Would you consider lycanthropy.. the actual change from man to wolf?
Or would it be more that you take on some of the characteristics of the wolf. rather than its form? the hunting, for food. a mate. a place that you would call your territory? i mean i can actually feel his spirit during the fullmoon phase...well much stronger than i can during the regular phases of the moon. so i ask you wha td oyou believe it to be?....
I think humans already feel those things. We don't need to change into a wolf to feel those things or sense certain things.
Humans have deeper senses than we think.
I believe that it is possible to be able to turn from man into wolf, however, I feel it is a born trait, not an aquired trait.
thats quite a response MRD..thankx i shall have t o find these books and read into them... furthering my knowledge.. thank you...
lycan1200, what you need is to do research on an actual lycan like myself or my brother. mrd is correct in some ways but in others he has them backwards. the change from man wolf is both mental, spiritual, and physical. the french stories he spoke of are of partial transformation where the person had not completed is or her transformation. when a lycan goes animal he or she actually takes the shape of that animal and all human mentality leaves the body and only primal instincts remain. while some mortals believe to have seen these happennings we can only be seen when we want to be seen. when i say the transformations can be spiritual i mean that the transformation takes place only in the spiritual realm, while the person is asleep. i could go on and on about this but i wont. if you have any more questions feel free to ask them and i will answer the best i can.
Tho is would not outrule the possibility of an actual physical shift....I should think being Therian, since I dislike the term Lycan (makes me think denegrated movie term) is more a spiritual shift, mental if you will. Also if you know about the Wendigo and the native history behind it, should you consume the body, perhaps energy of a person, it is possible to then inherit strength, super-abilities as well..I think this could also relate to the therian way.
MrD. had it right on, perhaps it is a state of mind. indeed lycan1200 there is still much for you to learn, research helps out alot with questions you may possibly have.
I happen to believe it is more than a mere state of mind..I believe in Native American cultures out there that can physically change their bodies shape into that of an animal..But, I believe as I said earlier it is a born trait.
indeed there are those among native americans who have that power to change into wolf, in my family were born with the gift of sight, and also of healing, sometimes its something thats passed down through generations.
lycan1200, I know for me personally I would have to see someone change form to know that is real. But I still consider it lycanthropy just to feel the the werewolf part of you more during the full moon, and taking on characteristics of that creature
I agree with you dune..it can be passed down, but, I do not feel that all it takes is a scratch from a werecreature to cause it..I do not feel you can simply aquire it.
The idea that there is a such thing as a person who is biologically part wolf, is asinine.
If anything, it is about the characteristics.
mm altho I do not believe it is impossible. I have never known of anyone that could.. or a reliable sorce that has. The stress on the body is one of the things that makes me wonder if it would be possible at all. And I can say this is not a power I would wish to have.
I, myself, have seen some odd things--things I can't explain. I am not speaking of a hairy, wolf-like creature, but I have seen physical changes in those that would call themselves Lycan. Mostly in the face, but there was no denying what I saw. However, I still believe it is due to their state of mind. The mind controls us, even physcially. Strength, muscle movements, speed--this is all controlled by the mind.
haveing the native american indian inme i do belive it is possible for the shapshifters.... but yet feel it is mostly in the minds itself were we feel the powers and such.... but anything is possible.... when doing research on myths and legends for my forum post of the mytological creatures this was one i had done research on and came across some neat information......
Although most people know werewolves as simply creatures of nightmares and horror movies they were once viewed as real beasts who killed savagely. The creatures are less feared in todays society but the sheer terror can still be inflicted fear of wolves and things that go bump in the night is almost natural.....
The history of the werewolf can be traced back to Greek mythology when the god Lykaon was turned into a wolf after serving Zues human flesh. This myth helped fuel a cult in Arcadia which involved human sacrifice and the thought of transformation into wolves. Although lycanthropy is usually associated with the metamorphosis into a wolf-human hybrid, different legends include the mutation into bears, cats and birds of prey.
During the medieval times the fear of werewolves took grip over Europe. Wolves were known to attack man as wolves during those times had no reason to fear man guns were unheard of. In most of Europe the fear of werewolves included wolfmen ("berserkers") who wore wolves skin and killed savagely. Germans however viewed the wolf with honor. Names such as Wolfgang and Wolfhard were common. As Christianity slowly gained prominence such beliefs were condemned as Satanic.
Philosophers and religious thinkers contemplated the theory that perhaps the person did not physically change into a wolf but had been tricked by Satan into acting like the creatures. Generally, though most believe that only God has the ability to change the body or mind of man.
Most werewolves claim they change into the hybrid by rubbing salve on themselves. Today we know salve has hallucination producing characteristics when mixed with certain plants such as henbane and nightshade. Those who participated in the witch trials of the Renaissance concluded the only transformation took place in the victims mind.
In most cases those who believe they can change into werewolves are considered mentally ill
in my eyes lycanthism as the shape shifting isnt possible... think rationally you cant change the shape of your bones its just inpossible..
although there is a illness that makes humans look kind of like a werwolf...
im not sure about the name.. but its a fact.
myths and legends about werwolfs have different origines
one are wild hunters which is most likely the reason why they were so feared
That illness you refer to is called "hypertrichosis" or Werewolf Syndrome.
I believe that it can be either, that the 'symptoms' and attributes can be completely within the psyche, or can lead into material transformation... but that's just me.
i'd have to agree with prettymuch everyone in this case i have an x who beleives he is a werewolf he dose show some characterisitcs but it's mostly mental with him...
I can see both sides to the arguement here. Some of us are strongly effected by the moon, in not only emotions but physical changes. (that time of the month for instance). I know as an EMT i saw more depression, suicide, battery and attempted murder, during the moon phase. Some I have spoke to actually feel a change within themselves. Feeling stronger, like their about to burst out of their skin with the power they feel. It could be mental, but there are alot of unexplained things out there. I wouldn't doubt lycanthropy so easily after the things i have seen
I have never met anyone that could actually change their shape, but I've met a few who believed they could. I don't discount that it is a possibility, but if there are those out there who can become a werewolf or any other animal, they keep the ability well hidden. It doesn't seem biologically possible, but then again I have seen the impossible with my own eyes, so why not this too?
A doctor will tell you that lycanthropy is a mental illness in which a person believes they can transform into an animal.
There is a lot to both sides of the whole "the moon makes people crazy" thing, on one hand police and emergency workers say there is more violence going on. And on the other hand there really is no evidence to support it, scientific evidence that is. And it has been looked into, for a long time now. There are also alternative explanations. One of those being the power of persuasion, and an active subconscious. Everyone at one time or another has heard about that moon theory, perhaps it is stored in their minds when the commit a crime.
I once thought to myself....if we are made up of water and the moon does what it does to the ocean, imagine what it can do to us. Then someone pointed out that the moon sloshed water around and I started getting a little more skeptic. How does sloshing us around inspire murder?
I believe there is probably another, more reasonable explanation.
I researched some of it,
from what i have found,
in my country,
it is subculture called kemono(An animal trail).
Their major characteristic are these,
Ransspeciesism
Cladotherianthrope
Theriotype
Shifting
Contherianthropes
Graymuzzle
Howl
Looked into it this is what I found...
If the legends are to be believed, lycanthropy has been with us since King Lycaon was transformed into a wolf, in retribution for serving human flesh to Zeus during a dinner party in ancient Greece. Ever since, the werewolf has followed the human race through whispered tales and popular myth, stalking towns and villages from the Caucasus to Colorado. The popularity and seeming irrationality of these stories has been a traditional target for debunkers of the supernatural. Rationalisations of the werewolf myth have stretched from theories of rabies infection to ergot poisoning. More difficult to dispel has been the delusional convictions of people with clinical lycanthropy. Often submerged in intense psychosis, affected individuals report the feeling of transformation into various forms of animal, some experienced as so unusual, the animal has yet to be identified.
“Unlike vampirism, werewolfism is not infectious; though in some cases werewolfery has been thought to be hereditary rather than acquired. According to some foklore, the werewolf is liable to become a vampire after expiring and those suspected in past times were always burned after death to prevent them wandering beyond the grave. Notwithstanding this predisposition, according to legend, the werewolf is a living being, not a vampire in wolf form, who either voluntarily or involuntarily changes, or is metamorphosed, into the apparent shape of a wolf; becoming possessed of all the characteristics, ferocity, cunning, strength and swiftness of that animal.”
~ Seán Manchester, The Vampire Hunter’s Handbook (Gothic Press, 1997, page 10)
“It should be stated that in a secondary or derivative sense of the word ‘werewolf’ has been erroneously employed to denote a person suffering from lycanthropy, that mania or disease when the person is afflicted with hideous appetites, the ferocity and other qualities of a wolf. While those suffering that savage delusion betray all the bestial propensities of the animal, lycanthropists do not physically change into the shape of a wolf. With regard to the voluntary werewolf, under whom for this consideration any kind of shape-shifting may be included, an essential circumstance and condition is the employment of the dark arts. Such metamorphosis can only be brought about by black magic.”
~ Seán Manchester, The Highgate Vampire (BOS, 1985, page 168)
“I know that after my departure savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock; and from among your own selves men will arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away the disciples after them. Therefore be on the alert.”
~ Seán Manchester, [quoting St Luke] Carmel (Gothic Press, 2000, page 19)
“Werewolfism has been reported throughout the world, though the animals into which humans transform has been quite varied. … Werewolves and vampires have been reported as existing side by side in the mythologies of many cultures, but they have a special relationship in the southern Balkan area, from whence the modern vampire myth comes. … Belief in werewolves apparently peaked in Europe during the late Middle Ages. … There were several trials against people accused of werewolfism.”
~ J Gordon Melton, The Vampire Book (Gail Research, 1994, pages 676-677)
“Werewolf: a person supposed to be able by natural gift or magic art to change himself for a time into a wolf.”
~ Chambers’ Twentieth Century Dictionary
I beleive humans already has these senses they are just increased when the ful moonth appears. they dont totally change into a lycan.
~Yours In The Darkness~
Most scientific studies on the effects of the moon and human behavior have found no relationship to be had. In other words, there was little if any data that showed any increases in any violent or aberrant behavior that correlated to the phases of the moon.
If there is any relationship between the moon and human behavior, it is likely a result of self fulfilling prophecy wherein someone believes they will act differently on a full moon and therefore convince themselves to do so.
http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a2_337.html
http://faculty.washington.edu/chudler/moon.html
I guess my point is that if you believe in the supernatural, then you don't need evidence but that looking for evidence will not yield very supportive facts.
i would have to say that it is true. For even with out the moon above me i feel that way. the need to hunt, and looking for a mate. As for territory also , for i have claimed some parts of indy as mine
Felix,
How does that work? Believing in the supernatural needs no proof? Feh, there are odd things that I belive in, yet I gained that belief only after proof was given to me. Maybe we should say that, "Evidence is debatable, no matter what you believe in." Or, maybe the word shouldn't be "believe," rather the term "mutually accepted." The supernatural will become "mutually accepted" or fact, when it is scientificly documented, translated for all languages and intellegence levels, then accepted by all. That can't happen, not going to happen. Heck, this hasn't even happend for some of our already accepted science, yet we go on pretending it is true because someone used big words in a thesis. ;)
I never ask anyone to believe what I feel to be true. I state what I know, and I wait for those to speak to me of experiences matching my own--without coaching.
me personaly i think that it can only happen when one blaks out or is asleep and has twitches in their sleep cuz one night in the past week i was in the woods naked and i was still tired and went back to sleep hopeing for it to be a night mere but then i was back ing bed with leaves in my hair so idk wat happend just i am shocked to be here right now.
I think its more a state of mind ,thinkin yourea wolf makes you become one ,my x was lycan and towards full mos his nails realy grew and got sharper and hes personlaty changed and he didnt follow the moon phases so jsut kinda knew when it was close to full
I agree that it is a mindset. I'm not saying its multiple personality disorder at all, do not misunderstand me. But I think that certain feelings arise in a person due to their beliefs, psyche, or emotional state. A poor yet obvious example would be a woman with PMS. Although vicious during this cycle, the woman will transition back to her normal self.
Believing it is a mindset, I don't believe there is a physical change. Just a mental change. I feel that it is a great 'gift' and wish those with it the best.
felix felix i like that lol..... but anyway some of the know causes they have researched for lycanthropy
Ergot, which causes a form of foodborne illness, is a fungus that grows in place of rye grains in wet growing seasons after very cold winters. Ergot poisoning usually affects whole towns or at least poor areas of towns and results in hallucinations, mass hysteria and paranoia, as well as convulsions and sometimes death. (LSD can be derived from ergot.)
Ergot poisoning has been proposed as both a cause of an individual believing that he or she is a werewolf and of a whole town believing that they had seen a werewolf. However, this theory is controversial and unsatisfactory. Witchcraft hysteria and legends of animal transformations, as well as hysteria and superstition in general, have existed across the world for all of recorded history. Even if ergot poisoning is found to be an accurate explanation in some cases, it cannot be applied to all instances. An over-reliance on any one theory denies the diversity and complexity of such occurrences.
Some modern researchers have tried to use conditions such as rabies, hypertrichosis (excessive hair growth over the entire body) or porphyria (an enzyme disorder with symptoms including hallucinations and paranoia) as an explanation for werewolf beliefs. Congenital erythropoietic porphyria has clinical features which include photosensitivity (so sufferers only go out at night), hairy hands and face, poorly healing skin, pink urine, and reddish colour to the teeth.
There is also a rare mental disorder called clinical lycanthropy, in which an affected person has a delusional belief that he or she is transforming into another animal, although not always a wolf or werewolf.
Others believe werewolf legends arose as a part of shamanism and totem animals in primitive and nature-based cultures.
The term therianthropy has been adopted to describe a spiritual concept in which the individual believes he or she has the spirit or soul, in whole or in part, of a non-human animal.
how many people out there believe vampyres exist? probably over half if not most. so why is it so hard to beleive that actual shapeshifters exist? i have read several things that are true and then there are some that insult me. my brothers get mad at me for saying more than i should about us but the fact that many out there say things that are just ridiculous makes me say it. i have said before that the transformation is mental and physical both at the same time and i stick to it. we can transform anytime we want it is not like the movies where it happens only during a full moon. the best way to explain it is to say watch the movie ginger snaps. that is the most accurate movie out there. the skeletal system does not have to change much. mainly facial is what changes. it is ancestral. i cannot make anyone. a "lycan" we have to many fucking names now i dont know what to call us. anyway. we are all part of a huge bloodline. i just dont understand how someone can beleive in the supernatural and vamps but not shapeshifters. can someone explain that to me? i am 6500 years old and i just cant understand it. never have i seen a century so messed up and confused.
Lycanthrope Information
Pyhsical Weres
Weres that have a physical connection with the animal. These people are not necessarily PSers, they might have a strong physical resemblance to their animal counterpart. Easily recognizable and liable to scare small children.
Mental Weres
Weres that have a deep connection to the animal within, as it tends to affect several core aspects of the person, including: personality, temperment, responses, instinct, emotions, and slight physical manifestations.
Spiritual Weres
Weres that the animal is a seperate entity of themselves, of their physical self, or non-exsistant. Spiritual components don't affect human cognitive abilities. They remain part of their "awereness" on a religious/spiritual level.
Taken with permission from Shifters.org
Shifters.org
You know, most "mythological creatures & legends" were born of fact. Lycans have been found in almost every culture on the planet. I am smart enough to know that I don't know everything, so...
Well I believe we as humans already take on characteristics of animals. It must stem from my Native blood. So it makes fare more sense to me that it would be the same with Lycan.
Lycanthropy is a theory, a study if you will in trying to prove if werewolves really exist.
This is based on the term Clinical lycanthropy which is a rare psychiatric syndrome that involves a delusional belief that the affected person is, or has, transformed into an animal. It is named after the mythical condition of lycanthropy, a supernatural affliction in which people are said to physically shapeshift into werewolves. The word zoanthropy is also sometimes used for the delusion that one has turned into an animal in general and not specifically a wolf.
Researchers have noted that lycanthropy can be a part of normal culture-dependent behaviour. Therianthropy is a non-clinical term that has been used to describe the same phenomenon, this article focuses on clinical lycanthropy as a factor in psychiatric diagnosis.
my personal opinion is that werewolves are way more impossible than undead mythical vampires. i mean really think about a human completely change form? i understand what mrd is saying that its a mental state, but if so how can it be true lycanthrope? very impossible to me
All animals are closely related, we all have the same basic structure, but i don't see how you could physically alter your body in such a way, not that I know of.
But mentally, anything is possible. You could easily get your mind to work like a wolf's, expressing the same actions/reactions, the same base principles that a wolf's mind operates on.
But also, you could go beyond just operating like a wolf, you could forget you're human and have men in white suits coming for you.
Believe what you want, just take all your new found knowledge with a grain of salt.
Follow those who you best identify with, learn from them, and walk your own path.
I agree with salemjones and a few others. The human body is too dissimilar from the wolve's and to change it so quickly is impossible, if you'd like to live that is. However, mentally people can be whatever or whoever they'd like. We see some of that on here, lol. Also, you can not denounce the possibility that there could be some sort of Chemical Imbalance to attribute to this Species Confused person, or mental state.
I see that most agree mind over matter is a strong tool however there are certian lines that just can not be crossed. No matter how badly you may want to fly you wil never grow real wings. Man can invent wings or discover them but he will never create them.
Asfar as the moon having effect I think if we look back on old wives tales we find quite a few about the full moon. Anything from conception to dreams are mentioned in with the moon's cycle. I could see a shift in pull having maybe a little effect on another human being but beyond that I would have to see a little more research before I could by it hook, line and sinker.
I see lacanthropy as a person's spirit taking on the features of the wolf rather than a magical physical transformation. In my mind any physical resemblance to wolf is a conscious effort or fluke.
"The supernatural will become 'mutually accepted' or fact, when it is scientificly documented, translated for all languages and intellegence levels, then accepted by all." - Illuminati
The supernatural is fact (unless, of course, it does not exist on any level), but if it could be scientifically documeted it would by definition cease to be supernatutal. For what is measurable by science is natural and can only be so.
The supernatural is such because it is beyond scientific explanation. It denies all known scientific principles and theories. It is the impossible become possible.
MorphineDream08, I tend to agree but changes don't have to be physical to be real.
ok lets say it is possible to have what you are suggesting of mental lycanthrope and u take on the mental spirit of an animal. well why would it be desired to go from an intelligent being to a wolf or other animal that is not nearly as intelligent
to be free from the trappings of man. to live out passionately...
To be humbled; to leave the high expectations of the human intellegence behind. Perhaps to see how simple, driven thought is more efficent.
O.R Melling[The Book Of Dreams] uses the lycan tale as a curse to her characters. In her stories Lycans become beasts and a full of rage. Stephanie Meyers does the same In her Newest Novel, New Moon.
Lycan's are werewolves and humans. In the Book of Dreams,Lycans are only werewolfs at night, wereas in New Moon, Lycans can become werewolfs easily if you make them angry.
Wikipedia suggests that in folklore, lycanthropy is the ability or power of a human being to undergo transformation into a wolf.
i believe that it is more of a mental or spiritual change into a more animalistic mindset
Thats an excellent question.I truly don't believe in the actual man to werewolf thing.But I do believe in some of the traits that are said to be akin to both.
Werwolves become most ferocious in Februray, retiring for the night to lone cemeteries and living precisely in the manner of ravening wolves. They have unusually hollow eyes, scabbed legs and thighs, very dry and pale. The lycanthropist is at risk of becoming a vampire when he dies.
From what I understand there is two sides the the whole Lycanthropy case..
there are those that exibit tradinal traids of what ever animal, held sway by a touch of lunacy, and hold a hunger with in themselfs.
And then there are those that have been called therians, those that can actuualy shift form from human to Animal, and back agian..your classic shapeshifter.
Now from what I'vce run acrose over time is that some be what ever they choose to classify themselves as, tend to be either or..
I know that in Wisconsin they have reports of a werewolf that had been dubbed the Beast of Bray Road. I do not know much about it other than it has been seen a few times in the last 10 or so years in and around Elkhorn Wisconsin.
I think it is more taking on the characteristics of a wolf moreso than actually changing into one. I have yet to run into someone who can actually change.
It can be all in the mind, the mind is a powerful thing. Who am I to say that it does or doesn't happen.
My Forfather's were Viking Berserker's and called Werewolves..
my name is Jormundgang Njordsatt.
(The Bloodline of Njord) Acording to my famely tree in book's
Njord was the Heeden god of Luck, Sea wind and Flame.
Father of Froya and froy
his wife was Skade.
now for those of you enlightend in Norrse Religion will know more aboute thees god's
Anyway.. iwe been tested for drug's a lot of time's cus i have an enormus amount of Adrenalin and Endorfin in my blood.
so why does my body generate so mutch of thees chemicals in my blood?
if my mind can make me produse thee's Natural "Drug's..."
why should it not then do the same to other's.
as far as it comes to feeling stronger this is the work of adrenalin in my blood..
it makes me faster and stronger and my reaction's are sharpened..
and when it comes to pain it will be ignored by the Endorfine.
2 time's National player in American Footbal.
Offence/ Defense Lineman.
I do not believe per say that a human will turn into a wolf during this process but I do think that they can have the characteristics such as a heightened sense of smell, sight, etc. Also there is the simple fact that the human mind is a very powerful tool it can make almost anything a reality. So if you wish to believe you are in a wolf stage... it's quite possible that you will develop such senses.
i believe that there is a mental and spiritual way to change into a wolf, and in doing so cause your body to take on caractoristics. however, physical changes are a biological oddity.
in the case study of 'the werewolf of london' (and i mean the real person, not the movie) he fully believed that he became a wolf during the full moon. he physicall hunched more and was incapable of human speech at those time. at one point during and episode he actually squeezed his head and one arm through the small viewing window in his cell door.
as for spiritually. i have myself taken many animal forms during meditation or while on other planes. in this case one must be careful not to be disturbed as a few times i was rudely awoken and it took several hours before i mentally was able to see myself as human again.
definately do alot more study into the subject before trying anything for yourself. and remember, we are all here to help if you need it.
the way i see it...ok a dog can take on its owners characteristics right?...well then why cant a person take on the characteristics of a dog like creature?
Well I suppose it all depends on which side you support more.
You have the spiritual aspects. Native Americans have animal guides and when they are in meditative states, they can access and harness that animals powers and characteristics. (I suppose here can be mental, too.) They would use these to gain insight on nature, for instance, to help them hunt better with the help of enhanced senses due to their animal ties.
For more mental... I guess some people can be delusional and just "think" they are werewolves or any other animal. I do not discredit them though, believe what you want. It may just be in your head, though. You cannot prove that you are a werewolf simply because you exhibit signs and characteristic associated with the wolf. Many people have animal-like features or behaviors, does that make them were-animals, too?
Perhaps it's psychological because you were an animal in a past life and you have just inhereted the traits :)
I can't explain how a person can transform. I know that many people in extreme cases can summon incredible amounts of strength and have incredibly keen senses, but can a person transform entirely? How is it that when transforming, you can shift all human properties to that of a wolf? I mean, we have completely different structures.
heh, someone mentioned the Stephenie Meyer books above (Twilight and New Moon). In these, it is believed that your ability to transfrom is hereditary. But it also says that they are descended from wolves. So really, the humans are only resorting back to their primitive state. Personally I would prefer to be descended from wolves versus the excepted belief that we are descended from monkeys.
Which brings me to my next point, how can you outrule physical transformation when humans used to be monkeys?! I understand that it is evolution and it took many many moons to make us the way we are, but perhaps for a specific few, it was different? Perhaps some humans are descendants of wolves and can resort back to their natural state simply by choice. Perhaps in the beginning the transformation did not go so smoothly, as many believe that is how it would go - not very pretty. But evolution! Survival of the fittest. Maybe they needed faster transitions and eventually they were able to do such.
And the moon. I do believe, regardless of how it relates to werewolves or otherwise, it does have some effect on us. The moon controls the tides. Humans are 70% water. The moon therefor has sway over us, too. We are creatures of nature. We are not simply creatures of our own sorts. We are all connected somehow. We all came from the same pool. Humans are not alone in this world.
In folklore, lycanthropy is the ability or power of a human being to undergo transformation into a wolf. The term comes from ancient Greek lykánthropos (λυκάνθρωπος): λύκος, lýkos ("wolf") + άνθρωπος, ánthrōpos ("man") (Rose, 230). The word can also be used transitively, referring to the act of transforming someone else into a wolf, or werewolf.
The word lycanthropy is often used generically for any transformation of a human into animal form, though the precise term for that is technically therianthropy. Rarely, zoanthropy is used instead of therianthropy (Guiley, 192).
Folk-etymology also links the word to Lycaon, a king of Arcadia who, according to Ovid's Metamorphoses, was turned into a ravenous wolf in retribution for attempting to serve human flesh (his own son) to visiting Zeus in an attempt to disprove the god's divinity.
There is also a mental illness called lycanthropy in which a patient believes he or she is, or has transformed into, an animal and behaves accordingly. This is sometimes referred to as clinical lycanthropy to distinguish it from its use in legends.
Causes
Much of the time, lycanthropy is not given any specific explanation in legends, other than being generally attributed to magic, which may be voluntary (a preternatural power) or involuntary (a curse). When a more detailed explanation is assigned, it is generally one of those listed below.
[edit] Mechanisms of transformation
Even if the denotation of lycanthropy is limited to the wolf-metamorphosis of living human beings, the beliefs classed together under this head are far from uniform, and the term is somewhat capriciously applied. The transformation may be temporary or permanent; the were-animal may be the man himself metamorphosed, it may be his double whose activity leaves the real man to all appearance unchanged, it may be his soul, which goes forth seeking whom it may devour and leaving its body in a state of trance; or it may be no more than the messenger of the human being, a real animal or a familiar spirit, whose intimate connection with its owner is shown by the fact that any injury to it is believed, by a phenomenon known as repercussion, to cause a corresponding injury to the human being.
[edit] Transmigration of souls
Lycanthropy is often confused with transmigration; but the essential feature of the were-animal is that it is the alternative form or the double of a living human being, while the soul-animal is the vehicle, temporary or permanent, of the spirit of a dead human being. Nevertheless, instances in legend of humans reincarnated as wolves are often classed with lycanthropy, as well as these instances being labeled werewolves in local folklore.
There is no line of demarcation, and this makes it probable that lycanthropy is connected with nagualism and the belief in familiar spirits, rather than with metempsychosis, as E. B. Tylor argued, or with totemism, as suggested by J. F. M'Lennan. Thus, these origins for lycanthropy mingle a belief in reincarnation, a belief in the sharing of souls between living humans and beasts and a belief in human ghosts appearing as non-human animals after death. A characteristic of metempsychosis is a blurring of the boundaries between the intangible and the corporeal, so that souls are often conceived of as solid, visible forms that need to eat and can do physical harm (Hamel, 15).
[edit] Witchcraft
The phenomenon of repercussion, the power of animal metamorphosis, or of sending out a familiar, real or spiritual, as a messenger, and the supernormal powers conferred by association with such a familiar, are also attributed to the magician, male and female, all the world over; and witch superstitions are closely parallel to, if not identical with, lycanthropic beliefs, the occasional involuntary character of lycanthropy being almost the sole distinguishing feature. In another direction the phenomenon of repercussion is asserted to manifest itself in connection with the bush-soul of the West African and the nagual of Central America; but though there is no line of demarcation to be drawn on logical grounds, the assumed power of the magician and the intimate association of the bush-soul or the nagual with a human being are not termed lycanthropy. Nevertheless it will be well to touch on both these beliefs here.
[edit] Animal ancestors
Stories of humans descending from animals are common explanations for tribal and clan origins. Sometimes the animals assumed human forms in order to ensure their descendants retained their human shapes, other times the origin story is of a human marrying a normal animal.
North American indigeneous traditions particularly mingle the idea of bear ancestors and ursine shapeshifters, with bears often being able to shed their skins to assume human form, marrying human women in this guise. The offspring may be monsters with combined anatomy, they might be very beautiful children with uncanny strength, or they could be shapeshifters themselves (Pijoan, 79).
P'an Hu is represented in various Chinese legends as a supernatural dog, a dog-headed man, or a canine shapeshifter that married an emperor's daughter and founded at least one race. When he is depicted as a shapeshifter, all of him can become human except for his head. The race(s) descended from P'an Hu were often characterized by Chinese writers as monsters who combined human and dog anatomy (White, 150).
[edit] Animal spirits
In North and Central America, and to some extent in West Africa, Australia and other parts of the world, every male acquires at puberty a tutelary spirit (see Demonology); in some Native American tribes the youth kills the animal of which he dreams in his initiation fast; its claw, skin or feathers are put into a little bag and become his "medicine" and must be carefully retained, for a "medicine" once lost can never be replaced. In West Africa this relation is said to be entered into by means of the blood bond, and it is so close that the death of the animal causes the man to die and vice versa. Elsewhere the possession of a tutelary spirit in animal form is the privilege of the magician. In Alaska the candidate for magical powers has to leave the abodes of men; the chief of the gods sends an otter to meet him, which he kills by saying "O" four times; he then cuts out its tongue and thereby secures the powers which he seeks.
The Malays believe that the office of pawang (priest) is only hereditary if the soul of the dead priest, in the form of a tiger, passes into the body of his son. While the familiar is often regarded as the alternative form of the magician, the nagual or bush-soul is commonly regarded as wholly distinct from the human being. Transitional beliefs, however, are found, especially in Africa, in which the power of transformation is attributed to the whole of the population of certain areas. The people of Banana are said to change themselves by magical means, composed of human embryos and other ingredients, but in their leopard form they may do no hurt to mankind under pain of retaining forever the beast shape. In other cases the change is supposed to be made for the purposes of evil magic and human victims are not prohibited.
A further link is supplied by the Zulu belief that the magician's familiar is really a transformed human being; when he finds a dead body on which he can work his spells without fear of discovery, the wizard breathes a sort of life into it, which enables it to move and speak, it being thought that some dead wizard has taken possession of it. He then burns a hole in the head and through the aperture extracts the tongue. Further spells have the effect of changing the revivified body into the form of some animal, hyena, owl or wild cat, the latter being most in favour. This creature then becomes the wizard's servant and obeys him in all things; its chief use is, however, to inflict sickness and death upon persons who are disliked by its master.
In Melanesia there is a belief in the tamaniu or atai which is an animal counterpart to a person. It can be an eel, a shark, a lizard, or some other creature. This creature is corporeal, can understand human speech, and shares the same soul as its master, leading to legends which have many characteristics typical of shapeshifter tales, such as any death or injury affecting both forms at once (Hamel, 21).
[edit] Regional Varieties
Although the term lycanthropy properly speaking refers to metamorphosis into a wolf (see werewolf), lycanthropy is in popular practice used of transformation into any animal, even though the proper term is therianthropy. In India and the Asian islands the tiger is the most common form; in North Europe, the bear (see berserker); in Japan, the fox, tanuki(raccoon dog), and sometimes a wolf; in Africa, the leopard, hyena, or lion; and in South America, the jaguar. Though there is a tendency for the most important carnivorous animal of the area to take the first place in stories and beliefs as to transformation, the less important beasts of prey and even harmless animals like the deer or rabbit also figure prominently among the were-animals. Another unusual case is the were-shark of Polynesia and were-crocodile of Indonesia and Egypt.
[edit] Lycanthropy in North America
Many Native cultures feature skin-walkers or a similar concept, wherein a shaman or warrior may, according to cultural tradition, take on an animal form. Animal forms vary accordingly with cultures and local species (including bears and wolves), for example, a coyote is more likely to be found as a skinwalker's alternate form in the Great Plains region. Skinwalkers tend to be totemic.
In modern folklore and fiction the Wendigo found in the stories of many Algonquian peoples is sometimes considered to be similar to lycanthropes, in that humans could transform into them. The original legends varied significantly, however, and the fit may not be very close.
The Cajuns of Louisiana also believed in a similar creature with the variant name of Rougarou.
Modern legends from Wisconsin describe a werewolf or man-wolf creature called the Beast of Bray Road.
The Were-hare is another, less common variant found in the South-Eastern portions of the United States.
[edit] Lycanthropy in South America
According to K. F. P. v. Martius the kanaima is a human being who employs poison to carry out his function of blood avenger; other authorities represent the kanaima as a jaguar, which is either an avenger of blood or the familiar of a cannibalistic sorcerer. The Europeans of Brazil hold that the seventh child of the same sex in unbroken succession becomes a were-man or woman, and takes the form of a headless horse (or mule), goat, guará-wolf or pig. The dolphin-man (boto) or encantado is common in native north Brazilian folklore, but it is more likely a mythical power of the boto (changing itself's shape into a man's) than a man that changes himself into an animal.
[edit] Lycanthropy in Europe
The wolf is the most common form of the were-animal, though in the north the bear disputes its pre-eminence. In ancient Greece the dog was also associated with the belief. The were-boar variant is known through Greece and Turkey. Marcellus of Sida, who wrote under the Antonines, gives an account of a disease which befell people in February; but a pathological state seems to be meant.
See Vilkacis, Berserker
[edit] Lycanthropy in Africa
In Abyssinia the power of transformation is attributed to the Boudas, and at the same time we have records of pathological lycanthropy (see below). Blacksmiths are credited with magical powers in many parts of the world, and it is significant that the Boudas are workers in iron and clay; in the Life of N. Pearce (i. 287) a European observer tells a story of a supposed transformation which took place in his presence and almost before his eyes; but it does not appear how far hallucination rather than coincidence must be invoked to explain the experience. The animal forms taken in Africa include the gazelle, crocodile, hyena, jackal, lion and leopard.
[edit] Lycanthropy in the South Pacific
There are various tales of people becoming sharks in various South Pacific islands. For the most part, these werecreatures are benevolent or at least not malign. There are several variant stories on how weresharks come about. One story is that a wereshark inherits their ability. Others point to children lost at sea or children adopted by a shark god. Many of the humans-turned-sharks are described as having skin patterns that no natural sharks have: similar to the cloth patterns of blankets that are wrapped around infants.
[edit] Lycanthropy in the East Indies
The Poso-Alfures of central Celebes believe that man has three souls, the inosa, the angga and the tanoana. The inosa is the vital principle; it can be detected in the veins and arteries; it is given to man by one of the great natural phenomena, more specifically the wind. The angga is the intellectual part of man; its seat is unknown; after death it goes to the under-world, and, unlike the inosa, which is believed to be dissolved into its original elements, takes possession of an immaterial body. The tanoana is the divine in man and after death returns to its lord, Poewempala boeroe. It goes forth during sleep, and all that it sees it whispers into the sleeper's ear and then he dreams. According to another account, the tanoana is the substance by which man lives, thinks and acts; the tanoana of man, plants and animals is of the same nature. A man's tanoana can be strengthened by those of others; when the tanoana is long away or destroyed the man dies. The tanoana seems to be the soul of which lycanthropic feats are asserted.
Among the Toradjas of central Celebes it is believed that a man's "inside" can take the form of a cat, wild pig, ape, deer or other animal, and afterwards resume human form; it is termed lamboyo. The exact relation of the lamboyo to the tanoana does not seem to be settled; it will be seen below that the view seems to vary. According to some the power of transformation is a gift of the gods, but others hold that lycanthropy is contagious and may be acquired by eating food left by a lycanthrope or even by leaning one's head against the same pillar. The Todjoers hold that any one who touches blood becomes a shapeshifter. In accordance with this view is the belief that lycanthropy can be cured; the breast and stomach of the shapeshifter must be rubbed and pinched, just as when any other witch object has to be extracted. The patient drinks medicine, and the contagion leaves the body in the form of snakes and worms. There are certain marks by which a shapeshifter can be recognized. His eyes are unsteady and sometimes green with dark shadows underneath. He does not sleep soundly and fireflies come out of his mouth. His lips remain red in spite of betel chewing, and he has a long tongue. The Todjoers add that his hair stands on end.
Some of the forms of the lamboyo are distinguishable from ordinary animals by the fact that they run about among the houses; the were-buffalo has only one horn, and the were-pig transforms itself into an ants' nest, such as hangs from trees. Some say that the lycanthrope does not really take the form of an animal himself, but, like the sorcerer, only sends out a messenger. The lamboyo attacks by preference solitary individuals, for he does not like to be observed. The victim feels sleepy and loses consciousness; the lamboyo then assumes human form (his body being, however, still at home) and cuts up his victim, scattering the fragments all about. He then takes the liver and eats it, puts the body together again, licks it with his long tongue and joins it together. When the victim comes to himself again he has no idea that anything unusual has happened to him. He goes home, but soon begins to feel unwell. In a few days he dies, but before his death he is able sometimes to name the shapeshifter to whom he has fallen a victim.
From this account it might be inferred that the lamboyo was identical with the tanoana: the absence of the lamboyo seems to entail a condition of unconsciousness, and it can assume human form. In other cases, however, the lamboyo seems to be analogous to the familiar of the sorcerer. The Toradjas tell a story of how a man once came to a house and asked the woman to give him a rendezvous; it was night and she was asleep; the question was put three times before the answer was given "in the tobacco plantation". The husband was awake, and next day followed his wife, who was irresistibly drawn thither. The lycanthrope came to meet her in human form, although his body was engaged in building a new house, and caused the woman to faint by stamping three times on the ground. Thereupon the husband attacked the shapeshifter with a piece of wood, and the latter to escape transformed himself into a leaf; this the husband put into a piece of bamboo and fastened the ends so that he could not escape, he then went back to the village and put the bamboo in the fire. The shapeshifter said "Don't", and as soon as it was burnt he fell dead.
In another case a woman died, and, as her death was believed to be due to the malevolence of a lycanthrope, her husband watched by her body. For, like Indian witches, the werewolf, for some reason, wishes to revive his victim and comes in human form to carry off the coffin. As soon as the woman was brought to life the husband attacked the werewolf, who transformed himself into a piece of wood and was burnt. The woman remained alive, but her murderer died the same night.
According to a third form of the belief, the body of the shapeshifter is itself transformed. One evening a man left the hut in which a party were preparing to pass the night; one of his companions heard a deer and fired into the darkness. Soon after the man came back and said he had been shot. Although no marks were to be seen he died a few days later.
Mmmmkay?
This is a really good web site for those who want to explore more: http://werewolves.monstrous.com/index.htm
I dont consider lycanthropy as a physical change from a man to wolf...but a change in physical actions and reactions....more of a mental change then physical really.
For me, it would be more of a mental state of mind rather than a physical change as portrayed by Hollywood in their movies. And it differs in every single individual. :)
If someone were a werewolf, I can't see them transforming into something like the wolf-man. I'd believe in a full transformation into a wolf before I'd consider that.
camuel that legend you weretalkign about was on tv tonight... the beast of bray road.. it was an alright movie...
im part lycan and yes we have some times change to form and grow into feeling of animal like when u get mad or there is a full moon it comes into us hehe..
especially me!
I think it depends on what a person specifically has. How can I say that lycans don't exist or that they can't physically change into wolves when people say that I don't exist. I think the better question is to come to terms with the parts of lycanthropy you have because just like there are many different types of vampires there are probably many different types of lycans.
i have difficulties with this. the mind affects the body - i think we have all read about stigmata, so it is not inconceivable that someone whose mindset is that of a wolf, might take on certain characterstics, a feral look in the eyes and face, maybe even grow a little hairier. but i have heard of many witnesses to a werewolf describe not a "Lon chaney jr" type man, but say that the werewolf actually becomes a wolf. that would mean a change in bone structure, mass, musculature. it's clearly not possible. perhaps a person could, in theory, alter their own DNA, but then the transformation would take several years to take place, not a few minutes. i once met a man who claims he saw a man turn into a tiger, in seconds. it defies logic and what we accept as real. maybe what happens, is the lycan is so spiriotually a wolf (or other beast) that he affects the minds of those who are around him, so they see what he imagines himself to be. thats the only thing that makes sense to me.
Lycans are realy misunderstood but i think tis the thrill of the hunt when your team is there with you and your working to gether to acomplish the same goal SURVIVAL OF THE PACK
I still believe it's genetically possible. Sure, you can't provide proof of the change until you see it, but that doesn't mean you can just set it aside as unbelievable.
oh, anything is generaly possible. however, a physical change of that nature would definately require a magical influance.
well I think that anything in this world is possible.. but for the most part, when one speaks of lycanthropy, it's more of a mind change than physical.
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Cartomancer Arch Sire (194) Posts: 1,252 Honor: 31,170 [ Give / Take ] |
I believe in miracles, but not this one. I am more of the 'state of mind' believer, metaphor.
It's just really gotten to be a hot topic since 'The Underworld' movies, and that really bothers me. People here say they are 'lycans'... and this derivative of lycanthrophy was invented for the movie, peeps.
i agree. i have always profered the term shifter. mostly because it doesn't limit the person to one animal as mentally and spiritually a shifter can take on many shapes
I don't think it really matters what name you give it, it all means the same thing, or at least sticks to the general idea. The person changes. Why does it matter so much that its physical as well as mental or spiritual? Is there really any differance? (OK, I know there is, but that line is really thin!) The person changes to that of a wolf, does it matter how?!
Belief is belief... in which any and everything can be stated and/or believed.
However, factually speaking, Lycanthropy originally referred to one of the original claimed characteristics of the vampire in the original legends. In fact, one of the first terms for a vampire was the Serbo-Croatian word "vukodlak", which means"wolf's hair," referring to the vampire's noted ability to change from man to wolf. This is where the legends of "lycanthropy" began.
While in fiction (most recently the "Underworld" movies) vampires and werewolves are separate entities, originally vampires were shapeshifters and could shapeshift into anything from a point of light, to a plant, to a wolf.
Ironically however, no where in the original accounts does the vampire ever change into a bat.
i am a scientist - to my mind, magic is just a science we dont understand yet. there is so much documentation and eye witness accounts of physical transformation that it cannot be just discounted. i want to believe it, but i need to understand how it can work.
All things sprang from the same pool in the beginning. No wonder so many creatures can be related to others similar to them. (Everything can be connected to everything!) I believe Vampires and Werewolves came from the same source also.
actually the word lycanthropy comes from the greek lýkos ("wolf") + ánthrōpos ("man") there fore it only refers to a wolfman or werewolf. there are other types of shifters; however, each would have it's own name.
That's why I prefer the term Therian...so that all shifters are included...since so many seem to roget there are other types than wolves...and all are important.
I think a change does happen...for some it may be merely mental attributes and taking on the ferocity of the chosen animal, for many it does show some amount of physical change, from minute to larger....
For me I become more testy, angry easy, wanting nice rare mooing beef...and ready to hunt at the merest provocation.
I think it has a lot to do with a persons mind-set. If one believes strong enough that they are in deed a mythical creature, it would not shock me in the least for them to begin to take on those characteristics.
Lycanthropy mean to take on the form of anouther creature like the wolf i don't belive you have to change into it but you may only have to "become" it in the mind
Lycanthropy from Greek lykoi, "wolf" anthropos, "man", a psychiatric state in which the patient believes that he or she is a wolf or some other nonhuman animal.
Lycanthropy is often confused with transmigration; but the essential feature of the were-animal is that it is the alternative form or the double of a living human being, while the soul-animal is the vehicle, temporary or permanent, of the spirit of a dead human being. The vampire is sometimes regarded as an example of lycanthropy; but it is in human form, sometimes only a head, sometimes a whole body, sometimes that of a living person, at others of a dead man who issues nightly from the grave to prey upon the living.
Even if the denotation of lycanthropy be limited to the animal-metamorphosis of living human beings, the beliefs classed together under this head are far from uniform, and the term is somewhat capriciously applied. The transformation may be voluntary or involuntary, temporary or permanent; the wer-animal may be the man himself metamorphosed, it may be his double whose activity leaves the real man to all appearance unchanged, it may be his soul, which goes forth seeking whom it may devour and leaving its body in a state of trance; or it may be no more than the messenger of the human being, a real animal or a familiar spirit, whose intimate connection with its owner is shown by the fact that any injury to it is believed, by a phenomenon known as repercussion, to cause a corresponding injury to the human being.
The phenomenon of repercussion, the power of animal metamorphosis, or of sending out a familiar, real or spiritual, as a messenger, and the supernormal powers conferred by association with such a familiar, are also attributed to the magician, male and female, all the world over; and witch superstitions are closely parallel to, if not identical with, lycanthropic beliefs, the occasional involuntary character of lycanthropy being almost the sole distinguishing feature. In another direction the phenomenon of repercussion is asserted to manifest itself in connection with the bush-soul of the West African and the nagual of Central America; but though there is no line of demarcation to be drawn on logical grounds, the assumed power of the magician and the intimate association of the bush-soul or the nagual with a human being are not termed lycanthropy. Nevertheless it will be well to touch on both these beliefs here.
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CuRsEdToDaRkNeSs High Sire (157) Posts: 1,286 Honor: 2,232 [ Give / Take ] |
I think that.... Lycantthropy is having characteristics there of.. and the actual changing into a wolf would be more or less canis lupis..... thats just me though.
I am not terrribly versed on this topic but I feel it is the taking on the attributes of the wolf.
Usually, a person is deemed to take the form of the most dangerous beast of prey of the region: the wolf or bear in Europe and northern Asia, the hyena or leopard in Africa, and the tiger in India, China, Japan, and elsewhere in Asia; but other animals are mentioned too. Both the superstition and the psychiatric disorder are linked to the belief in animal guardian spirits, vampires, totemism, witches, and werewolves. The folklore, fairy tales, and legends of many nations and peoples show evidence of lycanthropic belief.
I dont think its an actual physical change but more of a primal urge that we all have.
I don't know of any instances where someone actually turned into a wolf or other such creature. But I know some people who take on more primal characteristics in the full moon. Hightened senses, nervousness, quick tempered, cravings for barely cooked steak... That sort of thing.
Those characteristics are also ones that a person could be convincing themselves to have since they know it to be a full moon and desire to be associated with wolves. Mind over one's own mind as opposed to mind over matter.