I am starting this thread to get your thoughts on freemasonry and the occult. It has long been assumed that the freemasons are actually satanists, templar knights, or mostly just practicing high magic. I personally think that maybe at one time they night have been more than meets the eye, but nowdays, there pretty much a well funded boys club for men, i may be wrong of course, anyway, what do you think? Do you know any masons?
Hello,
I think they are a occult, but that is in my own opinion, but I shall do further reseach upon it...
I have myself thought many times about joining, but have never done it, I was also wondering if anyone on Vr is a mason, (if so you dont have to post publicly, you can messege me)
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CuRsEdToDaRkNeSs High Sire (157) Posts: 1,286 Honor: 2,184 [ Give / Take ] |
I have never heard of freemasons.... Is it possible for you to give us a bit more information so that this question can properly be answered by those of us who have never heard of this? :)
My Grandfather was a Freemason, to this day I still have no idea what was involved.
Sure, heres a link to all you should need.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freemasonry
There was just a show on the History channel about freemasonry. Their conclusion was that it's just a "boy's club" for rich adults.
My Grandfather was a Free Mason and I was enroled in the DeMolay for a short period of time. (The DeMolay is sort of a Jr. version of Free Masons). As far as I can tell it's basically like a Fraternity for adults.
No occult involvment or any secret rulling of the world.
My family has been involved with Freemasons for many years. And it is hard for me to see my Father and Grandfather and My Uncles as Satanists or even involved in a cult for that matter. My Grandmother was a pentecostal minister and my uncles were both deacons.
Thanks, for the results so far, i am still highly intersted in the masons, and I saw the show, its waht sperked my interest again,lol
My father and brothers were members of the local Masonic lodge. Though they no longer participate I think. Most of it is a type of mens club though they have a section for women too. They pursue activities in each community that the membership vote to do. Many of them are charity related. It's just another type of group gathering to me.
yes there are freemasons on this sight . you just have to surf through the pages. they are not hiding (some of them). At one time they were suppose to be a secret society of which they practiced their own form of christianity... Most religions get their bases off from Pagan origins Catholic church is a prime example. Instead of having to occupu a teritort with soldiers loyal to Ceaser it would be easier to convert a couple of key persons in the society to convert the rest of surounding people (instead of sending overseers they sent emisarrys to subjugate the minds of...). The masons used horded knowledge to prosper (the origin of the word witchcraft has developed from the term wise-craft or "those who know"). In this sense the answer would have to be a definate yes. But to say that they practiced Paganism---I doubt it since their goals are/were to get ahead through the existing channels of prefounded systems of beliefs and methods to remain a secret society for as long as they did/have.
Well, there are several mysteries and secrets that surround the Freemasons and they are considered to be well tied in to both the Templar Knights in the new world as well as the revolutionaries of the United States during the time of the American Revolution.
However, I believe their trail leads back further than just the new world. They were said to be adept stonemasons and craftsmen in their days. There are a lot of tombstones in an older graveyard here in NM that have the Mason's logo on it.
this thread is really intersting.. my dad is a mason here in our country and there's so much i want to tell about them..
first and foremost, they are NOT satanists.. a person who wanted to be a member of the organization should have a religion no matter what it is. it could be islam, catholic, pagan or whatever, as long as he believe in one true god....
masons are not knights templar... centuries ago, the prieure de sion are in search of the grail and the lost gospels of the bible. since they are a secret society, they formed a group of men(4 men) to search those for them. these men are called the knights templar. the reason provided by the templars why they are formed is because they have to guide the pilgrimage in a certain place (i forgot the name)..
one time, they just stopped guiding the pilgrimage and started digging solomon's temple and went to the pope.. for unknown reasons, the templar became rich and accepted by the vatican and their number increased. with power and wealth, the templars became greedy and power hungry that pope clement issued a letter to kill all of the templars in sight. the said letter is only to be opened on june 6, 1866, thus the numbers 666 was and still considered to be unlucky because tht day, all the templars were burned in stakes and beheaded.
but not all templars died, some of them left the country with the wealth (and maybe the grail to) and scattered into countries.. in france (im not sure) they we're housed or adopted by freemasons who. the templars joined the masonic organization to hide their true personalities and avoid being killed.
It is true they planning new world order of theirs.
They solicit home to home daily.
If you know about evolution,you can easily go beyond their elders.
That is how their levels are.
Sadly they are closest minded groups
i have ever seen.They could be friends.
today, masons are still considered to be an international mens organization, well funded and has the philosophy of brotherhood, justice, love... i attended some public inductions but the private ones, i don't know... here are some books that may help you about masons
THE HOLY BLOOD AND THE HOLY GRAIL
THE BOOK THAT JESUS WROTE
THE DEAD SEA SCROLLS DECEPTION
THE HIRAM KEY
THE TEMPLAR REVELATION
THE DAVINCI CODE (FICTION)
ANGELS AND DEMONS (FICTION)
I CAN SAY THAT THEY PRACTICE SOME ECCENTRIC ACTS DURING INDUCTION BUT IM NOT SURE WITH MAGIC..
TO SUM IT UP, I KNOW MASONS ARE KIND HEARTED, BUT OF COURSE ALL OF US HAVE SECRETS..
ANWYAY, NCBANDIT IS A MASON.. HI DAD!
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CuRsEdToDaRkNeSs High Sire (157) Posts: 1,286 Honor: 2,184 [ Give / Take ] |
It doesnt seem to me to be even anything more then like said, a fraternity.....a club for men...... I see nothing occult about it.
My Dad is a Mason. Nothing Satanic about it. It is however steeped in a lot of symbolism. Many of our founding fathers were Masons. Look at the dollor bill and the White House details, many symbols are Masonic in nature. One of the neatest things I have seen is a Masonic funeral.
The organization has been around for a LONG time and although there are books and information on it, many things are still only handed down orally.
from my research they were founded on the story of the master mason of solomons temple. The Hiram Key and the Second Messiah are bountiful in information
I agree. Maybe the Freemasons delt in the occult in it's infancy but, I know too many members today that would shy away from any kind of magic. I believe it is a secrative boys club used for networking.
My great uncle was a freemason, and I can assure you there was no occult going on there. It was basically a fraternity ot club for older men together and discuss whatever.
Most Freemasons are Craft Masons, the lowest rank, and have no idea what they have joined. It is not until a Mason has entered the Royal Arch and gone beyond that he begins to get an inkling, and it is only an inkling of the occult world to which he now belongs. Some fascinating information can be found at the following link:
www.holygrail-church.fsnet.co.uk/Freemasonry.htm
my grandpa was a freemason... he never talked about it so i dont know a lot about it.. they are pretty sectetive.. i watched this one thing on the national geographics channel that showed some actually filmimg of inside the masons temple, which was the first time ever done.... i think that back in the day they were something strong and mighty.. holding lots of power and doing strange stuff... but i dont know really..
alot of the myths youve ever heard about Free Masonry are just simply untrue, quite alot of the myths and judgements upon Free Masons were simply just judgements made after things occured, the judgeing sources needed a scapegoat and the free masons were just that an easy target due to their secrecy. really do some research and you'l see it for yourself. this is something called judgeing what you don't know and or understand.
there Are individuals I know, who I believe is in the Secret society, but Until the day comes that they want to recruit me.. I'll never know.
i used to be very curious as well until i was invited in long ago, but i turned em down , i was explained what it was by some of the members , which is just a club , if you want to think it is more than it really is then so be it, but in all reality of it here in what i say lay the truth .
I think they were contected with the occult but most of those in the group are there for social reasons now.
Like it has been said many people who are Masons and in lower ranks don't know everything. Today it is a boys club or maybe a club devoted to discovery and finding information that is valuable to society. No one directly knows and today it could be just a boys club and nothing more. We don't have a clue what the past really was and even if we did it is only educated speculation. History is like educated guesses based on information discovered. Not all the information discovered is true... It could be away to distract the truth. We can't be directly sure and even today Mason's probably have little knowledge of the past. Like any society much of the past is just the past. Just like a Christian doesn't know directly what happened in the past insept for what people tell them or what they may read. It is all educated speculation.
I agree with Illuminata on this thread. The History Channel just had a 2 hour episoide on this. and everything Illuminata says is correct . I'm very interested in this subject , and I read and watch everything that has to do with this .
ive always beem interested in th masonic temple---well everything masonic----but i never wanted to be a part of it.
an esoteric group like the masons are very misunderstood I can see why ppl would think they are in to magic and rituals I donot belive that todays freemasons are anything like the old order. they are just a group of fun loveing ppl like any others.
maybe they are against the occult. fighting it. and hiding a war from the world...
and since women are not allowed to be masons it is logical to assume that women are the epitamy of evil and must be brought down.
yah i agree with sacred.. the masons were just accused of being satanic. read again my explanation above and look for the 666 part..
dont judge people when you have limited info about them
wow, i couldnt have asked for better responses, I myself am still reading about them, and one of my close family members is joining, and from what i have found out, it is something that I am really interested in,,, well, off to do some more research...., Thanks, again,
well, the books i had written above will be very helpful in your research. most of it are documentaries and not fiction...
my great grandfather was a high mason.....
i belonged to jobs daughters because my parents thought it would be good for me yes job taken from job out of the book of the bible not something you go to everyday..... masons have many organizations for girls(job's daughters) and boys (demolay) not to mention the womens virsions starlight something i think and the mens....... most of the rituals and such are taken right from the bible and not from the devil....... many of our four fathers and presidents were mason for instance george washington just to name one.........people do say thing about all organizations when they dont understand them or are a part of them.....but no they never worshiped satan.......
Nightgame
thankyou i didnt see your post till i had posted mine..... yes they do alot of cheirity work..... even we did ... we would hold paper drives and such to get money to donate to local cheritys that needed the money would go into nursing homes and help out for a day something i enjoyed doing...... just like any organizations yeah we dont talk about to what we do in our meetings ......its private for private members...... people who join..... i do know every bethel or lodge keep acurate records of all the meetings and know what goes on way back......i have never tried hiding that i was in jobs daughters and will tell ya i was proud to be apart of it when i was younger .... i am a past jr. princess of bethal 59 for jobs daughters and also majority for them....... although i have not been to a meeting in over 18 years .... i had learned alot and enjoyed it emensly.....
my family has been involved in freemasons for as long as i can remember. based upon my family, i do not think this is any kind of an ocult. as previously stated they do a lot of charity work for those in need.
I am a 32nd Degree Scottish Rite Freemason and I can assure you that Freemasons are not Satanists or members worshiping the occult. Members of Freemasonry must believe in a singular supreme being and "no" this does not include Satan. Additionally, it is my personal belief that they are a subdivision of the Knights Templar which were developed to help the Knights Templar escape persecution and punishment after they were disbanded.
Finally, the Freemasons are not simply a well funded boy's club. Most of the lodges do not even have a lot of money to work with. Most of the money that is obtained is dispursed to charitable organizations.
I always sort of envisioned freemasons as the club that Fred Flintstone and Barney Rubble belonged to.
the history and the myths are fascinating, but if there is any truth to be told about certain Masons guarding the treasure of Soloman it surely is not going to be revealed to us on a VR thread.
id say its a boys club and like most clubs it will always help the rumours of occults etc as it is what will always keep it in ppls minds and make it a thing of mystery
Arthur Edward Waite, occult author, magician and Masonic historian, wrote an encyclopedia of Freemasonry. Dr Wynn Westcott, member of the Societas Rosicruciana in Anglia, was also a founding member of the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn whose members introduced Tantric sex magic rituals to Western society as a form of worship. S L MacGregor Mathers co-founded the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn. Aleister Crowley, pursued in letters by pseudo-scientist Alfred Kinsey for his “sexual experiences,” founded an anti-Christ religion called Thelema. Crowley, a master Satanist of the 20th century, advocated child sacrifice in one his published work Magick in Theory and Practice, used children in perverted sexual rituals, and held several Masonic titles including the highest (33°) in the Ancient and Accepted Rite, and the second highest (96°) in the Ancient and Primitive Rite. Dr Gerard Encaussé, (Papus) masterful author, exponent of the Tarot, and leader of the occult Martinistes Society. Dr Theodore Reuss, head of the German satanic society Ordo Templi Orientis. (The OTO was represented in the British Isles by Aleister Crowley). George Pickingill, witch and sorcerer in England and leader of the “Pickingill covens.” Annie Besant, leader of the occult Theosophical Society and Co-Masonic hierarch. (Yes, there are female Masons!) Alice Bailey, founder of the New Age Lucis (formerly Lucifer) Trust. C W Leadbetter, Theosophist, mentor of the failed avatar, or New Age “Christ,” Krishnamurti, and prelate in the occult Liberal Catholic Church. Manly P Hall, Rosicrucian adept and author of popular Freemasonry manuals. Gerald B Gardner, member of Crowley’s depraved Ordo Templi Orientis, and founder and practitioner of modern witchcraft, or, as it known, wicca. Alex Sanders, self-styled “King of the Witches” based in London, England, and one of the most influential leaders of wicca after Gardner. Freemasonry welcomed all of these occultists and sorcerers into its highest ranks. In addition many minor occultists are drawn to the Lodge by its mysterious power. While all levels of Masonry have their share of occultists and wiccans, the Illuminati, the Ancient rites and the Supreme Council are especially likely to have them.
Sahahria edit: there is no need for this posting as it comes from the one web site that you posted above. Do not just cut and past in the form, state the purpose of your posting.
TYPO in previouspost: they were not Christians nor were they Satanists either, is what the sentence should read. And the name of the Mason who initiated Crowley was Theodur Reuss. Crowley called himself "Baphomet" which was the name of the devil whom the Knights Templar were accused of worshiping by the Church.
Personally I do not believe the Masons are anything but an organization of Protestant men who have nothing to do with evil or Satanism. Some of their symbols and rituals may resemble occult themes, and they may have been linked to the Templars, but that in itself does not make them magickians or occultilists.
I don't know exactly what the Freemasons are about and what they do, but I do know that they are no longer a boys only club. There are a few sites that you can visit where women are allowed to join the Freemasons (I have thought about joining myself).
Visit the site below for more information on women freemasons.
http://www.womenfreemasonsusa.com/index.html
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Cartomancer Arch Sire (194) Posts: 1,252 Honor: 31,066 [ Give / Take ] |
It is a good thing that Sahahria pointed out that society's understanding of the word 'occult' means an evil group- when that is not true. Just like some people think 'Pagan' means an evil group of worshippers, NOT true.
Even the word 'heathen' is now used to describe people that cause trouble. Heathens were merely those Teutonic people of the Asatruar faith, following the Nordic gods, using runes, and laying the visual groundwork for what we now celebrate as Christmas. Being the heathens were considered to be uncivilized, the word started being used to describe troublesome types. A derrogatory word now.
Occult does not = evil.
Freemasons are cool beans :D
thanks sahahria for posting that up .... yes its the eastern star.....like i said it has been years since i went to a meeting or anything and i couldnt quiet remember... all i know is jobs daughters ritual work is right out of the book of job in the bible never was it for evil or satan worshiping..... and i do believe your right about how people view occults.........
I personaly know of a few Freemasons who pratice what some would call Spell Caasting
i wish i knew more ! my grandfather was a mason and my greatgrandmother belonged to the order of the easternstar. when i was finally old enough to join rainbow girls, my mother refused..never really explained..i have been to "the temple" ( a proper masonic family mausoleum up on san jaun island) and it has a distinct feel to it...and i remember a friend of grandpas comeing over after he died and collecting some books and assted things..
The Easter Star was, when my Grandparents were involed, a sort of "Women's Auxillary" to the Masons. My Grandmother was involved with them and their activities.
The History Channel special said that women are now permitted to join as regular members of the Masonic Lodges.
Someone mentioned the Masonic Funeral rights. I remember when my Grandfather passed away a large group of masons came to the funeral home to perform their ceremony. I remember them wearing their aprons and neck pieces and I also remember that pine branches were somehow involved. I wasn't in a state of mind to pay any further attention at the time.
whats the difference betewwn blue lodge, and scottish rite?
My great grandfather was a grand master in a lodge and we still have all his clothing he used very nice indeed all gold thread and the likes .........Still no nothing about it but King Soloman ......Chickens......Dollar Bills
The word "occult" means hidden. So if a society is occult you cannot expect its members to disclose its secrets or indeed whether it is an occult organisation. If they are genuinely occult they will deny it.
A high-ranking Mason was Aleister Crowley, born Edward Alexander Crowley in Warwickshire in 1875, who was the self-proclaimed “Wickedest Man in the World” and the “Great Beast 666.” He also considered himself to be the “avatar of the Age of Horus” which was supposedly a 2000-year-old aeon, beginning in 1904, that would supplant Christianity with “Crowlianity.” Crowley had rebelled against a strict religious upbringing and was thus initiated into the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn in 1898, after leaving Cambridge University. He left the Order after a row with its founders and then travelled to Mexico, India and Ceylon, where he was introduced to yoga and Buddhism which replaced his interest in the occult until an experience in Cairo in April 1904. Crowley was asked by his wife, Rose, to perform an esoteric ritual as an experiment. During the ceremony, she entered a trance-like state and became the medium for the words of a communicator. “They are waiting for you,” she said to Crowley. “They,” she said, being Horus, the god of war and the son of Osiris, according to the beliefs of ancient Egypt. The communicator told Crowley to be at his desk in his hotel room between noon and one o’clock on three specific days. He agreed and in these periods he wrote, via automatic writing, a document called The Book of the Law. This tome spoke of a race of supermen and condemned the traditional Judeo-Christian religions, pacifism, democracy, compassion and humanitarianism. “Let my servants be few and secret: they shall rule the many and the known,” the communicator revealed. The message continued: “We have nothing with the outcast and the unfit; let them die in their misery. For they feel not. Compassion is the vice of kings; stamp down the wretched and the weak: this is the law of the strong: this is our law and the joy of the world. … Love one another with burning hearts; on the low men trample in the fierce lust of your pride, in the day of your wrath. … Pity not the fallen! I never knew them. I am not for them. I console not; I hate the consoled and the consoler. … I am unique and conqueror. I am not of the slaves that perish. Be they damned and dead. Amen. … Therefore strike hard and low, and to hell with them, master. … Lurk! Withdraw! Upon them! This is the law of the Battle of Conquest: thus shall my worship be about my secret house. … Worship me with fire and blood; worship me with swords and with spears. Let the woman be girl with a sword before me: let blood flow in my name. Trample down the heathen; be upon them, O warrior, I will give you their flesh to eat. … Sacrifice cattle, little and big; after a child … kill and torture; spare not; be upon them!”
The same communicator confirmed that Crowley was the “Beast 666” who had come to destroy Christianity, something his mother had told him earlier in his life. Crowley apparently tried to ignore what he had written with his guided hand, but it would not go away, and from 1909 on he began to take it very seriously. He said: “After five years of folly and weakness, miscalled politeness, tact, discretion, care for the feeling of others, I am weary of it. I say today: to hell with Christianity, Rationalism, Buddhism, all the lumber of the centuries. I bring you a positive and primeval fact, Magic by name; and with this I will build me a new Heaven and new Earth. I want none of your faint approval or faint dispraise; I want blasphemy, murder, rape, revolution, anything, bad or good, but strong.” In 1898 Crowley had joined the Order of the Golden Dawn where he made the acquaintance of his temporary mentor, MacGregor Mathers, leader of the occult group. Taking on the name of Brother Perdurabo (“I will endure”) and beginning his experiments with drugs, Crowley’s voracious bisexuality and his interests in the darker forces gave him a sinister reputation. He was very much a figure of decadence who loathed Christianity. The Golden Dawn taught a form of magic that was derived from the Kaballah and Rosicrucianism. There are certainly similarities to Freemasonry and Theosophy. However, the magic espoused by the Order of the Golden Dawn soon proved to be insufficient for Aleister Crowley who was convinced that more potent magic could be harnessed through sex and drugs.
Crowley left his former tutor, MacGregor Mathers, a broken man as he embarked on a psychic war against him. They both conjured up demons to attack the other. The violent eruption concluded with Crowley claiming that Mathers was killed in a magical duel by a vampire he had conjured up. The would-be usurper proved to be too perverted and bizarre for the Order and was cast out. He formulated his own ideas, seeking aid from what he termed the Secret Chiefs (supposedly divine beings with supernatural intellects). The revelation that came to him in Cairo was via a demon named Aiwaz.
Crowley welcomed the First World War as necessary to sweep away the old age and usher in the new one. After going public with his revelations, he was made head of the German-based Ordo Templi Orientis that he had joined in 1912. The OTO emphasis on sexual magic was precisely what Crowley had been searching for. He founded his cult of Thelema in Sicily in 1920, but was expelled in 1923 amid accusations of, among other things, blood drinking, drug taking, and child sacrifice. He is known to have favoured the German war effort during the Second World War and, whilst abroad, once notoriously wrote in The Fatherland: “The sovereignty of England must be destroyed once and for all. England must be divided between the Continental Powers. She must be a mere province, or better still, colony of her neighbours, France and Germany.”
Psh, they can't even organize a potluck, let alone keep hidden any secrets of the universe. They're like glorified Shriners.
DarkArcana
we held many a pot luck in our bethel......... i dont know what your talking about...... but i think if you were part of the organization you wouldnt be saying as such .....
ventrueprince2
yes if you were part of it you would not be alowed to say what you have..... we are not to speak of such things.........but then again i dont know what you have been told not belonging to the masons..... someone might of been losed lips in your case ...........wich is in turn shuned apon ..... and it is for the masons to know...... if you would like to join if you have masons in your family so be it.... but what the truth is,,,, is among us.... and always will be........
I have been interested for a while, and know several people who are members.
NCBandit's post seams to most align with what I know about them.
If I were to be asked I should think that I would join.
On an RP note, we often use the main Lodge in my city for LARP. We have held dances and games and all manner of live events in most of the rooms, and we have been in the building (the large hall) when the other (small) hall was in use.
The building is magnificent, a little cliche... but what do you expect from a ceremonial order.
The Knights of Columbus have always seamed more distubing to me.
lol ventrue ....... nope i am not offended at all .......and i did mean for my post to sound that way.......if you read above yes i was in jobs daughters when i was in high school...... but havent attended a meeting in a long time .......the rules could have changed since ive been a part of them..........it used to be you had to have a family member in the masons in order to join the masonic temple or bethels.........and iam not sure if that is still the case........
when i wanted to join rainbow girls ( long ago and far away ) you had to have a male relative who had been/still was a mason . does anyone know if thats changed?
there are masons within every part of society, my grandfather has been a mason for most of his life and tells nothing about it, I also have worked with an individual who is a higher member of his lodge, they are very secretive, but are not afraid of someone finding out that they are involved.
LovesEternalDeath,
Actually, if you noticed the site that you referenced was posted by the Grand Lodge of Belgium and is not accurate per the United States. We do not allow women. No lodge allows women. There are various sub-groups to the Masons that allow women though. These groups are called Amaranth and The Order of the Eastern Star. There are even a couple groups for female youth (International Order of the Job's Daughters and Rainbow Girls). The Masonic Lodge, Scottish Rite, York Rite, and Shriners do not allow women.
Ive gotten a lot of info and insight from the posts here, id like to thank everyone......
My fiancee's father is a freemason. He's also very active in his church. I'm not sure if the freemasons have anything to do with the occult and he's just feeling very guilty, or if they have nothing to do with the occult. I'm still trying to figure that out. I've actually considered joining the womens version of the freemasons, called the Eastern Stars, I believe.
Basically everything I have heard of them of recent years they are of course just another club but my grandfather used to say that they were very secretive at one point in time which made me believe it was more than meets the eye but hey even if it wasn't the occult they could have been doing something else entirely... you never know what people are really doing
http://www.mystae.com/restricted/streams/masons/mhistory.html
A link about the History of the Freemasons.
From my understanding, long ago they were Templar Knights, protecting some secret. I did some research years back, and found that they also were a "secret society. " Presently, what is published is what information they want to share. They are a close Brotherhood, and are very prestigious. It is an honor to be a member.