provoking question

Is imagination of time fast or slow, for time its self keeps the same pace as when the days of old where here.

Einstein postulated that Time was, indeed, not a constant; that it was relative. And since then we've all heard of atomic clocks and theoretical near-light and faster-than-light scenarios almost ad nauseum. And none of which ever really indicated anything that we, here on Earth, could truly appreciate that proved whether Time was relative or not.

However, few are aware of the fact that way back as early as 1887, decades before Einstein's Theory of Relativity, there was an astounding experiment conducted that flabbergasted the scientific community of that day as it proved that Time was, in fact, not constant at all. .. that Time was relative! It wasn't until Einsteins' theories decades later that the results of this experiment were finally explained.

The experiment's original purpose was to "prove" the existence of Space as being filled with what was called "ether." The experiment failed completely to prove the existence of such a substance in space... but succeeded wonderfully in evidencing the fact that Time is... relative!

If this topic is truly of interest, you would be well served to enjoy the particulars and the astounding results of the Michelson-Morley Experiment here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michelson-Morley_experiment.

Ooops... gotta board my plane. I'll try to write later and continue this...


- Upir'




However, it wasn't until the famous Michelson-Morley Experiment that this was actually proven to be so. The experiment is a fascinating one and bears summarization given just how extraordinary its results were.

I would just like to touch on this little bit from the original post. I know it's probably not the answer you are looking for but I think it's relevant since you used that as an example.

"...have you ever been driving and gone into a daze, only to realize you're 10 miles up the road and don't remember getting there? A lapse of mind, or a lapse of time?"

This is called highway hypnosis and is a fairly common thing.

Here is a quick definition from the wiki:

"Highway hypnosis is a mental state in which the person can drive a truck or automobile great distances, responding to external events in the expected manner with no recollection of having consciously done so. In this state the driver's conscious mind is apparently fully focused elsewhere, with seemingly direct processing of the masses of information needed to drive safely. 'Highway Hypnosis' is just one manifestation of a relatively commonplace experience, theoretically where the conscious and subconscious minds appear to concentrate on different things; workers performing simple and repetitive tasks and people deprived of sleep are likely to experience similar symptoms. Therefore, it is a sort of subconscious "driving mode.""

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highway_hypnosis

I have work days where I repeatedly have to do the same things for extended periods of time. I have been doing them for years. For example, I might be completely focused on a conversation or a song on the radio yet my body goes through the motions of work without even thinking about it consciously.

I say time does not depend on us we depend on it.
Think of it if you did not have to eat, sleep, or even need some thing else to get around from place to place.
You would not need time .
We need time to tell us were we are in the day because we need the day light to see.
We need time at night to tell us when to sleep.
or do we!!!
We have light that we make.
And in the summer some places on the earth have no night but are light all the time.
But now say you are a spirit you have no need for time.
Think of it you never get sick , never have to eat, or drink, you can think of a place and be there.

Someone probably said it but My opinion on time is that when you've gone back and forth the same streach of road it's burned into your memory. There fore just goes as it seems timeless where you dont' recall driving that far in that time.

Your memory blocks it out cuz you know it inch by inch. You do notice it takes about the same time unless it's a heavy trafic day.

To the OP, right now I am going through a course on Psychoanalysis and part of it dealt with hypnotism. In that section they deal with a state of awareness called a trance. It is when our minds or preoccupied with thoughts and our bodies are on autopilot. In your description of driving, this is exactly the case. You might have been in a trance thinking about something and your body was driving the car while a small section of your mind that is VERY familiar with the mechanics of driving took over.

In this lesson I learned that we enter trances many times a day, kind of like when we daydream about stuff. In addition we allow things into our minds when we let others put us into a trance.

For instance when we talk about time. We might be late for work, we are thinking of what we are going to tell the boss etc, well we have entered a trance state. When we get there were get yelled at while still in that trance state and now have a small piece of mental code that equates being late with being yelled at. So it programs us to have a reaction to being late.

So how does this relate with time? Our perception of time is a programmed thing. We as a species have been programmed into thinking that time is constant, when in reality it is not. There are scientific studies that go something along these lines: two watches synchronized at ground level are separated when one watch stay stationary on the ground and the other put into a plane flying supersonic for a period of time are reunited to compare the differences (if any). It was found that they differed. So time is not the same even between two identical devices that have been synchronized when external conditions are applied. This is grossly simplified, but it makes my point. Our perception is that the time should be exactly the same, but that simply does not bear out the facts.

I believe that the driving down the stretch of road, is that you become complacent on the same drives and journeys, and suddenly you don't notice the time.

my preception of time how ever is the basis of my profile, and so I won't post it here, lol.

Michelson-Morley Experiment Pt. 2

Okay... I have a few minutes before my next flight...


As revealed in the 1887 Michelson-Morley Experiment, Time is not constant; it is relative.

In the experiment, a light beam was split and sent in two different directions, one: in the direction of the Earth's rotation, and the other: in the opposite direction. It was expected that the beam sent in the direction of the Earth's rotation would have increased its velocity by the 1000 miles per hour rotational speed of the Earth. It was also expected that the beam sent in the opposite direction would have its speed reduced by 1000 miles per hour. After all, if someone is standing in the back of a pick-up truck traveling at 50 MPH and throws a baseball ahead of the truck, the speed at which the baseball would initially be traveling would be speed at which it is thrown PLUS the speed of the truck. Thus, the baseball's speed would be increased by the truck's speed. So it was logical and expected that the speed of a light beam would likewise be affected by the speed of the object (in this case, the Earth) from which the beam was generated.

However... to their amazement and consternation... BOTH beams were revealed to be traveling at exactly the SAME SPEED!!! And that speed is the already well-known and established speed of light! Thus, it was learned that regardless the speed of anything else, the speed of light is absolutely constant!

Thus, mathematically speaking, given that velocity is determined by the distance divided by time equals the velocity ( d / t = V ), if the speed of light is constant and the distance is also constant (which it was in the Michelson-Morley Experiment)... then the only other factor involved in this that would account for the velocity discrepancy could only be... Time!

Time must, therefore, NOT be constant!

And this was the first indication of what Einstein later postulated... that TIME is not constant but, instead, relative.


No... this does not explain at all the specific situation described by the poster, which I believe to be purerly psychological, but it does help to explain the inconsistency, the relativity of Time.


- Upir'

I believe time is an illusion. It may seem crazy and others may agree. Opinion is Opinion. I believe time was created by the human race so as to set everything upon an order. Time helped humans in the begining to try and understand life. It made things easier. Same for now. Imagine life without time. It'd be confusing and hectic. Lost and cramped. Time is just a word we put upon an action none of us know the truth of. There is some being, somewhere, that controls time. If that being wishes to speed it up a bit as your driving down the road, then so be it. Who knows. Your time may just be your time, and others theirs. Time is an illusion, created by the Human Race.

time is a difficult thing to explain yes it is measure my clocks and all that but the passage of time changes depending on what your doing. think about it ever been in love and making love and it always seems like you never get enough time with that person or having to do something you hate and it always seems like it last forever. It depends on your mind set how you precise time. I get lost in my own mind and when I do things I enjoy. I can read a good book and not notice the day passing or be waiting to go out and think time has stopped.

Time is a lie there is no such time. Us humans made up time just as we made up other things. All time is, is a figment of the imagionation, an illusion, I do believe you can drive 10 miles up the road and not remember doing it, this is just a slip of the mind, where one side of the brain works more quickly than the other. Sort of like a day dream.

Trepidation--

Ok, seriously, I want to try and understand what you're saying.

I get that hours and minutes and days etc. are man made. We assigned names and measurements to them, got it. But how does time not exist?

Are you saying that "hours" don't exist or that time, the thing hours are measuring, doesn't exist?

How can actual time not exist? I just don't get that.
Time has to exist or else nothing can happen, for that matter without time nothing in this universe could even exist.

Xzavia, Ok so now i think about it you are right, the hours and minutes are made up by us. I made a mistake that time itself was made up.

I was just wanting to make sure, thanks for clarifying :)

That is nothing to do with time, it is all our mind. A person's mind slips into 'daydream' mode many times during the day. Such a trance like mode occurs alot when one is driving, this I think is called 'driving hypnosis'. Your mind snaps back to normal after a few minutes and you can't recall correctly the last mile or two because your mind was doing something else. We go into this mode all the time without noticing - it's impossible for someone to keep full attention all the time.

Taken from http://hypnotherapy-and-nlp.co.uk/ ...

"Hypnosis is similar to daydreaming and is an altered state of awareness where you will have a focused attention. You will enter hypnotic trances regularly every day. When the conscious mind closes down and the unconscious processes recent events. Daydreaming is a good example of this trance state. Whilst in a trance you can hear everything around you and you can bring yourself out of the trance at any time."
"Have you ever arrived at a destination and thought “How did I get here?”
That is an instance where the unconscious mind is doing the act of driving while the conscious mind is elsewhere. "

time can be many things time can last for ever until u make it stop

If time was to stop would life exist anymore. the balance that e have made time is the perception giving to the cycles of earth and things that inhabit this planet.

dont blink you may miss something thats a perfect motto in my head for ages. :) rember people time is everything and can be precious!

Its scary how many times that happens that i go into a saze thinking about something and then I realize its like 20 minutes later and have no idea where I went to.

when we sleep the time passes at the same rate but we are not preoccupied with the passing of time as much.......the old saying time flies when your having fun is a good example of how we can pass time in a state of preoccupation....

Time...it's a cruel thing sometimes.
Work, for example...drags by if you hate your job.
On the other hand, if you're doing something that you enjoy, time flies away and suddenly, you have to move on...time is never on our side...lol

I have had these self same zone outs or nano sleeps lol usually when my mind is occupied with things or I am in one of my day dream modes... time just gets away from me and the next thing I know time has lapsed and I have to get things done lol.

Although I have had moments where I was in a hurry to get somewhere and be on time. I was running late, the time on my watch and clocks both at home and in my car were running correctly. I made a 30min drive in 5 minutes. And NO I wasn't speeding. It was as if time stopped... Another time It happened while I was on public transport.

It has happened on occasion and I find it scary but wonderfully weird.

Time is roughly equivalent to Entropy which is a universal concept i.e. it will always exist whether we do or not. It is often referred to as the fourth dimension